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 Post subject: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:47 pm 

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 pm
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Does anybody know more details about the modifications to 19 to satisfy clearances?

http://trn.trains.com/news/news-wire/2019/09/10-worlds-oldest-largest-cable-car-returns-to-the-hills-of-san-francisco

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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:39 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:01 pm
Posts: 115
This if the first I have heard of this, thanks for posting it.

I came across this https://www.streetcar.org/back-on-track-after-77-years-off/ which briefly mentions some of the changes necessary to have it operate over California Street.

Roger


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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:35 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:47 pm
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Location: Philadelphia, PA
Wasn't Market St. Cable Ry. Standard RR gauge (4' 8 1/2") as a cable line? If so retrucking to MUNI's cable gauge of 3' 6" was another change.

In any event, an 1883 build date makes "Big 19" one of the oldest operating cars around. It predates practical electric cars.

Does any museum have an older in-service car?

Phil Mulligan


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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:38 pm 

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 pm
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Thanks.

"California style trucks" are outside bearing trucks, now the standard on the cables. Up into the 1970s, the ex-Market Street single end cars had inside bearing trucks, and I think that would explain the few inches of bind on curves with the running boards. Car 19 was a Market Street company car.

I bet they got a Sawzall out and cut notches into the running boards.

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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:40 pm 

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 pm
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Notice 19 is longer by an extra set of standee positions at each end, compared to a California car.

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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 3:44 am 

Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:28 am
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Location: Ipswich, UK
I've just got back from 11 days vacation in the SF area, arranged to coincide with the Heritage weekend. Didn't find time to ride on the two unusual cars that were out on the cable car line on California Street (#19 & #42), but did manage to photograph both of them at the Market St end of the line.....
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Was very impressed with the operation of the event as a whole, with the added bonus of some cars in use on the F line that aren't normally used, like the Melbourne and "Zurich"(Brussels) cars. Nice to see both Blackpool "Boat" cars out on the Saturday as well!

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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 4:24 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:51 pm
Posts: 1703
Location: Southern California
EJ Berry wrote:
Wasn't Market St. Cable Ry. Standard RR gauge (4' 8 1/2") as a cable line? If so retrucking to MUNI's cable gauge of 3' 6" was another change.

In any event, an 1883 build date makes "Big 19" one of the oldest operating cars around. It predates practical electric cars.

Does any museum have an older in-service car?

Phil Mulligan
The Sacramento-Clay cable car line was a 42' gauge cable car line. The cars were originally standard gauge cars; but rebuilt for the Sacramento-Clay line in 1907-08. This car line was discontinued by Market Street Railway in February 1942.

The 12 cars of this car line were stored at the Washington and Mason until after the Market Street Ry passed into the ownership of the City and Muni in 1944. These cars were then sold.

The Sacramento-Clay line operated with double ended cars, The Powell lines of the Market Street Railway used single ended cars.

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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:27 pm 
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Location: MA
A little off topic but is there a list of surviving San Francisco cable cars? I know some made it to museum around the country and or even a few that have been rebuilt into buses.


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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 9:55 am 

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 pm
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
RCD wrote:
A little off topic but is there a list of surviving San Francisco cable cars? I know some made it to museum around the country and or even a few that have been rebuilt into buses.


I think the book "Inside Muni" by Interurban Press has complete rosters of all cars that were acquired from Market Street and Cal Cable lines in the 1950s.

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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:35 pm 

Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:27 am
Posts: 563
Location: Winters, TX
This has a pretty complete list of the Powell Street and California Street cable cars both in service and retired.

http://www.cablecarmuseum.org/archive/cars/cars1.htm

I'm curious as to the fate of former Knott's Berry Farm cars 6, 20, 49 and 59. They were returned to Muni and I heard that they were scrapped due to extensive corrosion of the frame and trucks from leaking battery acid. But this list says they were sold to an unknown party.


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 Post subject: Re: Sacramento Clay cable car 19
PostPosted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:11 pm 

Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2015 2:48 pm
Posts: 106
At least one of the former Knotts cars is now at the Poway Midland RR in Poway CA, outside of San Diego. http://www.powaymidlandrr.org/


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