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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:44 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
Posts: 5934
Location: southeastern USA
Antifoam: double headers work best when both locomotives have similar operating characteristics. Would you run a Y and J on the same excursion? One would either hold the other back or shove the other slowly forward. Foam rationally, people, if such things are possible.

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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:09 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2004 7:52 am
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Location: Strasburg, PA
OK. #1309 and #614. Where do I show up to take photos without buying a ticket?

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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:28 pm 

Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 3:07 pm
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Location: B'more Maryland
Kelly Anderson wrote:
OK. #1309 and #614. Where do I show up to take photos without buying a ticket?


I'll send you my Bitcoin address. Tickets are 1BTC.

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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:33 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:25 pm
Posts: 1973
Kelly Anderson wrote:
OK. #1309 and #614. Where do I show up to take photos without buying a ticket?


Like button - Thumbs up - Smiley face


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 3:38 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 3725
Location: Inwood, W.Va.
Dave wrote:
Antifoam: double headers work best when both locomotives have similar operating characteristics. Would you run a Y and J on the same excursion? One would either hold the other back or shove the other slowly forward. Foam rationally, people, if such things are possible.


Just out of curiosity, how would this have worked out for a Y6 and an A? That combination was done regularly on coal trains east of Roanoke, and incorporated a second Y on the famous pusher grade up from Boaz, Va.

Of course, I would not suggest that for an excursion!! Talk about overkill in tractive effort for a passenger train!


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 6:37 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
Posts: 5934
Location: southeastern USA
Coal drags don;t have the option of speeding at passenger speeds up grades, so it is that rather than a power mismatch that was the issue. Now, suppose the Y stayed coupled on after doing its pushing job...... and the A tried to pull it along with the train at high speed. Rods would be flying off into the brush.

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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 9:25 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:47 pm
Posts: 638
Location: Philadelphia, PA
On the level, when you're doubleheading for more horsepower, yes, it makes sense, but on a ruling grade, the low wheeled engine supplies the tractive effort while the high wheeled road engine contributes what it can. Think of PRR with 2 K4's on a heavy express train racing from Crestline to Chicago, then think of ATSF on Raton with an old 2-10-2 leading a modern 4-8-4 on a passenger train.

Phil Mulligan


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:27 am 

Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 3725
Location: Inwood, W.Va.
Speaking of doubleheading N&W Ys and As--should have had this up earlier, a classic in my view, a short video of operations near Blue Ridge, Va. Just something cool to watch and enjoy--

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zV8rA3UE-lc


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:29 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:58 pm
Posts: 1006
bigjim4life wrote:
Also see NKP 765's short moves over CSX to access Cuyahoga Valley's line in Ohio the last few times the locomotive visited. I'd say change is in the air...
Big difference. 765 has a long proven track record of reliability, and proven crews. Taking a large steamer, fresh from restoration, unproven. is not likely to be on CSX trackage. It wasn't but a few years ago they wouldn't let 734 on their tracks for 10 miles.


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:21 pm 

Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2015 7:28 pm
Posts: 528
Location: Northern WV
Was 765's short moves over CSX under steam or was it dead-in-tow? I don't see where the big problem would be towing a roller-bearing steam engine by diesel power. It would have to be a special move much like a high/wide load.

On a different note, I was rummaging through some old slides and this one was taken in 1979. Who knew then what would happen to that engine over 40 years later.


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:55 pm 

Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2016 10:17 pm
Posts: 120
The last thing CSX wants to do is have to call a crew, take the time etc to move a steamer. I think often the "no roller bearing/no steam" etc is just an easy way for them to not have to deal with it.


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:06 pm 

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:30 pm
Posts: 803
Location: Bucks County, PA
WVNorthern wrote:
Was 765's short moves over CSX under steam or was it dead-in-tow? I don't see where the big problem would be towing a roller-bearing steam engine by diesel power. It would have to be a special move much like a high/wide load.


Under steam, during their ferry moves. Maybe without diesel (maybe with, I don't remember).

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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:32 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 5:58 pm
Posts: 1006
It might not be a big deal...at least to you and me. BUT, look at it from the RR's view. People hear about a Steam Locomotive being moved, hot or not. And out come the foamers. Just picture (and we've all seen it) the idiot with he camera standing on or just too close tot he track, and they get hit/killed. In our sue crazy society, the RRs just don't need the hassle. Some have been very gracious over the years, others have not. And depending on who is in the board room, this changes.


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:48 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm
Posts: 1372
Howard P. wrote:
The WMSR crew is still putting the finishing touches on 1309, and some of you are already speculating about where else it could/will/should operate? Let's all sit back and let them do their thing with 1309, and get their railroad in order.
Howard P.

Plus, "You Got to Dance with Them What Brung You". I doubt the region in which WMSR operates, which has contributed to 1309's restoration, and now is being asked for money for track, would be thrilled to see it attracting visitors in other regions. Part of the appeal of having this articulated steamer is that it is unique (in the east anyway), having 1309 attracts attention to a not so prosperous region in a way the other destinations mentioned won't be able to. Sending it around like the Gramlings do with their engines would take away that proprietary draw for the hotels, restaurants and other accommodations around western Maryland.


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 Post subject: Re: 1309 - All dressed up and nowhere to go
PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:00 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 pm
Posts: 901
PMC wrote:
Howard P. wrote:
The WMSR crew is still putting the finishing touches on 1309, and some of you are already speculating about where else it could/will/should operate? Let's all sit back and let them do their thing with 1309, and get their railroad in order.
Howard P.

Plus, "You Got to Dance with Them What Brung You". I doubt the region in which WMSR operates, which has contributed to 1309's restoration, and now is being asked for money for track, would be thrilled to see it attracting visitors in other regions. Part of the appeal of having this articulated steamer is that it is unique (in the east anyway), having 1309 attracts attention to a not so prosperous region in a way the other destinations mentioned won't be able to. Sending it around like the Gramlings do with their engines would take away that proprietary draw for the hotels, restaurants and other accommodations around western Maryland.


Are we expecting the 1309 to be a draw to the non-railfan crowd? That’s a serious question. It will be a draw for me but so is the Inyo and the Glenbrook out in Nevada so I’m not going to use my own judgement.


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