This link came to me via another board:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.p ... 943&nseq=3


IRM ???????

DPK

Really sad. I like the old alcos much more than emd.

The RailPictures caption is apparently in error; according to this roster site at least three other RSD-12's are preserved elsewhere:

http://www.thedieselshop.us/SurvivorsAlco%20RS-6.HTML

I think what he means is that was the last RSD-12 to roll off the production line.

This locomotive is extremely important as it is the last LS&I Alco that may be preserved as such since IRM may paint their RSD15 to ATSF colors (despite the fact that keeping in LS&I configuration would keep it in context to the midwest), and LS&I RS3's from Minnesota Commercial sold to NRE may be scrapped if not already.

This REALLY belongs at Lake Superior Railroad Museum, why they acted on it is something they have to answer since it is really vital to their mission in telling the history if local iron range railroads. This is also especially true because it is among the last of a large group of Alcos that used to work for the DMIR, CNW, and LS&I that are still extent.

There were parts available from other West Tennessee ex RSD12's that were extent until a few years ago and could be gotten from other RS11s or RS32s.

Engines like this NEED to be preserved in order to preserve regional and small railroad history. In the past decade and ESPECIALLY the past two years many important first and second generation have gone to the torch. Including the first purpose built road switcher and many other important last surviving locomotives.

-Andrew Cornillie

So who is going to spearhead this? Give Basic Marine a call...

Hmm, last time I checked, the AT&SF had this mainline running southwest from Chicago, through Illinois, Iowa, Missouri to Kansas City, then west through Kansas. Guess my map was wrong.....

Yes but to my knowledge ATSF kept its ALCOs more West and operated them California, Texas and Kansas City at its farthest (correct me if I am wrong).

Where as in its current configuration the engine it represents not only its LS&I history BUT also too when it was used once or twice by the FRV on freights into CNW Proviso in the early 90's (I believe it was this engine, it may not have been another).

More importantly too, if the LS&I 1804 is scrapped, IRM's GB&W 2407 may be the last LS&I large Alco extent aside from the chopped nosed Eastern Tennessee engines.

It's configuration represents changes and maintenance practices of the LS&I rather the ATSF.

LS&I 1804 may represent the last original Alco bought by the LS&I (that was not second hand) that has not scrapped yes (aside from LS&I RS3s at NRE if still extent).

-Andrew Cornillie

Kansas City is in the midwest. I'm not an AT&SF expert, but I think the consolidation of Alco power out west occurred later on. For example, they operated a small fleet of RS-1s in the Chicago Terminal.

The locomotive's current configuration is actually more representative of a hulk of a formerly useful locomotive, representing how useful components such as the prime mover, electrical parts, and other components are often re-purposed to other uses on the secondary market, while the remains are consigned to the scrap line, as unfortunate as it may be.

I'm not saying it can't or even that it shouldn't even be saved. Doing so is often more difficult and takes more money, and actual work, than writing flowery prose on the internet. Looking around at places like IRM or Duluth, I see projects potentially more worthy of the cubic dollars and time effort.

Mr. Wilkins Wrote:
The locomotive's current configuration is actually more representative of a hulk of a formerly useful locomotive, representing how useful components such as the prime mover, electrical parts, and other components are often re-purposed to other uses on the secondary market, while the remains are consigned to the scrap line, as unfortunate as it may be.

I would tend to disagree

I don't know what is still on the locomotive, but it may be more valuable then you would imagine. For instance its electrical cabinet and cab may be intact. This would show what an operating locomotive of the 70's and 80's looked like. Something that might be lost with an operating locomotive that is being maintained to modern standards.

Aesthetically the engine is important, it is almost the last of its carbody design, if not the last of standard RSD 12 (the NKP RSD12 may be a dual service passenger engine right?). It also maintains its original paint. It is tarnished, but original, with an excellent patina. This is extremely important too because it shows the painting techniques used by the LS&I, and again what practices were used in the 70's and 80's. From this angle, it is almost intact, just missing a radiator shutter and some handrail sections. It could easily be preserved as is and maybe even join LS&I U25C 2501, the last remaining U25C at Marquette, Michigan. It could be used as a replacement park engine for a steam locomotive. There are many opportunities available.

Standards for preserving diesel locomotives are many times set way too high. Most preserved diesel locomotives, even when they are intact, do not operate. Those that do have often had changes made to electrical or mechanical systems that often mitigate their historic value. Restorations of do much to eliminate much historic fabric (paint, electrical components, cab details) which tell much of what a locomotive used to look like. Some are simply replicas because they have been presented in an original paint scheme which misrepresents its mechanical configuration. Point being that there are many opportunities lost because of the desire to have an operating locomotive OR it isn't cute enough.

This engine does need to be preserved and of some group were to present an offer beneficial to the owner it might be preserved. I am no allusions that will happen. The locomotive has been sitting for 20+ years with one acting who will do it know? Especially when there are organizations scrapping rare, operational, locomotives (and passenger cars, electric cars, and freight cars) in good condition, if not restored, when there is no need to.

-Andrew Cornillie

Interesting that they wanted the 16cyl 251 when another major towboat operator on the ohio/mississippi rivers is yanking several 16cyl 251 from their boats and replacing with new GE engines. These 251s are now sitting on the dock and they look like mint.
Sorry the pictures I have are on another computer that isn't feeling well at the moment.

Rich

Look, I hate to be the Nattering Nabob of Negativity around here, but let's look coldly at Brother Cornillie's spiel here. I'm not saying this is driving me to drink, but I'm now on my second cup of house-made peach mead here...

At a time when people in Greece are rioting over the fact that old folks in a "welfare state" are being forced to choose between food and electricity because of Draconian cutbacks in their state pension system brought about by extravagant promises in past years, Brother Cornillie is attempting to persuade us that we must rally with our support and dollars to preserve what, for all serious purposes, must be deemed an esoteric diesel model used by an esoteric railway--a railway that has already contributed a multitude of 2-8-0's to the rosters of steam preservation.

Lord knows, I put enough energy into chasing former Duluth, Winnipeg & Pacific RS11's on the Central Vermont--literally, by bicycling through Vermont in 1984 and altering my cycling plans to pursue those RS11's via 60-mile round trips to White River Junction and Cornish. I can still hear the chugs of those midnight passings of the CV's "Rocket" piggyback express hauled by twin RS11's. So I'm not one of those guys who thinks it's all about GP9's or un-notched noses.

But.... COME ON. Okay, maybe if it were intact and switching a paper mill in Wisconsin or something, maybe. But I am especially loath to suggest to the IRM, Lake Superior Museum of Transportation, or even the "Alco-Haulics" at Delaware-Lackawanna or Arkansas & Missouri that they take on a project such as the one proposed.

So prove me wrong. Find enough LS&I or Alco fans wiling to pledge their financial support. Find the dollars or dinars or lire or marks to tell the scrappers to "take a long hike off a short pier". I still have this very vintage bottle of Crow Sauce in the refrigerator, just begging me to use it. And my wife wants it gone. Let's see the next Pepsi Challenge vote competition, asking us to save this loco.....

What 16 cylinder 251's? The RSD12 in common with the RS11 used a 12 cyl. engine.

Reality check:

http://www.railwaymuseums.org/Static/do ... sfinal.pdf

Not my work, but it sure resonates.

Howard P.
Get Real, CT

That link is great. I've bookmarked it, and will trot it out periodically as needed, when the foam starts to get too deep.