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 Post subject: Re: Rare bird? An outside braced CONVERTED boxcar preserved
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:05 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 3:57 pm
Posts: 171
Location: Eastampton, NJ
Les,

If I've found the right place in Google Street View, the car on the NWP is no longer there.

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.2469343,-122.4393759,3a,75y,41.75h,87.18t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDqETp-UnGFaItu-Dw-avaQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

In the picture it looks like there's a cantilever crossing warning. I found three of them in Schellville, and the south side of the Eighth St crossing looks like a good match.

-Mark


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 Post subject: Re: Rare bird? An outside braced CONVERTED boxcar preserved
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:57 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 5320
Mark Trebing wrote:
Les,

If I've found the right place in Google Street View, the car on the NWP is no longer there.

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.2469343,-122.4393759,3a,75y,41.75h,87.18t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDqETp-UnGFaItu-Dw-avaQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

In the picture it looks like there's a cantilever crossing warning. I found three of them in Schellville, and the south side of the Eighth St crossing looks like a good match.

-Mark


Mark -

Thanks for coming up with this. I agree that the spot where SP MW2417 and the other box car (SP 101157) were photographed, is no longer occupied. BUT, here's something interesting. I followed the road (perhaps 8th St E) out of town and found some equipment parked alongside the road. Looks like diesels and other stuff (although the trees hide a really good visual check in most spots), but at the far end appears to be the OTHER box car! Because IT exists and was moved, perhaps the MW2417 might have also been moved. It certainly does not look to be in the fenced in area in Schellville itself. There are some other tracks leaving Schellville both ways besides the line paralleling 8th St E. Might the car have been moved elsewhere? Probably not, but....!

Thanks again. This was really a great bit of detective work on your part.

BTW, I found this photo on the internet:

http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/photos/ ... aldson.jpg

I don't know if MW2417 was from the same series as this car, but the door sure looks like it could be the same. This was apparently a wood sided outside braced car that the Espee converted to steel, rather than being built with steel sides.

Les


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 Post subject: Re: Rare bird? An outside braced CONVERTED boxcar preserved
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:15 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 5320
Well, it seems I have stumbled across another possible outside braced wood boxcar that was rebuilt with steel sides. IF it still exists! Here's the photo:

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=1201018

The picture is about 10 years old. The car (and caboose) were located in East Point, Georgia at a place call the Wagon Works, or possibly, the Old Wagon Works. Haven't found any info on the internet, except that it seems that this might possibly be an old mill that someone was trying to lease out for office space. No photos of the building itself, and certainly none of L&N boxcar #22120. Is the car still there? Is it a converted wood car? Seems like it deserved preservation, but this may not have been the right place for that.

Any info appreciated!

Les


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 Post subject: Re: Rare bird? An outside braced CONVERTED boxcar preserved
PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 3:08 pm 

Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 5:26 pm
Posts: 147
Location: Pure Michigan
Les Beckman wrote:
Well, it seems I have stumbled across another possible outside braced wood boxcar that was rebuilt with steel sides. IF it still exists! Here's the photo:

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=1201018

The picture is about 10 years old. The car (and caboose) were located in East Point, Georgia at a place call the Wagon Works, or possibly, the Old Wagon Works. Haven't found any info on the internet, except that it seems that this might possibly be an old mill that someone was trying to lease out for office space. No photos of the building itself, and certainly none of L&N boxcar #22120. Is the car still there? Is it a converted wood car? Seems like it deserved preservation, but this may not have been the right place for that.

Any info appreciated!

Les


Google Streetview from September 2017, shows the cars still sitting there.
There is a caboose, outside braced boxcar, and a regular steel boxcar on the property.
They are located at Wagon Works, 1514 Cleveland Ave, East Point, GA.


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 Post subject: Re: Rare bird? An outside braced CONVERTED boxcar preserved
PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 5:42 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 5320
NS 3322 -

Thanks for that great news. Now I guess, we'll have to hope someone with some knowledge of the L&N can give information as to whether #22120 was actually built with steel sides, or if it was a conversion from wood.


Les


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 Post subject: Re: Rare bird? An outside braced CONVERTED boxcar preserved
PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:11 am 

Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 6:15 pm
Posts: 41
Location: Three Rivers, Michigan
SP’s B-50-15 class of boxcars were converted to steel sides, I think at random, and nowhere near the whole fleet. I believe that’s what we are seeing here with the car in California. None of the other classes of single sheathed cars on the SP were ever so converted unless I am remembering wrong.

As for the car lettered L&N, my money says it is not an L&N car at all, except perhaps by way of merger. I have no recollection of ever coming across any such cars on the steam era L&N. I don’t remember if L&N ever had nine panel truss cars, or only seven panel ARA style ones, but I also don’t recall any steel-rebuilt variations. This doesn’t mean I have just never seen it myself, or have forgotten, but there is another, easy explanation:

The nearby Georgia Railroad had a fleet of USRA cars and clones built mostly to spec—Murphy ends with the same rib pattern, nine-panel truss sides made of hat section steel—that they rebuilt with steel sides just like this one. I’ll look for photos, but I believe it’s a dead ringer. Many of these even wore a distinctive silver paint job with black roof and ends; occasionally, the right hand panel where the ladder was also appeared in black. Some had radial roofs and some peaked.

At any rate, if this car lasted on the Georgia through the L&N/Family Lines or CSX mergers, it may we’ll have picked up L&N lettering then, or received it at its display location in homage to its donor/last owner or even just a rail fan favorite. The cut down ladders suggest, though not conclusively, that it stayed in railroad service for quite awhile.


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 Post subject: Re: Rare bird? An outside braced CONVERTED boxcar preserved
PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2018 2:39 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 5320
David A. Vago wrote:
SP’s B-50-15 class of boxcars were converted to steel sides, I think at random, and nowhere near the whole fleet. I believe that’s what we are seeing here with the car in California. None of the other classes of single sheathed cars on the SP were ever so converted unless I am remembering wrong.

As for the car lettered L&N, my money says it is not an L&N car at all, except perhaps by way of merger. I have no recollection of ever coming across any such cars on the steam era L&N. I don’t remember if L&N ever had nine panel truss cars, or only seven panel ARA style ones, but I also don’t recall any steel-rebuilt variations. This doesn’t mean I have just never seen it myself, or have forgotten, but there is another, easy explanation:

The nearby Georgia Railroad had a fleet of USRA cars and clones built mostly to spec—Murphy ends with the same rib pattern, nine-panel truss sides made of hat section steel—that they rebuilt with steel sides just like this one. I’ll look for photos, but I believe it’s a dead ringer. Many of these even wore a distinctive silver paint job with black roof and ends; occasionally, the right hand panel where the ladder was also appeared in black. Some had radial roofs and some peaked.

At any rate, if this car lasted on the Georgia through the L&N/Family Lines or CSX mergers, it may we’ll have picked up L&N lettering then, or received it at its display location in homage to its donor/last owner or even just a rail fan favorite. The cut down ladders suggest, though not conclusively, that it stayed in railroad service for quite awhile.


David -

Thanks for the info on the Southern Pacific's B-50-15 class of boxcars.

Your hint about L&N boxcar 22120 possibly really being an ex-Georgia Railroad car got me to checking. Here's what I found on George Elwood's website:

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/grr/ga2623as.jpg

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/grr/ga19733jpa.jpg

Looks like you were right and the car there in East Point, GA is really an ex-Georgia car. The second photo shows the car still being used in interchange service while the first photo shows it apparently re-numbered, probably as a Maintenance of Way car. That is probably where L&N 22120 ended up, and the reason it remained around long enough to be preserved. Wonder how safe it, and the other two cars, currently are?

BTW, Dennis Storzek mentioned these Georgia Railroad conversions earlier in this thread and I asked Dennis if he knew of any survivors. Now we apparently know of at least one!

Les


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