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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 7:57 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
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Location: southeastern USA
Let's not get too respectful of parents in general - many are terrible at it. Any idiot can reproduce, but to turn that blob into a decent human being capable of critical thinking and rational thought - far too few of them. Most just seem to want to pass along generations old prejudices and divisive tribalism.

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Corollary: "He who does is doomed to watch those who don't repeat it anyway."


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 5:25 am 

Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2013 3:55 am
Posts: 99
Emmo213 wrote:
I have to agree with Ed though - so they're going to add some more female characters and have Thomas travel around the world visiting other countries. What's the big deal?


Railroads are principally a male thing, worldwide and even today as with all tec things, as we all are biologically determined by our genes and by hormones - all things you can't blame anybody for. PC indeed does blame and discriminate people for being white and male. That is the "deal".

Quote:
Barbie sales rose 24 percent earlier this year thanks to the new set of dolls and a message of female empowerment."



Mainly girls play with Barbie. So if Mattel takes a girls' toy, adds more female actors, adds "female empowerment" they reach more girls as customers. Surely a good decision - for a girls' toy.

The boys' toy "Thomas" needs no more Thomas losing to a female character. Where is the male empowerment here? Mattel may as well lose young male customers, as they are already getting their daily doses of white-man-hating PC in TV, schools and Kindergartens.

How would it suit the UN if Mattel added some "Donald" and "Ronald" to their Barbies instead of a "Hilary electric" to Thomas?

Mike


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 7:48 am 

Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2016 11:58 am
Posts: 33
484Mike wrote:
Emmo213 wrote:
I have to agree with Ed though - so they're going to add some more female characters and have Thomas travel around the world visiting other countries. What's the big deal?


Railroads are principally a male thing, worldwide and even today as with all tec things, as we all are biologically determined by our genes and by hormones - all things you can't blame anybody for. PC indeed does blame and discriminate people for being white and male. That is the "deal".

Quote:
Barbie sales rose 24 percent earlier this year thanks to the new set of dolls and a message of female empowerment."



Mainly girls play with Barbie. So if Mattel takes a girls' toy, adds more female actors, adds "female empowerment" they reach more girls as customers. Surely a good decision - for a girls' toy.

The boys' toy "Thomas" needs no more Thomas losing to a female character. Where is the male empowerment here? Mattel may as well lose young male customers, as they are already getting their daily doses of white-man-hating PC in TV, schools and Kindergartens.

How would it suit the UN if Mattel added some "Donald" and "Ronald" to their Barbies instead of a "Hilary electric" to Thomas?

Mike



I had to go outside and calm down for awhile and try and figure out how to politely respond to your "thinking".

I decided to just say that my daughter played with Thomas toys for at least five years when she was younger.

If you have anything to do with a museum you are costing yourself volunteers and visitors.

Brian


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:16 am 

Joined: Sun May 18, 2014 8:56 pm
Posts: 91
Location: New York
Quote:
I had to go outside and calm down for awhile and try and figure out how to politely respond to your "thinking".

I decided to just say that my daughter played with Thomas toys for at least five years when she was younger.

If you have anything to do with a museum you are costing yourself volunteers and visitors.

Brian


Firmly agree here, the previous statements by 484Mike demonstrate why so many of the general public perceive railroad preservation as an "old boys club". Whether or not you espouse these views while volunteering/working, these deeply rooted beliefs will subconsciously affect how you work with others who are not of the same gender/ethnicity/age as yourself.

I've tried to shy away from these recent Thomas threads, what began as an earnest examination of recent social/political trends influencing the Thomas series & Day Out events is devolving into a platform to air political grievances. But I wanted to throw my hat in the ring here having a stake in this game. Coming from someone of the next generation, I believe the very unfortunate "boys are one way, girls are the other; don't bother to change my mind" attitude will ultimately cost the wider preservation community new members if left unchecked.

And yes, I am a Millennial and damn proud of it. Also, yes, I am active in preservation.


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:57 am 

Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:08 pm
Posts: 292
Location: Amherst, Oh
484Mike wrote:
Emmo213 wrote:
I have to agree with Ed though - so they're going to add some more female characters and have Thomas travel around the world visiting other countries. What's the big deal?


Railroads are principally a male thing, worldwide and even today as with all tec things, as we all are biologically determined by our genes and by hormones - all things you can't blame anybody for. PC indeed does blame and discriminate people for being white and male. That is the "deal".

Quote:
Barbie sales rose 24 percent earlier this year thanks to the new set of dolls and a message of female empowerment."



Mainly girls play with Barbie. So if Mattel takes a girls' toy, adds more female actors, adds "female empowerment" they reach more girls as customers. Surely a good decision - for a girls' toy.

The boys' toy "Thomas" needs no more Thomas losing to a female character. Where is the male empowerment here? Mattel may as well lose young male customers, as they are already getting their daily doses of white-man-hating PC in TV, schools and Kindergartens.

How would it suit the UN if Mattel added some "Donald" and "Ronald" to their Barbies instead of a "Hilary electric" to Thomas?

Mike


Your response was so disheartening to read, but instead of digging in to more politics I'll just say this:

a) Read the article as the UN/Mattel is not adding a "Hillary electric".
b) According to the US Census Bureau 50.8% of America is female. Your thinking just lost your organization half of it's potential volunteers.


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 9:33 am 

Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:31 am
Posts: 480
In the 50s, Lionel marketed a "girls train set", painted in pastel colors and complete with a pink engine. It failed miserably, and surviving sets are worth quite a bit to collectors today. The reason is not that girls did not play with toy trains, but rather they wanted the realism of a traditional Lionel set. My point being that trains and railroading as a concept does not need any tinkering to appeal to anyone.


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 4:06 pm 

Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2013 3:55 am
Posts: 99
choodude wrote:

I had to go outside and calm down for awhile and try and figure out how to politely respond to your "thinking".


Be sure that my points are well thought and proven in science and psychology. Anyone can see that my generalization of course does not mean 100% but is necessary for I am not about to spend more time with exception than with the rule. You have no idea how many girls I know that play with trains; yet that proves nothing and it remains a biological determined minority.

Quote:
If you have anything to do with a museum you are costing yourself volunteers and visitors.

Brian


You didn't get my point: It is not about hindering girls from doing what they like. Neither is it about hindering girls buying tickets or becoming active members.

I repeat this for you: Mattel did right with their Barbie activities. Nothing too wrong with that. My point is about getting politics and especially PC and UN out of educational toys for children.

Again, why is there no Boys empowerment in Thomas, if girls empowerment in girls toys is so successful and not criticized by you - and BTW, doesn't Mattel also cut off 50% of their customers if they focus their Barbies on girls? Is empowerment only good for one gender?

Boys are falling behind in the US in schools and universities and this will not strengthen neither society nor economy. Let them just play trains the way they like it.

Mike


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:40 pm 

Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2016 11:58 am
Posts: 33
6-18003 wrote:
In the 50s, Lionel marketed a "girls train set", painted in pastel colors and complete with a pink engine. It failed miserably, and surviving sets are worth quite a bit to collectors today. The reason is not that girls did not play with toy trains, but rather they wanted the realism of a traditional Lionel set. My point being that trains and railroading as a concept does not need any tinkering to appeal to anyone.



My local gun shop has camo guns in which the background color is pink. The owner says he has only sold them to male grandparent types getting them for their grand kids.

Women and parents who bring their kids and grand kids buy regular camo colors or regular gun colors.

Brian


Brian


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:47 pm 

Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2016 11:58 am
Posts: 33
484Mike wrote:
choodude wrote:

I had to go outside and calm down for awhile and try and figure out how to politely respond to your "thinking".


Be sure that my points are well thought and proven in science and psychology. Anyone can see that my generalization of course does not mean 100% but is necessary for I am not about to spend more time with exception than with the rule. You have no idea how many girls I know that play with trains; yet that proves nothing and it remains a biological determined minority.

Quote:
If you have anything to do with a museum you are costing yourself volunteers and visitors.

Brian


You didn't get my point: It is not about hindering girls from doing what they like. Neither is it about hindering girls buying tickets or becoming active members.

Mike


You have been led to water. You will not drink. I get it. This response isn't really for you, but rather for those who are looking over our shoulder.

You appear to be practicing science the same way that Ancel Keys practiced nutrition science back in the 1960's when he did his 7 Nations Study. Ancel believed that fat was bad for you, especially animal fats, and when the evidence of his research from a country did not support his belief he rejected the countries results. Thus there were only 7 Countries in his publication.

You have rejected evidence as "exceptions" that contradict your belief that "Railroads are principally a male thing, worldwide and even today as with all tec things, as we all are biologically determined by our genes and by hormones"

As Mr. Keys teachings took hold and folks ate more carbohydrates and less fats, obesity and Type 2 Diabetes increased proportionately, and are spiraling out of control.

Others have spoken eloquently about why your attitude is hurting your museum. I don't expect you to understand why, but perhaps others can relate to a couple scenarios.

Many of us have experience with a certain person who practices bad personal hygiene and has terrible body odor. They don't seem to be able to smell themselves, but folks sure do move away from them.

I'm a Track and construction person in my professional life. Over the years I've volunteered at museums to do track work. Most of them are welcoming and are fun to work with. In other places though, Track folks were not good enough for the click and were just tolerated as a necessary evil. Guess where I didn't go back, and later heard the museum had to pay real money to a professional contractor to fix stuff I'd have taken care of?

So I'll bet you don't see how you are hurting your museum's success.

Brian


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:58 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am
Posts: 563
484Mike wrote:
I repeat this for you: Mattel did right with their Barbie activities. Nothing too wrong with that.

I just hope your organization does a little more research before attempting a "Barbie Train" event, e.g.:
Quote:
BERLIN (Reuters) - Women’s rights protesters disrupted the opening of a giant pink doll’s house in Berlin on Thursday, saying the Barbie “Dreamhouse Experience” objectified women.

Promoting the doll made by Mattel Inc, the house allows paying visitors to try on Barbie’s clothes, play in her kitchen and have a go on her pink piano. The exhibition will be open until August 25. A handful of protesters gathered outside the shocking pink house that has been erected in one of central Berlin’s greyest areas.

A topless woman, a member of the Femen protest group, who had the slogan “Life in plastic is not fantastic” scrawled across her chest, set fire to a Barbie doll tied to a mini crucifix.

Link to full article: Reuters - Topless protest disrupts opening of Barbie house in Berlin


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 1:09 pm 

Joined: Sun May 15, 2005 2:22 pm
Posts: 1354
What will the UN bring to the table to improve the draw of the Thomas brand? Couldn’t the Thomas brand simply adopt its own woke messaging without partnering with the UN? It seems to me that this partnership would help the woke cause of the UN because it would broaden the reach. But it is hard to see why the partnership would help Thomas. Does anyone really believe that the Thomas brand is faltering because it lacks woke messaging?


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 6:44 pm 

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 pm
Posts: 2135
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Quote:
What will the UN bring to the table to improve the draw of the Thomas brand?


Exactly. I think the original Washington Post news item that started this thread has buried the lead. There is no mention of how a quality program is going to be created. Quoting from the Washington Post story:

Quote:
Soon teams from Mattel and the United Nations were gathered in New York, where U.N. staffers pitched ideas to Thomas brand managers.


Quote:
The U.N. involvement in the episodes took multiple forms — correcting language such as Thomas’s use of “forest” when he meant "orchard,"


Seriously? Where are the writers? So, regardless of your opinion on the UN content, there is a lot of evidence here that the actual content creation is poor, bordering on incompetent. I support the ideas of broadening the Thomas script, but that work has to start with skilled writers who are inspired and motivated. It can't start with executives and administrators.

Even worse, if it likely fails, many persons, including in this forum, will blame the new script ideas, when in fact it is the creative process that has failed.

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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 7:14 pm 

Joined: Sun Mar 05, 2017 3:05 pm
Posts: 30
Quote:
Seriously? Where are the writers? So, regardless of your opinion on the UN content, there is a lot of evidence here that the actual content creation is poor, bordering on incompetent.


Here's exhibit A:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnaugj1uBwY

Basically 7 minutes of Gordon complaining that the show is crap now and the accepting his fate of being on a dying show.


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 1:11 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8864
Location: Somewhere north of Prescott, AZ on the Santa Fe "Peavine"
British BBC satire (WARNING: un-PC and "not safe for work") on the negative reaction to the "feminization" of another landmark British TV show, Doctor Who:

https://www.facebook.com/bbccomedy/vide ... 346419527/

Depending on your viewpoint, this is either a) how people opposing the trend look to the rest of the world, or b) further PC-bashing of those who oppose or confront the "politically correct" movements for what they are.................


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 Post subject: Re: United Nations to Collaborate With Thomas the Tank Engin
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 10:08 pm 

Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:08 pm
Posts: 292
Location: Amherst, Oh
parktrains wrote:
Quote:
Seriously? Where are the writers? So, regardless of your opinion on the UN content, there is a lot of evidence here that the actual content creation is poor, bordering on incompetent.


Here's exhibit A:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnaugj1uBwY

Basically 7 minutes of Gordon complaining that the show is crap now and the accepting his fate of being on a dying show.


Did anybody else find this clip rather ironic considering the conversation we're having?


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