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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 10:03 pm 

Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:31 am
Posts: 576
Charlie wrote:
This just in from the Bessemer & Lake Erie 643 Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/BessemerLakeEr ... =1&theater


If you are going to post from facebook please copy/paste at least the gist of whatever was posted. Not all of us have an account or are members on all of these support pages.


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 10:35 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 9152
Location: Somewhere north of Prescott, AZ on the Santa Fe "Peavine"
NS 3322 wrote:
Important to note that the Steel City group is NOT a member of the NRHS!
But rather a chapter of the Railway & Locomotive Historical Society (RHLS). An organzation that claims to be "The Oldest Railroad History Organization in North America." Never heard of it.


I would suggest that they do have a bit of an image/PR problem. Or maybe that's the way they prefer it.

But the R&LHS, at least nationally, has long been the "home" of the true rail historian academics--of the likes of Bill Withuhn, George Hilton, Jack White, Walter Gray, Herb Harwood, the Tabers, you name it.

I long ago heard a second-generation member of both the R&LHS and the NRHS state the R&LHS was the "stodgy, clannish, and boring" wing of railfandom, while the NRHS was the place for "railfans and train chasers."

Perhaps if one were to draw a more apt analogy in 2019, the NRHS is TrainOrders and the R&LHS is RyPN.

And somehow through all of this the Railroad Enthusiasts still exists.

Of course, there does happen to be an even more "elite" invitational-only rail group out there.......


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 11:51 pm 

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:27 am
Posts: 535
Location: Winters, TX
My apologies for the facebook link. It won't happen again. Since the announcement apparently contained sensitive information, I won't divulge what it said.


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 11:52 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2015 11:05 am
Posts: 57
Location: Quebec
What a weird story! Somes peoples try to said that all fake and the rest to said the sale is true.
But why on ebay?? I like ebay but i don't know, that story smell bad and the 643 (a great steam locomotive) is in

I thinking same as Ross(co614) now that look scrapping i hope not and something change with new peoples (AOS, Illinois Railway Museum etc)

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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 12:23 pm 

Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 11:09 am
Posts: 160
If the 643 is for sale, I believe the French Creek Valley Railroad Historical Society would be a good group to take her in, as they recently purchased an old B&LE depot, and the 643 would be a solid centerpiece for the museum their planning.

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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 1:05 pm 

Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2014 11:12 pm
Posts: 135
tweetsie12 wrote:
If the 643 is for sale, I believe the French Creek Valley Railroad Historical Society would be a good group to take her in, as they recently purchased an old B&LE depot, and the 643 would be a solid centerpiece for the museum their planning.


But do they have finances to pay for both the locomotive and shipping costs? Campbell is sticking to his guns about recouping some of his expenses so any group thats in consideration will need to have DEEP pockets.


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 3:17 pm 

Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:03 pm
Posts: 941
Location: Warszawa, Polska
WVNorthern wrote:
If this gizmo used in Nashville for moving a locomotive could be obtained, it would eliminate trying to reconnect the tracks for movement to a "friendly" siding.

http://www.railpictures.net/photo/684031/


You need the gizmo that was used to move a UP FEF some years ago.

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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 3:50 pm 

Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 5:26 pm
Posts: 357
Location: Pure Michigan
joe6167 wrote:
WVNorthern wrote:
If this gizmo used in Nashville for moving a locomotive could be obtained, it would eliminate trying to reconnect the tracks for movement to a "friendly" siding.

http://www.railpictures.net/photo/684031/


You need the gizmo that was used to move a UP FEF some years ago.


That gizmo is called a Road Schnabel.

The only recently moved UP FEF was #833, which was moved in February 1999 from Pioneer Park in Salt Lake City to the Utah State Railroad Museum in Ogden (40 miles). I managed to dig up some photos. I did not know there was a road version of the Schnabel Car. The entire move was done by truck.

"Union Pacific 4-8-4 No. 833 finally made its trip from (Pioneer Park in) Salt Lake City to ( the Utah State Railroad Museum in) Ogden on Sunday, February 21, 1999, as planned, by truck. Newspaper reports variously put the cost of moving the roughly 450,000-pound locomotive and tender at $100,000 and $120,000, apparently funded by a grant from the Utah Legislature."

Thank you for your comment! I was not aware of this history of the locomotive.

More photos here:
http://southern.railfan.net/road/833/road-well.html


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 4:00 pm 

Joined: Sat May 19, 2018 10:03 am
Posts: 47
I heard a rumor that the 833’s frame was damaged or had a lot of stress on it while being moved. Is this true?


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 4:12 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:40 am
Posts: 358
Interesting.

I've heard UPRR #838 has a cracked frame. Never knew #833 was damaged?

Robert


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 5:09 pm 

Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2007 8:09 pm
Posts: 391
The thing used to move 576 is a set of modular SPMT's. Much more maneuverable then the trailer used to move 833.

https://www.mammoet.com/equipment/trans ... rter/spmt/

VERY common for large loads these days, and using jacks, you dont even need a crane. But again, not a cheap option by any means.


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 10:16 pm 

Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:04 pm
Posts: 75
Those massive trailers like they used for the #833 will set you back six figures. Considering the entire locomotive will be taken apart for overhaul anyways, it would make sense to start disassembling the locomotive now piece by piece and moving it away cheaply using a flat bed truck or semi trailer to another site. You would have the boiler and frame left which could be shipped individually likely with just a 3 axle trailer.

The other choice would be using side boom cranes to get it on the mainline which would be the cheapest option. I know the recent move of the D&RGW, #9871 only took around 6 hours to move it about 1/4 mile from the mainline to the museum.


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Wed May 15, 2019 11:48 pm 

Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2010 6:22 pm
Posts: 239
Tom F wrote:
Those massive trailers like they used for the #833 will set you back six figures. Considering the entire locomotive will be taken apart for overhaul anyways, it would make sense to start disassembling the locomotive now piece by piece and moving it away cheaply using a flat bed truck or semi trailer to another site. You would have the boiler and frame left which could be shipped individually likely with just a 3 axle trailer.

The other choice would be using side boom cranes to get it on the mainline which would be the cheapest option. I know the recent move of the D&RGW, #9871 only took around 6 hours to move it about 1/4 mile from the mainline to the museum.


Except it's been reported that time is of the essence, as the new owners of the property want it out by July 1. I sincerely hope this ends well!

CD


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 9:49 am 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:10 pm
Posts: 1017
A potential stumbling block to getting 643 out of its present location by road, even in pieces: no matter which way you go, there are underpasses that may restrict the height of the load(s). Several right angle turns on relatively narrow streets are also involved.


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 Post subject: Re: 643 for sale on eBay?
PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 11:12 am 

Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2010 4:22 pm
Posts: 346
NS3322’s pictures are what is happening near us as the oil and gas industry moves in.
As I said over on TO, we also see a lot of flown loads (unfortunately, only 20,000 pounds at a time for one company and 44,000 for the other) and truly enormous river loads (500,000 pounds would not be on obstacle for a medium-sized deck barge and crane.) it absolutely is possible to move someth8ng 643’s size. I don’t think it will happen, but it could.

There are three problems working against a dismantle and heavy haul: time, money and volunteers. 1309 had some pro bono transport, and many heavy haulers will help on big public projects, but it can take time to get approval and/or wait for a break in the weather and the superload hauler’s schedule.

If any rescue group had a chance at discounted transport, they’d need to have a small army of volunteers onsite now, stripping off everything possible as fast as possible without losing sight of what went where. The owner would have to approve of that while he’s waiting to get paid, of course, and I don’t think Ebay’s PayPal Credit deal would offer their six-month interest-free special on 250 tons of old iron. That means should a group manage the financial end of it, time is liable to be even shorter. With a done deal and a few months, it wouldn’t be that hard. Given six weeks and the need to assemble people just as construction season takes off, the difficulty factor just shot up.

Finally, getting her out of the pocket she’s in would indeed be the hardest part of the job. Once she left the tight confines and got out to any railroad, any of the major highways and/or the river, the trip to any storage place—AOS being a good choice, but not the only one—would be fairly routine. I’ve just seen too many false starts with this engine to think this last one will work unless some really spectacular last-minute move can happen.

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