Reading & Northern 2102 Comes Up Lame

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Sun Oct 09, 2022 9:33 pm

Repost from the Reading & Northern's Passenger Facebook page:

Quote:

Friends, rail enthusiasts, and RBMN fans,
On Saturday (10-8-22), we had the perfect conditions for a Fall Foliage ramble. The weather was beautiful, the leaves were stunning and vibrant, and the energy of the RBMN staff was bolstered by our wonderful Passengers.
What could possibly go wrong?
Unfortunately, as many of you know, our newly restored 2102 steam engine suffered a minor problem at a critical area. This effectively shut down the locomotive and prevented further operation for the trip. The part in question is called a “firing table” made of a metal alloy dedicated to resist extremely hot temperatures and it crumbled. Think of this as a nail coming out of a horseshoe. It is a simple fix, but the horse would still be unable to run.
At RBMN, we try to predict every potential point of failure that would negatively impact our customers’ experiences. For example, we actually installed a brand-new firing table prior to this trip!
Needless to say, I was just as shocked and disappointed as all of you. We responded to this one-in-a-million chance breakdown of the 2102 immediately. It was taken to our shop the day of the incident and we are hard at work to get our flagship engine back in service.
Our top priority is the goal of running 2102 still well within Fall Foliage season (prior to Oct. 30th)!
If you haven’t subscribed to our social media channels or navigated to our websites for updates, we strongly encourage you to do so; links are below.
My sincerest gratitude to everyone who has and continues to support Reading Blue Mountain and Northern and your patience as we navigate through this unprecedented and unforeseen event.
Our Passenger Department can’t wait to see you back aboard an even MORE powerful and awe-inspiring 2102 experience to come!
Lastly, the passenger department will be contacting everyone who rode the October 8th trip over the next few days.
Andy Muller Jr., CEO

I have steam loco textbooks in three different variations of English, including one by the Reading RR, and I've never heard the term "firing table." And an Internet search proved fruitless. What the hell are we talking about here, a fusible plug, a grate, or a crownsheet?

NYCRRson · **Joined:** Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:25 pm **Posts:** 488

I have never heard of a "firing table" with regard to a RR steam Loco ?

Seems like a problem with the grates (or maybe the stoker) ?

If the grates are stuck "open" I could understand the difficulty of keeping a coal fire burning and making steam.

If a stoker is OOS then one could perhaps complete the trip with a lot of human effort ?

Sounds like some "cover up" language to gloss over the real difficulty ?

Hope they figure out the difficulties with their "firing table" whatever the heck it is...

BM765 · **Joined:** Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:06 pm **Posts:** 127

The firing table is the cast iron coal distribution table of the stoker. Basically the area where the coal rises via the auger behind the fire door to be distributed by the stoker jets can be described as the firing table. Multiple replacements in a short time span seems odd though so maybe they are actually talking about grate fingers?

filmteknik · **Posted:** Sun Oct 09, 2022 10:08 pm

Quote:

I have steam loco textbooks in three different variations of English, including one by the Reading RR, and I've never heard the term "firing table." And an Internet search proved fruitless. What the hell are we talking about here, a fusible plug, a grate, or a crownsheet?

While not a term I am familiar with, I immediately took it to mean what is often called the distribution plate part of the stoker.

I don't know how you conducted your internet search but I found a number of places which confirmed my theory.

One site, reproducing old literature said this: At the forward end is the distributor. This comprises a vertical cylindrical housing carrying a vertical lifting screw. The coal thus raised overflows, or spills, on to the protecting grate, or, as it is called, the firing-table - a flat cast-iron surface, whence it is blown into the furnace, where required, by the steam-jets.

And Wes Camp, whom I would consider an expert, used the term on TO.

https://www.trainorders.com/discussion/ ... sg-5474849

If that was the issue then I wonder why they didn't try hand firing.

EJ Berry · **Posted:** Sun Oct 09, 2022 10:19 pm

It is indeed part of the stoker:

http://www.multipowerinternational.com/stoker.html

http://www.multipowerinternational.com/spec/table.pdf

Description: The type HT-1 firing table is a replacement part for locomotives equipped with Standard Stoker type HT-1 stokers. Its design is similar to the original HT-1 stoker table. It is made out of cast iron.

Phil Mulligan

J3a-614 · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2022 12:49 am

I'm familiar with what a firing table is and what it does; it's sort of visible in some videos of the coal coming up from the stoker, landing on the table, and the jets blowing the coal around from the table onto the fire. I understand it's a consumable item, subject to erosion from the coal and steam jets, and of course also stressed by the high temperatures of the firebox.

What puzzles me is how a brand new firing table could fail ("crumbled" according to this press release) this quickly. Considering that it may be of cast iron suggests there were flaws in the casting.

https://www.railarchive.net/firing/index.html

This video has what might be the most visible view of a firing table in use with a stoker that I can find; it's just after 6:15. It looks like it might be the same or similar to the HT-1 table illustration provided by EJ Berry above.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Irn2mVjZjro

Boilermaker · **Joined:** Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:47 pm **Posts:** 216

Believe it or not, it is possible for even new castings to have undiscovered internal flaws/defects that are difficult to find short of having an x-ray of the casting done.

At the end of the day "shit happens" and the R&N passenger dept (at least as I see it) is doing a good job handling the situation, even reaching out individually to everyone who rode that day. My congratulations to them on a first class operation.

Pat Fahey · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2022 9:00 am

Hi All
For those that posted and were not sure what and HT-1 Firing Table looks like, I found a diagram on the internet showing the table. Pat.

Attachment:

File comment: From the internet .

Stoker HT-1 diagram.jpg # 2.jpg [ 82.91 KiB | Viewed 4451 times ]

Frisco1522 · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2022 9:16 am

OK, I will attempt to post this again.
My post, asking what is wrong with some of you?
Andy Muller has put together a great railroad with two excellent locomotives and freely runs excursions.
Then, the 2102 goes OOS, and immediately the boo birds start questioning.
He wrote a fine description of the problem, which some of you didn't understand so the snotty posts begin. Asking if it is some sort of doublespeak to cover up the "real" problem?
How many of you have bought tickets or supported the RR in any way?
I would love to be able to visit BM&R for a steam fix.
Mr. Muller deserves more respect than what some of you have given.
I'm familiar with the Monday Morning Quarterbacks who come out of the woodwork from my 1522 days.
Give the sniping a rest please.

BM765 · **Joined:** Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:06 pm **Posts:** 127

Frisco1522 wrote:

OK, I will attempt to post this again.
My post, asking what is wrong with some of you?
Andy Muller has put together a great railroad with two excellent locomotives and freely runs excursions.
Then, the 2102 goes OOS, and immediately the boo birds start questioning.
He wrote a fine description of the problem, which some of you didn't understand so the snotty posts begin. Asking if it is some sort of doublespeak to cover up the "real" problem?
How many of you have bought tickets or supported the RR in any way?
I would love to be able to visit BM&R for a steam fix.
Mr. Muller deserves more respect than what some of you have given.
I'm familiar with the Monday Morning Quarterbacks who come out of the woodwork from my 1522 days.
Give the sniping a rest please.

Absolutely right! It seems a little odd that a firing table would require two replacements in short succession, but I certainly don't suspect any cover up. It would be easy enough to just leave it at "mechanical issues." The transparency of the railroad should be commended. I also understand that a portion of the ticket prices are being refunded and the railroad is reaching out to all ticket holders individually. Any lesser organization would simply point to the fine print "May substitute motive power as required."

I'm still very impressed by this restoration. Mechanical issues will always creep up, but for all intents and purposes 2102 has been running like a Swiss watch ever since the first break in run. Hats off to the R&N steam team.

Mouse · **Joined:** Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:10 am **Posts:** 41

BM765 wrote:

Frisco1522 wrote:

OK, I will attempt to post this again.
My post, asking what is wrong with some of you?
Andy Muller has put together a great railroad with two excellent locomotives and freely runs excursions.
Then, the 2102 goes OOS, and immediately the boo birds start questioning.
He wrote a fine description of the problem, which some of you didn't understand so the snotty posts begin. Asking if it is some sort of doublespeak to cover up the "real" problem?
How many of you have bought tickets or supported the RR in any way?
I would love to be able to visit BM&R for a steam fix.
Mr. Muller deserves more respect than what some of you have given.
I'm familiar with the Monday Morning Quarterbacks who come out of the woodwork from my 1522 days.
Give the sniping a rest please.

Absolutely right! It seems a little odd that a firing table would require two replacements in short succession, but I certainly don't suspect any cover up. It would be easy enough to just leave it at "mechanical issues." The transparency of the railroad should be commended. I also understand that a portion of the ticket prices are being refunded and the railroad is reaching out to all ticket holders individually. Any lesser organization would simply point to the fine print "May substitute motive power as required."

I'm still very impressed by this restoration. Mechanical issues will always creep up, but for all intents and purposes 2102 has been running like a Swiss watch ever since the first break in run. Hats off to the R&N steam team.

Pat Fahey · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2022 10:18 am

Hi All
My friends and I are looking forward to riding behind the Reading 2102 at the end of this month. Yes the locomotive had a small problem, which will be over come by the Reading & Northern.
The locomotive has ran without any problems since her break in runs this year, yes it is a little set back for the railroad.
The shop crew of the railroad will have the locomotive up and running again, in a matter of time. A CONGRATULATIONS for the shop crew, on the job they did, just to get her running for all of us to enjoy.
All I can say my friends and I are looking forward riding behind her at the end of October, along with Riding the Western Maryland # 1309. Pat.

co614 · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2022 12:50 pm

Yes, over time a firing table can need replacing as it is subject to the extreme temperature swings in the firebox and other stresses.

Just a piece of bad luck that the one that failed Saturday was evidently cast using the wrong metal. I'm 100% sure the next one will be cast using the correct metal and will last a long while.

Things like this happen with machines as complex as the 2102. Mr. Muller explained it well and he and his crew deserve all of our support and gratitude for all they do to keep the steam flame burning brightly.

Ross Rowland

Alexander D. Mitchell IV · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2022 3:28 pm

filmteknik wrote:

If that was the issue then I wonder why they didn't try hand firing.

You first.

co614 · **Posted:** Mon Oct 10, 2022 4:14 pm

Hand firing a large locomotive like the 2102 is not physically possible when the engine is pulling a high tonnage train like it was on 10/8. When under full load ( wide open throttle, long cut off, booster engaged, sanders on full, rail washer full open ) as it would have been in both directions, this engine can burn up to 5 tons of coal per hour to keep up a full head of steam.

No human being can shovel that amount of coal and even if you were to carry 3 men so they could relieve each other frequently they couldn't manually feed that amount of coal through the fire door.

I'm sure the foundry will learn from the failure of the firing table and cast the next one with the proper metal.

Ross Rowland

Reading & Northern 2102 Comes Up Lame

Who is online