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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 10:36 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:03 pm
Posts: 905
Location: Brampton, Ontario
5288 is from Canadian National

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 10:56 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8358
Location: Baltimore, MD
joe6167 wrote:
5288 is from Canadian National

But it's a 4-6-2 from Canada; therefore it's a Canadian Pacific.

Let's compromise and call it a Canadian National Canadian Pacific. >;-D


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 10:57 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:03 pm
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Location: Brampton, Ontario
yuk, yuk, yuk...

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 11:03 pm 

my mistake! And i'd imagine they'd persue K&T #10.


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 1:21 am 

Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2012 8:47 pm
Posts: 475
I'm not surprised Claytor asked for 1401 to use it in the steam program. By several accounts, he was the reason it was there in the first place.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:34 am 

Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2010 8:50 pm
Posts: 148
Location: MD
Classic Trains Vol. 10, Issue 4, Winter 2009 pages 37-39. Read it, know it. There will be a quiz.


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 6:32 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:34 am
Posts: 371
TVRM never had any plans to make the CNR 5288 into a Southern Ps-4. I get tired of hearing this internet rubbish.

I do believe the 1401 can be removed safely from the Smithsonian. I've studied it and with today's moving equipment that did not exist back when she was placed in the building, it could be done. Why? Well, that's for others to decide.

G. Mark
(the guy who got the 5288 to TVRM and a civil engineer with lots of heavy rigging experience)

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:39 am 
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Location: Pac NW, via North Florida
Anyone who knows the Smithsonian's policies on their artifacts would never bother asking the question on if 1401 would ever steam again...
gmray wrote:
TVRM never had any plans to make the CNR 5288 into a Southern Ps-4. I get tired of hearing this internet rubbish.
Thanks for clearing that up, I'd heard this rumor plenty of times in the past and didn't know it wasn't true.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:58 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 11:26 am
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Location: Maine
Mark, what are the plans for the noble CNR Pacific?

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:29 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 9:42 pm
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p51 wrote:
Anyone who knows the Smithsonian's policies on their artifacts would never bother asking the question on if 1401 would ever steam again...


While I would tend to agree, never say never. Do you recall when they steamed the John Bull? Not the PRR replica, but the original.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxcdY2Cj5nQ

I'm glad that 1401 is where she is, well preserved and cared for. I did prefer the original display thuogh, where you could get a nice view of the entire engine.

http://americanhistory.si.edu/onthemove ... _31_1.html

The current display has some other items that don't allow you to take in the whole locomotive. Yes, they have limited space, and yes, it gives folks a view into the cab, so there are positive aspects of the new one. Everything is a compromise, especially in situations like this one.

http://photos.greatrails.net/showpic/?p ... y=Southern


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:43 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:28 am
Posts: 2440
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
It is an interesting idea, though I doubt the John Bull could or would be steamed today. It was the exception to the rule.

As to Mr. Ray's comments. The more I think about it (though I am not a civil engineer), I am sure the 1401 could be rigged in such a way to lessen its load, or if you were going to restore her anyway, you could disassemble her into as light as components possible for transport. You wouldn't have to move the entire locomotive intact.

As to the 5288, I think the "Ps-4" idea was bandied about several times in the railfan press, with no offical word from TVRM. At best it was a "wouldn't it be nice" suggestion by people not associated with the decision-making process at TVRM.

Personally, I like what Strasburg has done with the 89, it is a "Strasburg Railroad" hearald done in the CN Maple Leaf style. I could see a "Tennessee Valley" done in a similar manner.

Bob, the best explaination, besids the lack of space issue, as to why 1401 is presented the way she is has a lot more to do with how museums interpret industrial and technological history. There is, at least in the academy, less and less of an emphasis on technological history, and more of an emphasis on "social history." As a result, artifacts take on a different role in how they are presented and interpreted. Before, when it was just "Railroad Hall" 1401 was the star. Now it plays a role in an ensamble cast amongst a greater "story." I'll leave it for another thread to debate the good and bad of this approach. Generally, I think the "America on the Move" exhibit was well done, although I do wish I could see more of 1401.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 2:55 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:03 pm
Posts: 905
Location: Brampton, Ontario
Re: Strasburg 89. I never noticed the Strasbug Decal! I saw the square and assumed it was CN! (aka nice work Strasburg! the deception is complete!)

I consider that to be a VERY tasteful way of lettering a locomotive. I believe a few other lines in the US running CNR engines have done the same thing.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:54 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 9:42 pm
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For those of you not familiar with the old display, that photo was taken inside the museum, and shows pretty much the view visitors had. I think there was stuff on the track at left (a covered wagon amongst other things?) but you still had a nice wide view of the engine so you could really get a feel for just how large they are.


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 5:20 pm 
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Location: Pac NW, via North Florida
Jeff Lisowski wrote:
...but it's hard to get good photos of this engine now.
Hard isn't the word I would use. Flipping impossible is more like it.
The interior of the building does have the window and it's very dark inside, so it's a backlit nightmare.
Unless you have a tripod (and can keep people from between you and the locomotive), you're not apt to get a good photo of the engine. This is the best I could get the last time I was in DC:
Image

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 5:29 pm 

Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 12:58 pm
Posts: 1195
Location: Chicago USA
If 1401 was going to be moved out, you'd get an experienced crew of heavy movers and take the thing intact. Dismantling it in situ would make things far more difficult. The equipment exists that can spread the weight as much as is needed. Not that this is ever going to happen.

John Bull was steamed because the Smithsonian's John White wanted to do it, not because some outside group wanted to borrow their prized artifact.

As long as we're talking about the "railroad hall," is the Zephyr 201A engine still displayed somewhere? I'm thinking not, since I didn't see it the last time I was there.

Steve


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