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 Post subject: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 2:20 pm 

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2019 3:52 pm
Posts: 1
Location: Cleveland Ohio
Hello, I am a live steam builder here in Cleveland Ohio, I am building a 4-8-4 in 3/4" scale,I am looking for photo's of a 1927 built 4-8-4 to see were everything goes on both side's of the engine. Any help would be great.


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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:28 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:52 pm
Posts: 537
Location: Apple Valley, Minnesota
Whoa! Do you have plans or a photo of the locomotive you plan to build? There were as many different arrangements of where the appliances go on a steam locomotive as there were railroads that had the 4-8-4 type on their roster. Your best bet is to google "northern locomotive" or "steam locomotive" and see what you come up with.

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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:44 pm 

Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 12:36 am
Posts: 377
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
The 1930 and 1941 Locomotive Cyclopedias are good places to find details. See if you can borrow them via inter-library loan. The were reprinted about 35 years ago but I believe they have become hard to find. You might find a slightly earlier version that is out of copyright on archive.org.


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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:06 am 

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:02 pm
Posts: 1291
Location: Back in NE Ohio
squandt wrote:
Hello, I am a live steam builder here in Cleveland Ohio, I am building a 4-8-4 in 3/4" scale,I am looking for photo's of a 1927 built 4-8-4 to see were everything goes on both side's of the engine. Any help would be great.


I'm a long-time live steam enthusiast in NE Ohio, and have one question for you? Where are you going to run your engine besides your own backyard? Basically 3/4" scale is fairly dead in this region. Pretty much everything the clubs in the area run is 1.5" or 1.6" scale/7 1/2" ga. I believe NEOLS in Lester has a small 3/4" elevated loop, but I've never seen it being used. You might want to reconsider your goal. I'm not saying don't do it, but you might want to consider other factors. Yes, it's a LOT easier to put a 3/4" engine in the back of your SUV that a 7 1/2" ga loco, but you will pretty much be alone with the 3/4" engine wherever you go.


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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:17 am 

Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2013 3:55 pm
Posts: 51
PaulWWoodring wrote:
squandt wrote:
Hello, I am a live steam builder here in Cleveland Ohio, I am building a 4-8-4 in 3/4" scale,I am looking for photo's of a 1927 built 4-8-4 to see were everything goes on both side's of the engine. Any help would be great.


I'm a long-time live steam enthusiast in NE Ohio, and have one question for you? Where are you going to run your engine besides your own backyard? Basically 3/4" scale is fairly dead in this region. Pretty much everything the clubs in the area run is 1.5" or 1.6" scale/7 1/2" ga. I believe NEOLS in Lester has a small 3/4" elevated loop, but I've never seen it being used. You might want to reconsider your goal. I'm not saying don't do it, but you might want to consider other factors. Yes, it's a LOT easier to put a 3/4" engine in the back of your SUV that a 7 1/2" ga loco, but you will pretty much be alone with the 3/4" engine wherever you go.


Don't let all that discourage you. I would build what you want and make the running happen. I have mostly 1" equipment, but am gearing up to build a loco in 3/4". I'm also located in St. Louis, where there are no 3/4" tracks. I know that it will be necessary to travel to Iowa, Illinois, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, etc... just to run 3/4", and I'm OK with that. What I would like is the opportunity to visit tracks that I likely otherwise would not get to travel to (with loco) - whether it be too far away to take my 1" scale engines, but a 3/4" suitcase loco may do just the trick.

Have fun! Also - check out www.chaski.org if you haven't. Lots of good live steam info on there!


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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:04 am 

Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 12:20 pm
Posts: 181
PaulWWoodring wrote:

I'm a long-time live steam enthusiast in NE Ohio, and have one question for you? Where are you going to run your engine besides your own backyard? Basically 3/4" scale is fairly dead in this region. Pretty much everything the clubs in the area run is 1.5" or 1.6" scale/7 1/2" ga. I believe NEOLS in Lester has a small 3/4" elevated loop, but I've never seen it being used. You might want to reconsider your goal. I'm not saying don't do it, but you might want to consider other factors. Yes, it's a LOT easier to put a 3/4" engine in the back of your SUV that a 7 1/2" ga loco, but you will pretty much be alone with the 3/4" engine wherever you go.


Yes......7 - 1/2” gauge is popular in the bulk of the US. But if you want a locomotive that you can run quite literally anywhere in the world.....3 - 1/2” gauge is pretty much your only choice. If you want to run your 7 - 1/2” gauge locomotive in the Northeast, or Eastern Canada....you are out of luck. And that goes for pretty much the rest of the planet Earth, as 7 - 1/4” gauge is the standard throughout the rest of the world. Even 1” scale, while 4 -3/4” gauge is standard here in the U.S. in parts of Canada and most of the rest of the world...it is 5” gauge!

I live a five plus hour drive from the nearest club with 3 - 1/2” gauge on an elevated track. I can load my locomotive, tender, riding car, tools, firing supplies and the luggage for my wife and I and still have room for the dog in her crate in our Jeep SUV. Try that with a big 1 - 1/2” scale loco!

In Ohio I know of the Northeast Ohio Live Steamers and the Cincinnati Cinder Sniffers that have 3 - 1/2” gauge tracks. So don’t give up and build what you want and what works for you.

Keith


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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 12:41 pm 

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:02 pm
Posts: 1291
Location: Back in NE Ohio
I didn't suggest to the inquirer that he NOT build a 3/4" scale engine, just that he should be aware of his options before he commits. If he's primarily a machinist/tinkerer, who doesn't care that much about operating in a lot of different places, or operating sessions with other live steamers in my area, then fine. There are a number of people who have been in the hobby who mostly enjoy building models as opposed to operating them themselves, and we need those folks to do work those of us not as skilled can do. But if you want to "play" train, operating with other traffic, switching, hauling much in the way of passengers, you need to go bigger. A smaller locomotive in the larger scale gives an owner more options in my area as to where they can run. That is all I'm saying. As I was told about the hobby many years ago, it's a commitment to a lifestyle as well as a hobby when you have larger equipment - owning a truck, a trailer, larger place to run it, etc. It's one of the reasons this apartment dweller doesn't own any equipment. As a former full-size railroader I enjoy helping out at operating sessions and meets.


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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 1:05 pm 

Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 12:20 pm
Posts: 181
Paul,
Reading the original post....he is already building the locomotive.
“The Hobby” is different for each individual. And it has changed a lot from when it started out in the 1920’s and 1930’s. Back then it was a hobby of amateur machinists. And the tracks where you could try out your handiwork might just be a bit of back and forth. Once you had proved your work....the next project was started. And with 3/4” scale you could have a small South Bend lathe and a drill press in a spare bed room or basement. Many locomotives were built with just that for machinery.

I too am a retired full sized railroader. Having been an engineer on the Lehigh Valley Railroad and Conrail, where I also was a Road Foreman of Engines.....I have had my fill of switching, working with timetable / Train Order business. Now I enjoy working in my shop, and in particular working on classic live steam models built in the past Golden Age of the hobby. Bringing older models back to life works for me.

Keith


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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:42 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2004 10:50 pm
Posts: 505
Squandt,

I'm on the east side of Cleveland and among other things am currently restoring a 1" D&RGW 4-8-4. Shoot me a PM when you have a minute. There is 3/4" scale - 3-1/2" gauge track at NEOLS in Medina (elevated track, more than 1,000' in length), LSLS in Kirtland (660' ground track, multi-gauge, in the shade) and also the Cincinnati Cinder Sniffers just across the state line in Indiana. Would love to chat and help you in your quest to build a 3/4" 4-8-4. Locomotive Cyclopedias are a great place to start to get good scale drawings on complete locomotives as well as every possible accessory and component you may encounter.

Do you have a specific prototype locomotive you are striving to model?

There is also another great online resource at www.chaski.com where a lot of live steam builders share suggestions, ideas and their own progress on their various projects. There is a lot of activity in 3/4" scale these days and it seems to be enjoying a bit of a renaissance of sorts.

Rob Gardner
ASR VP and 2100 Project Manager


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 Post subject: Re: 1927 Northern 4-8-4 pictures
PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 7:29 am 

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 pm
Posts: 2386
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Carillon Park in Dayton, Ohio, has a 3.5 inch gauge track.

Other tracks:
St. Croix Live Steamers, Hudson, WI
Golden Gate Live Steamers, near Berkeley, CA
Los Angeles Live Steamers
New Jersey Live Steamers
Chesapeake and Allegheny in Baltimore
Pioneer Valley near Springfield, MA
Long Island Live Steamers
Pennsylvania Live Steamers
There are more.

The best track in the US is Waushakum Live Steamers, west of Boston. They have something like a mile of elevated, high quality 3.5 inch track.

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Lektor
Danmarks Tekniske Universitet


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