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 Post subject: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 1:17 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:17 am
Posts: 155
Location: New York
Does anyone know where I could find color codes for a Fruit Growers Express wood reefer? I'd like to replicate the simplified, and slightly darker shade used after the 1940s. I found this example at the Southeastern Railway Museum, they recently repainted their FGE car.

Attachment:
File comment: FGEX 55558 at Southeastern Railway Museum, Duluth, Ga.
FGEX 55558.jpg
FGEX 55558.jpg [ 116.73 KiB | Viewed 2315 times ]


Last year, a gang of volunteers applied primer and yellow paint to the east side of our FGEX 50220. The color is a little too bright ("English Daisy") and since we're getting ready to do some work to the other side of the car, I figured lets get the color closer.

Attachment:
File comment: FGEX 50220 at R&GVRRM
FGEX 50220_RGVRRM.jpg
FGEX 50220_RGVRRM.jpg [ 78.68 KiB | Viewed 2315 times ]


Does anyone have information on FGE red and yellow colors?

-otto-
RGVRRM

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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 6:29 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 4996
Otto -

Thanks for posting the photo of SERM's reefer #55558 and also your soon-to-be-done sister car, FGEX #50220. This brings up an interesting question. "To paint or not to paint"...the door hinges that is (and other door hardware) with black paint? I have seen photos of cars both ways and I'm not sure how these private car owners did it "back in the day". I had a friend who long ago told me that he spent a summer painting these hinges black, while working for one the owners (possibly PGE) of these refers! The cars on his HO railroad all had black hinges. With him there was no question. Whether Marlo was right or not, and whether this policy was only at the repair shop he worked for and not a company policy, I don't know. But I just wondered what is the right way to do it. Did different private owners of these cars have different policies? Any info is welcome! We'd like to get it right!

Les


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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 7:20 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 9:42 pm
Posts: 2431
I've typically seen them with both the hinges and the grabirons painted black. I am of the impression that it was to make them more visible. Maybe that was helpful when spotting the cars? Or simply made it easier for workers?


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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Thu May 12, 2016 8:25 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:17 am
Posts: 155
Location: New York
Thanks for the responses.

Based on what I've seen, the more detailed paint job with black hardware dates from the pre-war era. This FGE car at the California State Railroad Museum reflects the earlier paint job:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/ottomatic77/5936057550/

From what I understand, after the war, FGE went to simplified paint job and lettering without black accents. While the black hinges and grabs "look cool," I think we want to represent a later era with our car.

See also:

http://pennsyrr.com/index.php/data/92-o ... rs-express

And also:

Quote:
Shamelessly plagiarized from the instructions for Martin Loftin's beautiful and accurate FGEX 40' reefer (Sunshine Models, Box 4997, Springfield, MO 65808-4997):

Paint schemes applied to FGEX cars in the late steam era had yellow sides; red ends, kick board and roof; and black underframe, side sill, trucks, hinges, ladders and grabs. In the late forties or early fifties, grabs, ladders and latches became the color of the underlying carbody--yellow on the sides and red on the ends. The sidesills were briefly red. I believe the cars eventually became yelow on the sidesills, ends and end details also. The yellow was a reefer yellow when new, but in the late steam era, this didn't last long. Sunshine recommends a Santa Fe Warbonnet Yellow or a mixture of 10 parts yellow, one part orange and a "touch" of brown. If you model ten cars and they are ten different yellows, that would not be unprototypical!


-otto-

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Rochester & Genesee Valley Railroad Museum, Rochester, N.Y.


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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2016 12:20 am 

Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2004 2:50 pm
Posts: 2091
Location: Northern Illinois
Bobharbison wrote:
I've typically seen them with both the hinges and the grabirons painted black. I am of the impression that it was to make them more visible. Maybe that was helpful when spotting the cars? Or simply made it easier for workers?


I'm of the opinion that it dates back to the days when paints, made from natural pigments and oils, were often chosen for their functionality rather than their color. Lampblack in oil with Japan drier, so called "black Japan finish" was considerably tougher and more scuff resistant than most other paints, and was often specified for architectural ironwork as well.

Of course with the advent of alkyd enamels, all colors became more or less equal, but traditions die hard.

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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Sat May 14, 2016 8:57 am 

Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:24 am
Posts: 43
Location: Cleveland, OH
We have FGE car number 559-- at Midwest Railway Preservation Society in Cleveland. One side of the car has been repainted and we are in the process of doing the other side right now. One thing that may help you out in your restoration is that we replaced all of the stenciled information that was on the car including the built date, light weight, loaded weight, cubic foot capacity and much more. i will try to post some photos when i get a chance. Our car is the darker yellow color similar to Southeastern Railway's car. Here is a link to our Facebook page which shows the car during our night photo shoot from last year. https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/ ... e=57E3E23A


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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:34 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:17 am
Posts: 155
Location: New York
trainsfireengine wrote:
We have FGE car number 559-- at Midwest Railway Preservation Society in Cleveland. One side of the car has been repainted and we are in the process of doing the other side right now. One thing that may help you out in your restoration is that we replaced all of the stenciled information that was on the car including the built date, light weight, loaded weight, cubic foot capacity and much more. i will try to post some photos when i get a chance. Our car is the darker yellow color similar to Southeastern Railway's car.


I would love any information you could share.

I haven't found color codes, so I might just go with a School Bus Yellow and a Barn Red and call it a day...

-otto-

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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:21 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:56 am
Posts: 341
Location: Northern California
The yellow used by Union Pacific is Armor yellow, DuPont color code 9356. A lighter yellow, maybe more like FGE used is 6808. In the DuPont number system ther would be a prefix number indicating the paint system. Another yellow similar to the Armor yellow would be 421.


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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 4:59 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:24 am
Posts: 43
Location: Cleveland, OH
These are some pictures of the FGE car at Midwest Railway Preservation Society in Cleveland, Ohio. We hope this aides other people in restoring similar cars.


Attachments:
R3.jpg
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R2.jpg
R2.jpg [ 193.91 KiB | Viewed 1557 times ]
File comment: Left Side
R1.jpg
R1.jpg [ 237.96 KiB | Viewed 1557 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:00 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:24 am
Posts: 43
Location: Cleveland, OH
Pictures 4-6


Attachments:
R6.jpg
R6.jpg [ 182.77 KiB | Viewed 1557 times ]
R5.jpg
R5.jpg [ 224.74 KiB | Viewed 1557 times ]
R4.jpg
R4.jpg [ 237.89 KiB | Viewed 1557 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:01 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:24 am
Posts: 43
Location: Cleveland, OH
Pictures 7-9


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File comment: Right side
R9.jpg
R9.jpg [ 216.1 KiB | Viewed 1556 times ]
R8.jpg
R8.jpg [ 214.5 KiB | Viewed 1556 times ]
R7.jpg
R7.jpg [ 228.14 KiB | Viewed 1556 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 10:12 pm 

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 pm
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
This is original paint? and it has been outside for sixty years?

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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:58 am 

Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 8:24 am
Posts: 43
Location: Cleveland, OH
This is not original paint, it was repainted some time recently. We did make an effort to duplicate the lettering on it and I am posting the photos of that so the other groups that have cars can do that also if they want to. This lettering was done by a sign painter who used a small brush along with a stencil pattern. The tongue and groove wood siding makes it impossible to just use a stencil and spray can because each groove will have paint running down into it.

In photo number 7 I am not sure what the difference is between EX W 10-1 and EW 9-11 and also H 11-1 and H 211. I think that H 211 may be a mistake and it might be H 12-1.Where EX W 10-1 would be external width 10 feet 1 inch, what is EW 9-11? And why the two H numbers? The other length, height and width numbers are easily understood.


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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 1:34 pm 

Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2004 2:50 pm
Posts: 2091
Location: Northern Illinois
trainsfireengine wrote:
In photo number 7 I am not sure what the difference is between EX W 10-1 and EW 9-11 and also H 11-1 and H 211. I think that H 211 may be a mistake and it might be H 12-1.Where EX W 10-1 would be external width 10 feet 1 inch, what is EW 9-11? And why the two H numbers? The other length, height and width numbers are easily understood.


I thought I just answered this a couple months ago in a different discussion, but here it is again. EXW is the EXTREME WIDTH, and the H on the same line is the HEIGHT above the rail to where the extreme width is located; in this case it appears to be at the top of the door, likely the top door locking bracket. EW is the EXTERIOR WIDTH, measured at the eaves, and the H on that like is the HEIGHT to the eaves... the stenciling is missing a 1, it should be 12-11. The three lower lines are the interior dimensions; the IL is so short because it is between the ice bunkers.

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 Post subject: Re: Color codes for FGE wood reefer
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 1:12 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:17 am
Posts: 155
Location: New York
Thanks very much for posting the photos of the lettering!

-otto-

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Rochester & Genesee Valley Railroad Museum, Rochester, N.Y.


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