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 Post subject: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 11:47 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2007 5:40 pm
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Location: Hamilton, Illinois
A viewer of my web site sent me photos of two 45-ton switchers his company owns. He is looking for a manual so he can find replacement parts. He describes the engines as "B/B 100/100-733 loco," and says they came from a plant in Pennsylvania that closed. The builder's plate is missing. I am not a diesel expert but I assume these are GE locomotives. Can anyone identify the loco and explain how my respondent can get a printed manual for them? Thanks for your help.


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 12:12 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 3:07 pm
Posts: 643
Tell your friend to contact Western Star Rail Services at 740-344-3336. The owner has a lot of GE manuals and can provide copies. That said, understand that this loco is an oddball. However even the oddest GEs still used a lot of the same components, such as the 733 traction motor. Chances are the only really odd parts are the frame and related mechanical portions. Good luck.


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 12:20 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2011 5:07 am
Posts: 70
Imho it looks more like a Whitcomb 45 or 50.
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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 12:47 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 3:07 pm
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Definitely not a Whitcomb. There are too many details that scream "GE" loud and clear. Whitcomb did build a lot of locos in this configuration, but this isn't one of them.. The logo on the hoods, I believe, stands for Johnstown American Corp., a freight car builder at Johnstown, PA that has since moved elsewhere. It is very likely that these locos originated with Bethlehem Steel in Johnstown and MAY have been 36" gauge as built.


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2016 8:09 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 4:29 pm
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Location: Youngstown, OH
GE manuals for the most part were collections of various instruction sheets for individual parts. About the only thing that was specific to the locomotive was the wiring diagrams and even in those there are similarities. So even if the actual manual isn't found, if you know what components are used you can get instruction sheets to get you close.

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 8:48 am 

Joined: Tue Sep 22, 2015 12:36 pm
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Interesting that it has the low cab options but yet they mounted air cleaners on top of the cab. Wonder what the reason for the side skirts was as well. Does it have standard 45 ton GE trucks underneath or is that just a single truck 2 axle loco?

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 9:22 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
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Location: southeastern USA
That's not side skirts, that's the frame.......

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 9:32 am 

Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2010 11:43 am
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Location: Floyd, AR
The variety of these GE 'ton' size switch engines amazes me. It's almost like they never built any two alike.

The air cleaners were almost certainly a later add-on. Many of these had their engines swapped out, often with at least a slightly different engine, sometimes the new engine had a slightly different intake or took up space where the original air cleaner was mounted. That and getting rid of what was probably an oil bath air cleaner caused many of them to get retrofitted with a new air cleaner some time in their life.

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 9:35 am 

Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:40 pm
Posts: 33
While it has some distinctive ge features...

http://www.railpictures.net/photo/347680/

The engine behind the 1 is a GE 45-tonner. This thing looks like a over-ballasted 25 tonner (with two engines). To me the engine compartments look too small for the "normal" 45 powerplant. It would appear to be balancing on a single truck; no side-rods.

Probably weird export/mine (narrow gauge sounds good) version. Ill bet the exhaust was changed... just originally had flappers. Maybe the weird shrouding around the truck was to protect it in certain environments.

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 3:11 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2010 11:43 am
Posts: 465
Location: Floyd, AR
The 'skirts' are part of the trucks basically, they support and guide the suspension. Just like a 25 ton. It certainly looks GE or GE inspired. I would bet it has 2 traction motors and basically duplicate/redundant systems on each end, so no side rods or chain drive. Probably the control panel would tell the story if it's GE.

I agree the hoods look tight for a HBI-600 Cummins with gens. When you see that one parked behind it, it suddenly makes the larger engine look like a monster and this one looks more in scale.....

Any chance on getting more pics, engines, inside, etc?

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 4:30 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 9:18 am
Posts: 476
Location: Wall, NJ
The louvers/radiator shells look remarkably like those found on an early 1940s GE 23/25 tonner. These smaller GEs usually had the smaller Cummins 150 or 160 diesels in them.

Neat locomotive though. A powerful beast no doubt.


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 5:07 pm 

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2016 7:05 pm
Posts: 77
#1 definitely looks like a GE to me - late production (60's) due to the wrap-over style hood and cab tops (vs. the earlier rounded/welded corners), door latches, railing mounts, hood vents, etc. Probably in the 23-25 ton range, but the heavy deck plate and very heavy end plates might make it a 28 or 30 tonner. Definitely an interesting variety, particularly with those angled end steps.

The red engine in Dave's linked photo would be the B/B 100/100-733. That info would come from the builder's plate/markings and would not be for #1. It is the standard GE designation for - B/B indicates two 'B' or four wheel trucks, 100/100 IIRC means total weight/weight on drivers (in 1000s of pounds, so a 50 tonner), and 733 is the type of traction motors.

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 5:30 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:40 pm
Posts: 33
I think the 1 is older than the 60s as it has poling pockets which is fascinating considering the step arrangement.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/rgvrrm/33 ... 850997352/

Both GE 45 tonners - Yellow one is built 1950, Green was built 1941; notice the overhang on the roof sheet. The 1950 has the nicer "beveled" roof/body; where as the earlier built has the simpler overhang, and pockets. Maybe GE reversed that trend (overhang early 40's, bevel 50's and overhang 60's)?

Should be a number stamped some place on the frame, assuming its builders plates are gone; usually in the neighborhood of where the plate would have been iirc.

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 6:47 pm 

Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2016 7:05 pm
Posts: 77
Dave - I think the dating depends on the hood type - I also have a '42 built 45 tonner with the wrapped roof but rounded hood. Maybe a war-time simplification? Seen plenty of late 40s-50s builds with both rounded - haven't looked at too many prewar examples lately. Seems like the wrapped hood was a later cost-saving measure that just happened to go along with the earlier wrapped roof style, so the style came back near the end of production. Also those radiator grills...

Pole pockets were standard equipment for years after poles disappeared, so I'm not surprised by them - another archaic feature that remained on the books far past usual practice.

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 Post subject: Re: Looking for 45-Ton Manual
PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2016 9:55 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:14 am
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Look carefully at the original picture. It looks like the hoods extend a couple feet into the cab. This would probably alow the Cummins H engine to fit. Our organization had a 50ton, 2 axle GE (before I was part of it). I will see if anybody has any pictures of it. I was told that it would porpoise horribly if you were at speeds above 8mph. It would be interesting to know if the angled steps were added. I have seen a few of the GE critters have these frame extensions welded on with angled steps.

After looking up some pictures of 50 ton GEs, I found a few of these units. It looks like, on the unit in question, they moved the engine/generator and hood assembly inward towards the cab. Then they carved the angled steps into the frame ends. It also appears that most of what is seen on the sides is in fact added skirts and toolboxes. Interesting.


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