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 Post subject: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:31 am 

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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:40 am 

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The Yankee Air Force is doing just fine -- see

http://yankeeairmuseum.org/

Bob H


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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:10 pm 

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Location: Tucson, Arizona
The Commemorative Air Force, fka the Confederate Air Force, is also very strong. Then there's the Experimental Aircraft Association, which is also quite strong. Also, the DC-3/C-47/C-53 is still used in commercial service and Basler Aviation is actively modifying them to operate in the modern cargo environment. Not too long from now, the DC-3 will be the only commercial aircraft to claim 100 years of service.

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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:55 pm 
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Yeah, go to an airshow and see who's working on these warbirds. You'll find an age range well lower than, say, at your local RR museum, NRHS chapter or model RR club...

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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 8:27 pm 

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The Collings Foundation runs a tour for about 10 months around the country with their WW2 aircraft. They have a B-17, B-24, B-25, P-51 and a P-40.. You cam ride in any of the aircraft for a donation. In addition, the P-51 and P-40 are dual control, so you can fly them.
I have flown a B-25, and the P-51 for my birthday. It was a rush!


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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 11:32 pm 

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Location: Northern WV
Fantasy of Flight in Florida has a large collection of operating warbirds. At one time, the entire museum was open to visitors and most days one of the planes would be flown. I was fortunate enough on my visit several years ago to see one of his P51 Mustangs scorching over the museum. We also got to see his restoration shop and there were dozens of brand new surplus radial and non-radial engines. A while back, he (Kermit Weeks) scaled the museum hours and exhibits way back. When you inherit a fortune, it allows you to indulge in your expensive hobby.

https://www.fantasyofflight.com/collection/


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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 3:12 am 

Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:28 am
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Location: Ipswich, UK
Bowmore wrote:
The Collings Foundation runs a tour for about 10 months around the country with their WW2 aircraft. They have a B-17, B-24, B-25, P-51 and a P-40.. You cam ride in any of the aircraft for a donation. In addition, the P-51 and P-40 are dual control, so you can fly them.
I have flown a B-25, and the P-51 for my birthday. It was a rush!


I'm intending to have a flight in the B-24 at some stage - Just got to make sure my vacation plans to the USA fit in with their schedule..........
Had a flight in the EAA's B-17 out of Madison, Wisconsin back in 2011 and was certainly an experience to remember, particularly as I was told to sit in the cockpit for take-off and landing as they were fully booked with participants on that particular flight!.

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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 8:35 am 

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:07 pm
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Location: Leicester, MA.
Bowmore wrote:
The Collings Foundation runs a tour for about 10 months around the country with their WW2 aircraft. They have a B-17, B-24, B-25, P-51 and a P-40.. You cam ride in any of the aircraft for a donation. In addition, the P-51 and P-40 are dual control, so you can fly them.
I have flown a B-25, and the P-51 for my birthday. It was a rush!

Also of note is that the Collings Foundation has their new American Heritage Museum in Stowe. I've been there for the preview weekends and for their recent father's day open house. They've got no shortage of young volunteers to run that either.

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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:38 am 

Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 1:24 pm
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I've been fascinated by the aircraft preservation movement's ability to not only attract younger members but raise incredible amounts of money. Certainly, the World War II connection has a somewhat universal appeal in addition to the awesome sights of one of these warbirds flying. But couldn't the same be said of a steam locomotive? Is this another example of the rail preservation movement generally not having its act together?


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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:51 am 

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Location: cheyenne
Agreed with most comments, its nowhere near as big an issue, many current military and civil jet pilots transition to warbirds quite happily and the resulting age is a lot lower. I was in the warbird industry for a few happy years in AZ.

Mike


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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2019 1:47 pm 

Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 10:54 am
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Location: Tucson, Arizona
Brent S. Bette wrote:
I've been fascinated by the aircraft preservation movement's ability to not only attract younger members but raise incredible amounts of money. Certainly, the World War II connection has a somewhat universal appeal in addition to the awesome sights of one of these warbirds flying. But couldn't the same be said of a steam locomotive? Is this another example of the rail preservation movement generally not having its act together?


Probably not. I'm going to be brutally honest here-rail preservation is in a really bad state compared to the aviation museums and I am not convinced that there really is much that we can do, unless we get more support from the big players in modern railroading-yes, modern railroading. Aviation museums tell the story of the history of flight and the advancements of aviation from the very beginning to the modern day. The best museums do not attempt to emulate one specific era only.

Example-has one of our museums received a SD70 that we can display and demonstrate the advances in diesel electric locomotive technology from the first generation diesel electrics? My local aviation museum-the Pima Air and Space Museum received a MAJOR donation from Boeing's Commercial Aircraft division-a complete Boeing 787 . Yes, a 787 that was flown into Tucson's Davis Monthan Air Force Base and towed across Valencia Road to the museum. They constantly mention that they have a 787 in their radio spots and I am certain that the local community college's aviation technician students have had their hands on that airplane as part of their learning experiences? How is it that they can convince an airplane manufacturer to donate a $100 million dollar airplane to them and none of us can convince a major railroad or locomotive to donate a new locomotive for display to represent advancements in railroad technology?

While we should preserve the historic artifacts of railroading, we would do well to represent modern railroading as that is what will attract the youth of today. There's a lot of neat and vital technology being introduced but if the youth don't get exposure to that technology, we're not going to attract them-certainly not in the numbers that aviation and automobile museums do.

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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:02 pm 

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 3:07 pm
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Location: B'more Maryland
Is part of the problem that there are so many "rail museums" that has resulted in unnecessary duplication of efforts and a dilution of interest?

I think part of that may that many rail orgs sprang from simply "rail focused social clubs" (::cough NRHS cough::) instead of being mission driven. In those situations, attracting new blood is very difficult.

Another issue is one of access. If you have a warbird you can pretty much fly it from or to any airport. With a train, you can only go where you have an owner's permission, and that has gotten increasingly difficult. If we had a system like the UK's where there was open access, I think the situation might be quite different, but we don't (and likely won't).

But I think the #1 issue facing railroad preservation today is that groups are not getting where the action is when it comes to recruiting a new generation. Nobody wants to hang around with unpleasant cranky old men. If your group seems like a bunch of said cranky old men then younger people will simply go find other people to associate with. You've got to be welcoming, open minded, and maybe leave that MAGA or Bernie hat at home.


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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:17 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm
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A clear mission and also an attractive mission is key, imho. The organization I belong to it’s basically you get to do the dirty work on the project that the higher ups want to see happen. That’s the “volunteer oppprtunities.”

I always envy places like IRM where the individual departments get to work on projects they decide to work on.


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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 1:27 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am
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Alan Walker wrote:
I'm going to be brutally honest here-rail preservation is in a really bad state compared to the aviation museums


I disagree. AFAIK, nobody has attempted to historically preserve a complete airbase or airport (other than Floyd Bennett Field in NYC which is now a park managed by the National Park Service.)

Furthermore, preserved historical airplanes operate far fewer hours than do preserved steam locomotives.

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 Post subject: Re: O/T--Who Will Keep the Warbirds Flying?
PostPosted: Wed Jun 26, 2019 4:35 pm 

Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2004 10:54 am
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Location: Tucson, Arizona
The problem that many railroad museums have is that the stated mission often tends to focus on one era of railroading. For a museum to be successful, the museum does need to consider who their target audience is and what is necessary to attract interest. Aviation museums don't need their airplanes to function to draw the interest of the public, so a comparison of operating hours is really an apples to oranges comparison.

One problem that museums have is that we tend to be more or less immobile. That means that we are largely dependent on getting people to come to us, instead of us taking the museum to where the people are. The museum that I am currently active in has solved that problem. As we are a transportation museum (not a railroad museum), we have the advantage of having vintage transit buses (from our city) that we have restored and can send to any community event. The external advertising signs have been replaced with signs advertising our museum and our donation programs. We can place exhibits inside the buses using platforms designed to sit on top of the seats. The buses are a real hit at auto shows, as they are show vehicles that you can touch and go inside-as opposed to the usual "look but please don't touch" rule.

What I see as the big difference between aviation museums and railroad museums is this-to the general public, aviation is very relevant to modern life. If you travel long distances, you're going by air. Aviation has forums where it can wow the general public, such as the Reno Air Races or major air shows. I literally grew up around aviation-my parents are both pilots and I got to go to the premier aviation camp-recommended to my parents by June Scobee Rogers. Our counselor was a senior captain with Delta Air Lines-ex-USAF. The person who ran the camp program (it was a Texas A & M program) was a project manager with Boeing. We got to do all sorts of hands on aviation activities, including getting to get up close and personal with an MD-88. It should also be noted that general aviation has several large organizations-particularly the Experimental Aircraft Association-that make it one of their principal goals to recruit young people into the aviation ranks. Scouting also helps, as the Explorer Scouts have dedicated Aviation Posts-I went through that program too. Railroad preservation tends to be more individual and was a bit more difficult to get into, from my own observations.

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