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 Post subject: Edgar Thompson Steel?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 3:28 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:16 pm
Posts: 209
Hey, that's a good question.

Wikipedia tells us about the works:

On January 1, 1873, ground work began on the Edgar Thomson Steel Works. It has been estimated that the plant was built for about $1.2 million. The mill was built by Alexander Lyman Holley, who found a manager to run the mill, Capt. William Jones, a Civil War veteran. On August 22, 1875, the Edgar Thomson Steel Works' hulking Bessemer converter produced its first heat of liquid steel, destined to become 2,000 steel rails for the Pennsylvania Railroad. Within one year of beginning production the mill was able to create 32,228 tons of steel rail.[4] The plant's first general superintendent, William R. Jones, described the steel mill writing, "This is the most powerful rail mill in the country; amongst its notable productions are a 62 lb. rail 120 feet long, rolled in five minutes from the time of drawing the bloom from the furnace and 600 rails 56 lb. per yard rolled in 11 1/2 hours."[5] With continual improvements in production the mill was capable of producing 225 tons of steel rails per day...

I think you're right!


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 Post subject: nightmare....
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 4:03 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:16 pm
Posts: 209
On the search for ETS identity I did come across this!!!


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 Post subject: Re: 100 year old rail
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 4:41 pm 

Joined: Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:56 pm
Posts: 185
Location: Norwalk, Ohio
I happened to have a slightly older pc. of Edgar Thomson Steel from Nov. 1881. It does not have E. T. S. like your 1884 pc. does.

Mine has the full "Edgar Thomson Steel 81 ///////////" with the 11 slash marks for the month of Nov. Attached is a photo of poor quality,you can see the Edgar Thomson Steel fairly well but the 81 is hard to see in the photo.

It was from about a 3 1/2 ft. pc. of rail i found laying in the river several years ago that i shortened to 2ft. for display purposes.

Maybe sometime between 1881 - 1884 E.T.S. abbreviated the lettering on the rails?


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E T S  Nov.  1881 rail.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: nightmare....
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 6:20 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 6400
Bad Order wrote:
On the search for ETS identity I did come across this!!!


My goodness, a "grand union", obviously made for a streetcar company. Which brings up the questions:

1. Does any museum have a "grand union" piece of trackwork, even if only for display?

2. Does any museum have plans to build one?


Les


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 Post subject: Re: 100 year old rail
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 6:58 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 10:58 am
Posts: 384
Location: Reston, VA
I do not know of any museum that has or plans to build a grand union, except possibly in O or HO gauge. Even my colleague Larry Lovejoy would consider that a real challenge, particularly where to find all of the pieces of prebent and precut rail.

If you want to see one in use, my recollection is that there are at least two in central Toronto.


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 Post subject: Grand Union
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 7:34 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:16 pm
Posts: 209
If that is for a streetcar.... can you imagine the tangled web of overhead wiring?


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 Post subject: Re: Grand Union
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 8:06 pm 

Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 6:45 pm
Posts: 258
Bad Order wrote:
If that is for a streetcar.... can you imagine the tangled web of overhead wiring?


I don't think many people want to imagine that wiring.

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 Post subject: Re: 100 year old rail
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:14 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 6400
I seem to recall seeing a photo of a Grand Union somewhere, perhaps right here on RyPN. Anyway, the overhead wiring didn't seem too bad to me, considering the nature of the junction. But maybe it would be a nightmare. Perhaps someone from one of the trolley museums might be able to answer that.

Les


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 Post subject: Re: 100 year old rail
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:48 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 3:01 pm
Posts: 1730
Location: SouthEast Pennsylvania
Indianapolis, Ind had worse. Mixed streetcar and trackless trolley, with 1 curve of the Grand Union missing, but not the same curve for each mode! Salt Lake City, Ut. had a streetcar Grand Union with trackless trolley straight through on on of the streets.


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 Post subject: "West Virginia"
PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:58 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:16 pm
Posts: 209
Stumbled onto this rail today... a guy had 4 four foot pieces welded onto his logsplitter using them as a table for the split wood to fall on.

I was shocked when I saw it, the owner wasn't there to ask questions as to where he came up with it... out here in Kansas. There were coal, plus lead and zinc mines in our part of the state. Maybe this was mine rail. The owner worked in the Katys' shops, and it had a little narrow gauge set of tracks in the floor that they rolled little carts carrying heavy parts from place to place... may be some part of that?

It had no date rolled into it...but the name is crisp and legible. Took the pic with my cell phone.


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File comment: 12 pound rail marked "West Virginia 12Lb"
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 Post subject: Re: 100 year old rail
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 6:42 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:52 pm
Posts: 559
Location: Apple Valley, Minnesota
Great photo of the trolley grand union. This photo could have been taken at the manufacturer of the grand union or in the "back lot" of a streetcar company. It looks like the former to my eyes. Wharton was a big manufacturer of track components and switches for railroads and what is commonly called "special work" for streetcar companies. But there were several others.

Typically, the manufacturer (either a company or the streetcar system) would fabricate the various & numerous components based on blueprints from the streetcar company. The streetcar company would then pre-assemble the special work on a specially prepared flat site in their central track materials depot/yard to make sure everything fit properly. Then the whole thing was disassembled and at the proper time transported by flat cars to the intersection to be put in place. After the track was set up, the overhead gang would come in to hang the "celestial knitting."

I know of no museum who would even want a grand union. A couple of Museums do have a single or double slip switch in the track, e.g., at Seashore Trolley Museum (see photo). The only current North American streetcar system that has one to my knowledge is Toronto at Queen Street West & Bathhurst Street (I think). I suspect there are several in Europe and other parts of the world.

Thanks!


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838 at Arundel.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: 100 year old rail
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 6:52 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 3911
Location: Inwood, W.Va.
Don't know how accurate this Wikipedia item is, but it includes a list of grand unions and variations, such as three-quarter unions. Surprising how many are still around; Toronto supposedly has three of them, and a bunch of other variations, too!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_union


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 10:28 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 1:16 pm
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 Post subject: Re: 100 year old rail
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 5:46 pm 

Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 10:54 am
Posts: 1184
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Back when I was at TVRM, the seasonal Downtown Arrow still ran on the NS East Chattanooga Belt Line from East Chattanooga to Terminal Station. Back then, NS still had multiple double slip switches in service at Main Street interlocking. Later on, most of the double slip switches were removed during improvements and the connection with the Belt Line at Main Street was removed. The puzzle switches were something of an annoyance due to the fact that they were often out of adjustment during summer months and would not properly lock-mostly due to the level of maintenance (or lack thereof).

I never got to line one of them manually, but almost got the chance. I was conductor on one of the interline trains and we were heading to Terminal Station after a heavy thunderstorm had passed through the area. When we contacted the Operator for permission to occupy the Belt Line, we were informed that the power to the interlocking was out. Just before we got to Main Street, the operator informed us that power to the interlocking was restored.

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 Post subject: Re: 100 year old rail
PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 5:36 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 3:01 pm
Posts: 1730
Location: SouthEast Pennsylvania
At the moment, this is 124 year old rail:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mtlwestrailfan/10236166724/in/set-72157636482784943/


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