You know, that's something else worth noting.

By and large, museums seem to keep bankers hours. Which I'm sure is fine for school trips and volunteers, sucks for people who want to visit them.

For example, business travelers who might be tempted to check something out after a day of meetings are left with only the pool and hotel bar because the interesting stuff closes at 4.

Likewise, locals who have 9-5 jobs and busy weekends.

If you have an attraction that's good for an hour or two, you might do well to be open late once or twice a week.

folks,
i have been working in the archives of the western Railway Museum for over 20 years. I believe they are successful because:
They have been around since the early 1960s. A good long time!

They own 22 miles of the historic Sacramento Northern Railway and have restored 10 miles of it. They have placed it on the National Register of Historic Places. One of only to traction museums to do so.

They have restored and operate a number of SN Interurbans on the line. More restorations to follow.

The most recent large car barn has fire suppression and insulation. 100% of their historic collection is under cover. Another Car Barn upgrade is being planned.

The F. M. Smith Library and Harry Atkin Archives preserves books, magazines, paper and photos from the Western United States.
The Bay Area Railroad Association (the actual 501(C) non profit has a substantial endowment.

it is a fun place to work and most of the time people are good to work with. Sorry I can't add phicture, but the web site at wrm.org has lots of them!

ted66

I will never forget my wife and I standing outside the fence of a certain railroad museum on a Sunday afternoon in the summer. At that time there were two or three other families with kids who also stopped to look through the fence. And there may have been more people before and after we left and probably on other Sundays as well. In a way we were all practically begging to spend our tourist dollars there. That seems like a real missed opportunity to me.

When I communicated with the museum to share my experience they just seemed to ignore what I was saying and invited me to visit another time. Since they're about 800 miles away that's unlikely to happen any time soon. Paraphrasing, none are so deaf as those who won't listen.

-Mark

The above is in contrast to the Connecticut Antique Machinery Museum and the adjacent Eric Sloane Museum, which I blundered upon with no warning or planning while headed home from another outing further north--and ten minutes before closing at 4 PM.

I went to the Sloane Museum first and persuaded the lone staffer to stay a few minutes late so one rabid Sloane fan and his wife could pay respects and see original art for another $16 in revenue--plus a potential signed print order to come.
Then we hopped "next door" to the Machinery Museum, where two volunteers enjoyed the shade in what passed as a "guard booth," asked if they were still open, and they said "If someone's here, we're open!" They offered me the run of the grounds, but I confined myself to the rail exhibits. We shot the breeze for about a half-hour after I grabbed the shots.

And, yes, we'll take extra effort to return again, unlike the places that flip the sign to "CLOSED" ten minutes before the scheduled closing time after I got stuck in a traffic jam.

"provide one example of what a successful railway museum"

The PRIMARY mission of any museum, from Merriam-Webster:

"Full Definition of museum : an institution devoted to the procurement, care, study, and display of objects of lasting interest or value; also : a place where objects are exhibited"

So, in this case, the objects are railway related. Notice that it doesn't say how many visitors, nor volunteers, nor cash assets. Therefore, almost all open railway museums that preserve, present and display railway artifacts are successful. NOTE that train rides are NOT required. Also, photos collections or small artifacts could also make up all of the museum.

I would add one other qualification - education - if your public leaves your museum with new knowledge and appreciation of railways and how they shaped and are still shaping your history - you are successful.

Jim, I think you've made an excellent point that train rides are not required. While they could enhance or be a significant part of the experience, they are not a requirement for success. They just might be part of a museum's chosen path to reaching success.

However, I believe that the number of visitors, volunteers, and cash assets are directly related to the success of a museum. How long can preservation continue without funds to support long term conservation. How long will a museum carry out the day to day tasks of its operation without volunteers (or employees) and how will we insure the preservation of artifacts in the next generation without visitors who learn to value and understand what we are working to preserve.

If preserving, presenting, and displaying artifacts is a measure of success, part of that success must also be continuing that work after our own demise, since the artifacts are, as the definition mentions of 'lasting value'. One way to accomplish that is through outreach, programs, and exhibitions. These require visitors, volunteers, and cash assets.

Case in point: How can we consider a museum that was able to preserve their artifacts initially a success if after the first generation there is no one interested in continuing the work, they are out of money, and no one is interested in their artifacts?

On another note, this discussion is really moving in the direction of the other thread 'Are Railway Museums Successful?' which I've linked below:http://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=39488&start=15

This thread is for answers to the question 'What does a successful railway museum look like?' I was hoping for specific examples and evidence to provide the basis for some research I am doing.

Thank you,
Stephen

"Now here is an UNsuccessful encyclopaedia salesman:"

https://www.estatesales.net/OH/Toledo/43607/1223298



</Man's Crisis of Identity in the Latter Half of the 20th Century>

I don't have photographs to share yet, but any successful museum is neat, clean, and attractive.

It's simple things. Keep the grass mowed. Pick up trash. Have clean bathrooms. Put a fresh coat of paint on once in a while. Have picnic tables. Be bright, be inviting. Just like any other attraction you may visit, your museum is a business, and business is based on first impressions.

=otto=

Stephen:

"However, I believe that the number of visitors, volunteers, and cash assets are directly related to the success of a museum."

I disagree. These are related to the size of the museum and the location of the museum. A small museum in a small town with a nice building presenting railway history with very low costs could be very successful at what it does. As an example - the Tehachapi Depot. Small town. Limited budget. Limited visitors. Still doing a fine job of presenting local railroad history.

Bigger is not always better.

At MANY railway museums - they have bitten off to much to chew - and by being bigger they are not necessarily doing a better job.

Hi Jim,

I definitely agree with you- bigger is not always better! However I do think sustainability is the key here. Whatever a museum needs to do to ensure its long-term survival is important to their role as a museum.

Steve

As a "furriner", I haven't visited any American museums, but I have been to York and visited many Australian museums.
Places like York and several well-funded Aussie museums suffer from being too sterile IMHO. When all you can do is stand outside and look in, the experience isn't that good.
Without trying to sound like I'm blowing my own trumpet, I find visitors who come to Canberra Railway Museum and get to look at my pet project, Pullman sleeper AL1040, really enjoy being able to look through an under-restoration carriage. I can explain what's been done, what's being done and tell some interesting little tales of discovery during the restoration.
This involves them and most leave feeling they've leared something interesting.
Of course, you get visitors with varying levels of interest. One doesn't spend heaps of time with young couples with small kids who have short attention spans. You pick your target, which to me, tends to be older people who remember the days of old-style rail travel.
If I find visitors who leave me with gratitude, I think I've done my job.

For a railroad museum to be successful, or even the best, don't even think of looking at the so-called "National Railroad Museum", here in Green Bay, because over the past 35 years, they have scrapped and destroyed engines in 1984, like the 1934 Plymouth Center-cab nick-named the "Mighty Mite" from the Cassville and Exeter Ry., family owned shortline in Missouri, that donated it in 1961, where it was used for only 2 years before it broke down, then sat for nearly 20 years until 1984 when the Museum was being run by outsiders who are definitely NOT railfans, nor even professional, nor retired RR people. Instead, this outside group decided to scrap it because it didn't run, and there was a group of local railfans who eagerly volunteered to restore it, but these outsiders immediately rejected the railfans, and even went so far as to evict them from ever returning under threat of arrest for trespassing. These outsiders also had destroyed two(2) freight cars, (and even more now), that included the 4-(four) barrel pickle car that had been used in local agriculture and canning. Also scrapped was the Santa Fe Boxcar #9714, with five(5) marks of historical value, like: (1): It was home-shop built by ATSF in Topeka, KA. (2): It was an early 50' foot car that indicated that the railroads were about to change from the older 40' foot cars to the newer larger size. (3): It had double-doors along each side for loading extra-size loads. (4): It had a set of other doors at the "B" tail-end because it was an early Automobile loader. (5): It should have been coupled behind the steam locomotive ATSF #5017 2-10-4 TEXAS-type as a matched set and example of engine and freight car combined from one railroad. (All that was left was to get a cupola caboose to round it out). But this never happened, so we are all the worse off. Even worse, this holocaust of destruction has continued as recently as 7 years ago when a different outside manager was hired, and he and the Board decided to get rid of 7, YES, SEVEN, DIESELS! There was the matched set of EMD F7A A-B-A owned by a late, well known, Midwestern railfan who ran them on a well known shortline and excursion in the Southern part of Wisconsin, but now they are in Upper Michigan on another popular regional RR, so you can see them on the internet, but will they run, or rust? Only a few other museum have matched sets, and this made the museum in Green Bay with the largest assortment of 1950s' EMD Diesels. But then, we also lost the TWO(2) BL-2 engines to the excursion in New York state, where one was made to run and also repainted in similar colors to the D&H RR, with the 2nd BL-2 supplying parts until other parts can be acquired to also make it runnable and have a perfect matched set running back to back, whereas here, our plan was to get one running and repaint it as the ROCK ISLAND, (either red or silver), then use the 1956 AEROTRAIN coaches to simulate a RI Red Rocket Commuter train to Aurora, even though our train would just go in a small circle. But this museum has fallen so far behind, there a little chance of improvement, unless there is a dramatic change in management, and responsible and knowledgeble railfans are once more in control. Because 2016 is supposed to be this museums 60th anniversary of its foundation in 1956, and its very first steamer was Milwaukee Road #261, (as well as Soo Line #2718 4-6-2 Pacific). But here it sat for nearly 35 years, being vandalised and weather-beaten, until in 1992 when it was chosen by Northstar Rail, a brand new company from Minnesota, to be rebuilt for excursion trains. Whereas it just sat here for those 35 years as just a rusty old engine, after they spent nearly 18 months, and millions of dollars, it was beautifully transformed back into the sleek black thourough-bred Iron-Horse like ALCO, and The Milwaukee Road, originally intended for its 10 War-babies of 1943. Plus the recent 1472 day rebuild included the installation of many modern features that were not even thought of in 1943, making 261 an even better engine. Wouldn't it be cool if we could run it again at over 100 MPH, just like when it pulled the Hiawatha, and the Olympian. With Amtrak, and some railroads rebuilding track sections both East and West of Chicago for high speeds of 110 MPH, this is the perfect place to test 261 again. But it was a long held dream of the Original Founders of this museum to have a steam locomotive running, sometimes in the future of the 1950s', maybe the 1980s', or 1990s', so that the children of that future, which is our now, would get to see the steam locomotives that their grandparents remembered, who are now US, when WE were just as small, and share our love of trains, and they can know why America has grown into the Land of The Free. But, how can we celebrate, when we don't have our original locomotive! We can't even run excursions with diesels because the local lines won't allow it. Also, many of the most popular, and specially requested routes, have been torn out and made into hiking trails, so that where the C&NW 400 used to run at 117 MPH in the late 1940s', now only bicycles and joggers slowly wander along the former right-of-way. So much was lost over the past 35 years, and what makes it worse, is that the very place that was supposed to care for these artifacts, instead decided to sell, as well as scrap and destroy 37 engines and cars, as well as buildings, and really upsetting, was the Turn-Table from the C&NW RR in Antigo, WI., that was planned to be installed and used, but instead, scrapped and destroyed by 1999. Meanwhile, at so many other Railroad Museums, there are often bidding wars as to who will get the next available Turntable, if by chance one might be up for sale. So congratulations to the lucky winner, just please remember to share with the others when they need help, because here, those chances were BLOWN BIG TIME!!!!! As an employee there from 1984 to 1989, I can definitely speak from first hand experiences, (Plural), and tell you about the examples of who all you other Museums have far out-shined this place from "green bay". During the 1960s', during the greatest growth periods, GB was known for Football and trains. But after 1980, the trains fell away, so far back that all you others have far exceeded the goals of the Founders. Can "green Bay" ever recover? Will you help? Please?

Judge Not, Lest Ye Be Judged.

Someone can most easily spout off a list of similar grievances about just about any and every rail museum out there, from the humblest depot museum to every national-scale museum out there (CSRM, NRM York, Steamtown, B&O Museum, Seashore Trolley Museum, IRM, you name it).

The relevant question is, has [Fill-In-The-Blank] done anything RIGHT or SUCCESSFUL in the same time frame? Being successful at raising money, raising interest, and management of resources is FAR more important than whether the directorship are "railfans" or not; get back to me when said directors can't tell a steamer from a diesel, or the Milwaukee Road from the Missabe Road.

Your grievances and complaints may be perfectly valid (if one-sided), but the tone of your post smacks far too much of a disgruntled ex-employee with an axe to grind rather than someone offering objective and constructive criticism.

This thread may have been thinking of volunteer staffed museums; but others sure come to mind like the California State Railroad Museum in Sacramento.

They opened in 1981, they have a wonderful collection of static displays. They have held several Rail Fairs where about 250,000 people come to see live steam locomotives from 0-4-0s to the UP 2985.

They operate the Sacramento Southern steam powered excursion trains along the river with volunteers.

They are planning a major expansion: The Museum of Railroad Technology; I have been in the buildings and they are immense!

Ted66

I would like to see this, but are you sure it will happen? They've been talking about it for decades. Nothing seems to actually happen.