A respondent from Germany is looking for the source of a diagram he found on a Wikipedia page, without attribution. It shows a 4-6-4 with a large trailing truck, labeled "Unitary Machinery Support as Applied to a 4-6-4 Type Locomotive." It is obviously not a NYC Hudson (note, e.g., the crosshead, not of the "alligator" type) and the longer trailing truck does not fit other 4-6-4s I could locate. The respondent is of the opinion that this is a proposal, perhaps early in the "super-power" era, not a locomotive that was actually built. Can anyone enlighten him as to the source of the diagram?

The trailing truck looks like the frame-extension type such as were under the Erie 2-8-4's versus the conventional type under the 4-6-4's that were actually built. Is that a booster on the rear axle? Really big boiler, too. Drivers look low for a 4-6-4.

Are there any dimensions?

Phil Mulligan

As far as I know, no other information. At least my German respondent hasn't provided any.

Hi All
Looking at the diagram of the posted diagram, it was suggested by the other two posts, that the locomotive has low drivers. Well, I am more than likely wrong on this.
The Locomotive looks like a Boston & Albany J2c they were Lima built, I know the crosshead is wrong, in the attached photo. But that is my guest.

Could it be the Lima proposal for the B&A J-2 with the articulated frame trailing truck as used in the Lima B&A A-1 2-8-4's?

Phil Mulligan

That's 96% a Lima articulated trailing truck. The NYC Hudsons all had the more usual GSC cast-frame swiveling trailer.

I'm thinking this may have some relation to the ICRR rebuild of an early-style Lima 2-8-4 (which had those articulated trailers) into a "freight Hudson". One was rebuilt, but apparently, it was proposed to rebuild 50 2-8-4s to Hudsons. The one that was converted had a conventional GSC swiveling trailing truck. Perhaps this diagram showed the planned rebuilds, re-using the Lima truck?

Howard P.

The "front view" cut-away make me think "Narrow Gauge" if that's any clue. The driver spacing looks to be narrow, but that's only "Looks."
But it might be a clue.

I’m betting on artistic license of no particular locomotive. Big barrel, small drivers, narrow gauge and what looks like a simplified guess at a trailing truck booster. But as stated many times previously, I’m a diesel guy, what do I know....

I wonder if we aren't looking at either this....Frisco 4-6-4 1066...
https://donsdepot.donrossgroup.net/dr0605/fr1066.jpg

or an early version of this...B&O No. 2 Lord Baltimore...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/124446949@N06/36797014375

Both of those have Walschaerts valve hear. The drawing shows short frame Baker.

Not Frisco. I wonder if it isn't a proposed engine that was never built.

There's an earlier thread on this. Supposedly it's a W. E. Woodward (Lima) proposal for a branch line 4-6-4. Possibly 1928.

See:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35261&p=198741

Phil Mulligan

I found it!

It's in the May, 1928 issue of Railway and Locomotive Engineering pp 142-145. Article is "Locomotive Design to Reduce Maintenance" by W. E. Woodard, VP of Lima Locomotive Works. The engine drawings are the 4-6-4 and a 2-12-6 (!) which must be seen to be believed. Both seem to have articulated trailing trucks. The drawings are not detailed and do not have dimensions.

If a 2-12-6 is hard to believe, remember in that period Alco built 88 4-12-2's for UP and Baldwin built a watertube-firebox compound 4-10-2 with 350 psi BP.

Here's a link:

https://archive.org/stream/railwaylocom ... 2/mode/1up

BTW the next article describes Baldwin's move to Eddystone.

Phil Mulligan

Great work, Phil! I will copy your info in both posts to the man in Germany.

This locomotive looks quite similar, (to me at least) to the Illinois Central experimental freight 4-6-4 they rebuilt in the late 30’s from an older Berkshire. Not exactly of course but it fits the mold with the smaller drivers.