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 Post subject: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2004 8:25 pm 

In the thread below about Frank Hicks' passenger equipment, Keith Muldowney mentions a couple of cars once owned by Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc., of Baltimore, MD.

As I recall, this was a volunteer group but I don't know if they were "non profit" or "for profit". I remember many years ago they had a small fleet of cars and their principal business was leasing coaches to the B&O for service on the Baltimore - Washington commuter trains. Much of the equipment was disposed of after the state of Maryland took over that service.

Does anybody have roster and disposition information for Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.? I did know one of the principals and I recall many years ago our live steam club held a meeting aboard one of the cars parked at Camden Station in Baltimore. But time goes by and I've really lost track of the people and the equipment.

Steve Zuiderveen - do you know the story?

Alan Maples

AMaples@aol.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2004 9:48 pm 

> Does anybody have roster and disposition
> information for Railroad Passenger Cars,
> Inc.? I did know one of the principals and I
> recall many years ago our live steam club
> held a meeting aboard one of the cars parked
> at Camden Station in Baltimore. But time
> goes by and I've really lost track of the
> people and the equipment.

RRP, as it was called, dissolved a couple of years ago, donating its remaining assets to the B&O Museum. The dissolved because of aging membership and the rapid decline of places to operate what few cars they had left. By the time they dissolved, they were down to B&O coach 3587 (out of service), 2066 (parlor/lounge, then in the middle of a repair at Delaware Car Co. for lease to the Black River & Western), and 3302 (obs/buffet/lounge, former 1923 Pullman coach 5234, out of service). A list (probably incomplete) of other cars includes the following B&O coaches: 3501 (68-seat coach), and 3502-3509, all 60-seat B&O built between 1924-30. My roster also shows B&O 1949 diner 1091 Pittsburgh, which I believe was cut up as a totally hopeless derelict in Locust Point, Baltimore in the 1990s, and 3004, a 38-seat snack bar coach built in 1930 by Pullman and modernized by the B&O in 1948. I *believe* the 3509 was renumbered at one point to the 3589, but I don't trust my memory.



LNER4472-NOSPAM-@bcpl.net


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Thu Jan 01, 2004 10:19 pm 

> In the thread below about Frank Hicks'
> passenger equipment,

You meant to say Jim Hicks, I believe. He's not related to Frank or me.


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 12:08 am 

> You meant to say Jim Hicks, I believe. He's
> not related to Frank or me.

Yes. I apologize for the error.

AMaples@aol.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc. *PIC*
PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 12:34 am 

> RRP, as it was called, dissolved a couple of
> years ago, donating its remaining assets to
> the B&O Museum. The dissolved because of
> aging membership and the rapid decline of
> places to operate what few cars they had
> left. By the time they dissolved, they were
> down to B&O coach 3587 (out of service),
> 2066 (parlor/lounge, then in the middle of a
> repair at Delaware Car Co. for lease to the
> Black River & Western), and 3302
> (obs/buffet/lounge, former 1923 Pullman
> coach 5234, out of service). A list
> (probably incomplete) of other cars includes
> the following B&O coaches: 3501 (68-seat
> coach), and 3502-3509, all 60-seat B&O
> built between 1924-30. My roster also shows
> B&O 1949 diner 1091 Pittsburgh, which I
> believe was cut up as a totally hopeless
> derelict in Locust Point, Baltimore in the
> 1990s, and 3004, a 38-seat snack bar coach
> built in 1930 by Pullman and modernized by
> the B&O in 1948. I *believe* the 3509
> was renumbered at one point to the 3589, but
> I don't trust my memory.

Alan, will do what I can using Sandy's start.

RRP was originaly for-profit, but changed its charter to not-for-profit before the end. What equipment assets it had at the end went to the B&O Railroad Museum as not-for-profit "next of kin".

The hw (3587)coach is at the B&O Museum, inoperable; the lightweight coach was beyond salvation, and was cut up by United Iron, and I purchased the trucks from the Museum and have them stored in Cumberland
The LW diner (1091)was also beyond hope and cut up. The HW obs/lounge (3302)had been on lease to the Entertrainment in Union Bridge, been derailed , and was siting on one of its own trucks and the truck of the MW diner that was formerly the Riverside Wrecker. DLW Car Co purchased the Riverside Diner, and donated it to the B&O Museum, so that the obs wouldn't loose its truck in the bankruptcy auction of Entertrainment, but the truck has not been repaired and swapped back yet.

The lounge car built of a prewar ACL coach was stuck at BR&W over lack-of-money but was eventually returned to the B&O Museum, where it is in operable condition. Was once Amtrak legal, but is now out of inspection.

I do not know the complete list of RRP equipment formerly on lease to Maryland State Railroad Administration (now MARC) but two of the cars were ex B&M, ex Wabash Bird series coaches, one of which is now owned and operated by Southwind Rail Transportation (Mike Kelly). I think another one of these is now at Roanoke Chapter.

In the photo below are from left to right, RRP 8304 (es DLW via LIRR)as Chessie Steam Special 15; RRP 6600 as CSS 16 (The Chickadee now owned by Mike Kelly, see above); the High Iron Parlor Car built out of a NYC 2900 coach, presently at Morristown and Erie; and the Independence, Ross Rowland's office car. Photo is from George Elwood's site.

Steve

Image
SZuidervee@aol.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 7:08 am 

Steve,

Thanks for the information.

I was one of the original group that owned the "EnterTrainment Line" (not the subsequent owners who went bankrupt). I seem to recall that our coach #80(?), which was purchased from the Maryland Midland, was an ex-RRP car. I may be making that up; I don't have any records on it. The coach was a smooth-side lightweight with 80 seats and large windows. I think it was later gutted for another table car and may now be owned by Ken Bitten.

The 3302 was a nice car and I'm sorry to hear it was damaged in a derailment.

Alan

AMaples@aol.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 12:16 pm 

> The 3302 was a nice car and I'm sorry to
> hear it was damaged in a derailment.

As I recall (having been involved at the time in helping to transport it for repairs), the damage was purely superficial in the grand scheme of things, not major frame-twisting, glass-breaking damage. It was confined to damage to the truck and a bit of under-rigging--the kind that, if it were an automobile, you couldn't really see but costs mucho doleros to set the alignment and steering rack straight. I remember working to get some springs out of a six-wheel truck frame that was destined to be used for replacement on 3302.


LNER4472-NOSPAM-@bcpl.net


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 8:37 pm 

Weren't a couple of those cars used in the Camden Station scene in Barry Levinson's movie "The Diner"?

pww57@hotmail.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:12 pm 

Joined: Sun Oct 08, 2017 10:34 am
Posts: 22
Normally I wouldn't breath life back into a 16 year old post, but it I am looking for the disposition of some equipment...

The thread says everything from RRP went to the B&O Museum when it closed down. But cars were disposed of before the final closeout.
I am looking for the DL&W Coaches that RRP saved from the LIRR scrap line.

Sources tell me that 7 were saved. I can account for 5, but would like to know what happened to the other two.

Current disposition:
DL&W Coach 315 => Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc. 8300 => Medina Railway Museum
DL&W Coach 317 => Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc. 8301 => Medina Railway Museum
DL&W Coach 318 => Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc. 8302 => EL 1318
DL&W Coach 314 => Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc. 8303 => ??
DL&W Coach 325 => Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc. 8304 => Austin Steam Train “Buckeye Lake”
DL&W Coach 311 => Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc. 8305 => GSMR 37 “Nantahela”
DL&W Coach 323 => Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc. 8306? => ??


According to this other 16 year old post;
"Looking for Jim Hick's Passenger Equipment" http://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7990

"Also note from roster that 3 cars belonging to the Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc were ex-Long Island, ex-EL, original Lackawanna coaches #315,#317 & #325."

From what I have seen ...
315 went through OMID and COE Rail
317 went through at least COE Rail
325 went directly to Austin
318 went through OMID and the support fleet for Cotton Belt 819
311 went through Maryland Midland and EnterTrainment

I'd like to find out what happened to DLW 314/RRP 8302 and DLW 323/RRP 8306(?). I know they made it out of the Corona/LIC Scrap Line.

Thanks in advance!


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 2:51 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 4:49 pm
Posts: 429
The 318 was owned by Peter Smykla who was affiliated with the Cotton Belt 819 group. At some point it was sold to a party that was affiliated with the EL Dining Car Preservation Society. When that didn't work out, they sold the car to Lance Erickson, a big DL&W fan. The car has been repainted into DLW colors and is stored at Bob Moen's place in Charles City, IA.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:00 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 4:49 pm
Posts: 429
One of the ACF built coaches was stored in Sayre, PA back in 2012, at the old LV shops there. It had moved there within recent years, but I looked everywhere and could not find any evidence of a number, other than what looked like either 263 or 363, which doesn't jive with any former numbers I have for that car. This car was wide open, so I got some pictures. It had no vandalism whatsoever and was completely intact. The body was a bit rough but very restorable. I heard recently that the car was scrapped, sadly, but I consider that to be unconfirmed.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 3:00 pm 

Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 4:18 pm
Posts: 496
Location: Illinois
At the risk of going off-topic, a question:
Shortly after EL sold off these cars, they bought (via the state of New Jersey) used (and older) passenger equipment from the Santa Fe for commuter operations in New Jersey. Why didn't they just keep their ACF 300-series cars for commuter service?

Also, a view of the 325 today, with interesting polka dot upholstery:

https://www.austinsteamtrain.org/the-tr ... keye-lake/


Chris.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:49 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2014 3:15 pm
Posts: 282
Topfuel wrote:
The 318 was owned by Peter Smykla who was affiliated with the Cotton Belt 819 group. At some point it was sold to a party that was affiliated with the EL Dining Car Preservation Society. When that didn't work out, they sold the car to Lance Erickson, a big DL&W fan. The car has been repainted into DLW colors and is stored at Bob Moen's place in Charles City, IA.


Are there any pictures of this car? I haven’t found any online.

Same with pictures of 310, the car in Sayre.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:14 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 17, 2015 5:55 pm
Posts: 1209
Steamguy73 wrote:
Topfuel wrote:
The 318 was owned by Peter Smykla who was affiliated with the Cotton Belt 819 group. At some point it was sold to a party that was affiliated with the EL Dining Car Preservation Society. When that didn't work out, they sold the car to Lance Erickson, a big DL&W fan. The car has been repainted into DLW colors and is stored at Bob Moen's place in Charles City, IA.


Are there any pictures of this car? I haven’t found any online.

Same with pictures of 310, the car in Sayre.

Lance Erikson (owner) photo, from the Lackawanna Cutoff Historical Committee closed group:


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Last edited by PMC on Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Railroad Passenger Cars, Inc.
PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:32 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2014 3:15 pm
Posts: 282
That’s a beautiful car. Shame it didn’t work out with the ELDCPS. Would’ve looked amazing running with their other cars. But happy to see it’s in amazing condition.


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