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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:20 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2226
...just -restore- the 1309 and make credit where credit is due from whomever is the financial favor is from, if its from a government source, donation, grant, whatever. I am sure the turnaround will be worth it when the engine runs. Any restoration has its lumps to jump over.


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:13 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8962
Location: Somewhere north of Prescott, AZ on the Santa Fe "Peavine"
dinwitty wrote:
...just -restore- the 1309 and make credit where credit is due from whomever is the financial favor is from, if its from a government source, donation, grant, whatever. I am sure the turnaround will be worth it when the engine runs. Any restoration has its lumps to jump over.

What's in YOUR wallet??

Please send it.


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:07 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2226
I havent seen any donation slots yet, I heard about some special train run to raise funds. I don't think they are operating like a museum than more a functioning railroad.


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:23 am 

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:30 pm
Posts: 673
Location: Bucks County, PA
dinwitty wrote:
I havent seen any donation slots yet, I heard about some special train run to raise funds. I don't think they are operating like a museum than more a functioning railroad.


Are you using a smartphone or laptop? I just went to the WMSR laptop and the “Support Us” button was staring me in the face...

And who said anything about WMSR ever operating like a museum? AFAIK they’ve always been a tourist railroad first and foremost...

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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:27 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:19 pm
Posts: 1745
Location: Pottstown,Pa.
The issue now is one of trust. Does the State of Md. and Allegheny County who between them have invested over $ 1M in this project and were told that it would be up and running months ago double down and put up the extra $ 530K the mgt. says will get her over the goal line or do they decide to cut & run??

From the tone of the remarks made a week ago by the County's Exec. Director it was clear to me that the county is strongly inclined to cut & run??

Their chances of raising $ 530K from the foamer community is nil.

IMHO-Ross Rowland


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 10:01 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8962
Location: Somewhere north of Prescott, AZ on the Santa Fe "Peavine"
Gee, what a Nattering Nabob of Negativity® that guy is.........


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 5:39 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 11:54 pm
Posts: 1821
co614 wrote:
The issue now is one of trust. Does the State of Md. and Allegheny County who between them have invested over $ 1M in this project and were told that it would be up and running months ago double down and put up the extra $ 530K the mgt. says will get her over the goal line or do they decide to cut & run??

From the tone of the remarks made a week ago by the County's Exec. Director it was clear to me that the county is strongly inclined to cut & run??

Their chances of raising $ 530K from the foamer community is nil.

IMHO-Ross Rowland


Agreed, although it should be one of clearly attainable goals, with a proven team-where are they?

For the potential donor, the question is now one of opportunity cost-should I give to an organization that has, quite frankly, not done well since acquiring the 1309, or donate to the 5550 project, which seems to be making progress, or something else?

Of course the already expended funds are sunk costs.


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 5:55 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:27 pm
Posts: 53
I have been using your logic and have been contributing to the 5550.

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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 6:30 pm 

Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2014 11:12 pm
Posts: 128
meixel wrote:
I have been using your logic and have been contributing to the 5550.

Same here. Another bonus to the 5550 project, is that it isnt mostly funded by our tax dollars; and yet it still has more potential progress to show for it when you look at the ratio of funds donated to progress.


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 7:58 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8962
Location: Somewhere north of Prescott, AZ on the Santa Fe "Peavine"
There's another approach to this mentality:

For, let's say, another half-million dollars, the WMSR will end up with a 2-6-6-2 that will put on an admittedly impressive show over a steeply-graded rail line with scheduled passenger service for as long as the loco has a boiler ticket, say fifteen years or so based on 734. (This, of course, assumes no major changes that cause the County to abandon the WMSR as a tourist enterprise, etc.--which, considering it's been operating for around thirty years now definitely pushes it past "experimental"or "temporary" in status.)

For whatever millions of dollars or so, we all end up with "PRR 5550," which at the moment has NO committed home, no firm operating plan, no assurance it will have a chance to trot on a track capable of showing off its capabilities (that we know of). etc.

As much as I dislike what I'm hearing from Cumberland of late, if you approach MY nonprofit looking for a handout with those two proposals, I know which one the BOD I'm on will take more seriously.......


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 8:47 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:27 pm
Posts: 53
As for "where will 5550 run?" I stopped worrying about that when I saw the top notch group of people who are building her. They must know something about "where" and I trust that they wouldn't be involved if they didn't have that already figured out.

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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:14 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
Posts: 5550
Location: southeastern USA
Any operating plans for 5550 now will no longer be valid by the time she's ready to run. Sure, they have very knowledgeable and competent engineers and others involved, and no doubt they will eventually find an opportunity when that day finally does come, but as for a dedicated and committed program of operation? That takes more a leap of faith than anything else at present. It's eventual construction OTOH has reached the point of a strong likelihood. Contribute for that, not for an unknown future.

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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:46 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 4:29 pm
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Location: Youngstown, OH
To me, building the 5550 is far more interesting than merely seeing it run. Think of all of the manufacturing processes and techniques that are being developed, updated, refined and improved upon to make this happen.

Seeing a new T1 fire up, even if it just runs back and forth 500 feet, would be one of the greatest achievements in railway preservation, because it breaks the "glass ceiling" that says that no large locomotive would ever be built in the US after the demise of the "age of steam".

Many people also said a Big Boy would never run again.

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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:55 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 12:57 am
Posts: 205
Location: Sandpoint, ID
Rick Rowlands wrote:
To me, building the 5550 is far more interesting than merely seeing it run. Think of all of the manufacturing processes and techniques that are being developed, updated, refined and improved upon to make this happen.

Seeing a new T1 fire up, even if it just runs back and forth 500 feet, would be one of the greatest achievements in railway preservation, because it breaks the "glass ceiling" that says that no large locomotive would ever be built in the US after the demise of the "age of steam".

Many people also said a Big Boy would never run again.



Exactly!


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 Post subject: Re: The strange saga of C&O 1309 restoration just got strang
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2018 10:03 pm 

Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:26 pm
Posts: 80
In the spirit of 150 years ago, "whoever lays track to the state line gets the mail contract or something." If 5550 gets finished first, the WMSR should invite the 5550 group to run their engine on the WMSR.


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