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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:40 pm 

I dont recall seeing one when i was there last april.


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:43 pm 

Not trying to change subject but I have a question for mark. Are their any plans for K&T 2-8-2 #10 at TVRM IIRC it was undergoing restoration long time ago before 630 entered the picture.


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:58 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:34 am
Posts: 371
Hilman Rollers, Airfloats, Jacks, Hydraulic Trailers, and Mobile Cranes are a few of the tools that could be used to extract the 1401. Obviously, there is much engineering to do but it will be a fun project :-)

I seem to remember reading in a Southern Railway Ties Magazine that the 1401 only received a cosmetic restoration (i.e., paint) prior to her placement in the museum. So I've always wondered what kind of mechanical shape she is really in.

The passing of Bob Soule and the NS 21st Century Steam Program caused a major shift in TVRM's steam priorities. 630, 4501, and 610 should all be under steam by 2014. Where does that leave the 5288? Probably on display at Grand Junction Station for an indefinite period. She is a fine horse that deserves to run at track speed but we'll need to see where we are in 2014.

Work on the K&T 10 was started in 1973 by the late Paul Brock. Paul was then sidelined by his headaches so work stalled. When 630 arrived on the scene in 1977, the K&T 10 was backburnered where it remains today. She was evaluated in 2000 during our process to select the next locomotive to rebuild. I would love to see the K&T 10 back on her home rails in Kentucky but not without a locomotive to take her place at TVRM.

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Last edited by gmray on Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 8:53 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:25 pm
Posts: 1808
Quote:
I seem to remember reading in a Southern Railway Ties Magazine that the 1401 only received a cosmetic restoration (i.e., paint) prior to her placement in the museum.


SR 1401 was repainted by a local auto body shop crew working in the SR yard in Alexandria, VA before being moved to the Smithsonian. Our painting contractor at NCTM in the 1990s worked on the SR 1401 paint job and showed us a picture of the paint crew with the engine. He was new on the job at the time he painted SR 1401 and proud of the fact that his career had come full circle.

When SI staffed moved the engine back a few feet for the new exhibit they reported she rolled just fine after they cleaned out the dirt from the girder rail in the floor. I like the new exhibit but miss hearing the recording of SR 1401's whistle made on a fan trip with SR 4501 out of Alexandria, VA. Someone posted here that Paul Merriman just went and got whistle off SR 1401 himself(?).

Wesley


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:33 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:34 am
Posts: 371
The story of Paul H. Merriman (PHM) removing the whistle from the 1401 is quite a tale. Sometimes I wonder if PHM actually embellished it some when he told the story. According to PHM, an agreement had been reached to use the 1401's whistle on 4501 to make the recording. However, on the day that PHM went to remove the whistle, he just casually walked into the Museum of American History with his pipe wrench without notifying anyone that he was there. Naturally when visitors noticed this individual up on the locomotive removing the whistle, it caused quiet a commotion. Security was soon as on the scene. After some tense moments, "officials" (I presume Jack White at that time) appeared and the situation was resolved. The whistle was removed and the rest is history.

I wonder how many people have a copy of the 45 rpm record of the 1401's whistle but can't play it anymore? I do.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:01 am 

Joined: Fri May 04, 2012 12:20 pm
Posts: 120
gmray wrote:
I wonder how many people have a copy of the 45 rpm record of the 1401's whistle but can't play it anymore? I do.

I have a recording that is the size of a 45....but it is a 33-1/3 rpm recording, and I still do have a turntable.
This record was purchased at the Smithsonian.

Keith


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 9:04 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:28 am
Posts: 2438
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
gmray wrote:
The story of Paul H. Merriman (PHM) removing the whistle from the 1401 is quite a tale. Sometimes I wonder if PHM actually embellished it some when he told the story. According to PHM, an agreement had been reached to use the 1401's whistle on 4501 to make the recording. However, on the day that PHM went to remove the whistle, he just casually walked into the Museum of American History with his pipe wrench without notifying anyone that he was there. Naturally when visitors noticed this individual up on the locomotive removing the whistle, it caused quiet a commotion. Security was soon as on the scene. After some tense moments, "officials" (I presume Jack White at that time) appeared and the situation was resolved. The whistle was removed and the rest is history.

I wonder how many people have a copy of the 45 rpm record of the 1401's whistle but can't play it anymore? I do.


Try walking into NMAH today with a pipe wrench and see how far you get.

Wasn't the recording made during 4051's first season back on the Southern? I have that record as well, but am without a turntable.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:34 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:28 am
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Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Actually, this thread brings another issue to mind. Have they cleared the area around the outside of NMAH where you can see the 1401 from the outside? I remember on several visits to Washington that the view of the locomotive from the outside of the museum was obscured by a fence, and other equipment. I always thought that view looked stunning at night, being able to see the whole locomotive through the window.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 12:03 pm 
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Posts: 1903
Location: Pac NW, via North Florida
Does anyone know the real mechanical condition of 1401? Sure, she looks great, but that's not a guarantee that she'd run in any case. Just wondering, even though it's a moot point as there's really no reason to believe a fire will ever be in that firebox again.
gmray wrote:
I wonder how many people have a copy of the 45 rpm record of the 1401's whistle but can't play it anymore? I do.
My folks bought a copy of it in 1970 and I think I listened to it only 1-2 times as a kid. I'm sure they still have it.
Up until today, I had no idea this was 1401's whistle mounted on 4501 on that record. It makes so much sense now, but many years ago, my folks had assumed the recording was made on a trip under steam. I realized only a few years ago that 1401 was pulled out of a line of cold engines and no trips were made under steam before she was placed in the building.

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 12:32 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 9:42 pm
Posts: 2431
I remember that recording being played in the museum. Apparently it was pretty realistic too. As a young boy, I was admiring the engine and studying the valve gear, standing quite close. The recording started to play and a lady said "Look out, I think it's going to move!" (As far a I could tell she was serious). I got a good laugh out of that one.

Even at that age I knew enough about steam to know it was stone cold and not going anywhere. I also knew enough about the museum to figure out that if they were doing the Franklin Institute "move it back and forth with an electric motor" gig, they'd also have a fence to keep from squishing the occasional visitor who got in the way.


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 12:43 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
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Bobharbison wrote:
I remember that recording being played in the museum. Apparently it was pretty realistic too. As a young boy, I was admiring the engine and studying the valve gear, standing quite close. The recording started to play and a lady said "Look out, I think it's going to move!" (As far a I could tell she was serious). I got a good laugh out of that one.

Even at that age I knew enough about steam to know it was stone cold and not going anywhere. I also knew enough about the museum to figure out that if they were doing the Franklin Institute "move it back and forth with an electric motor" gig, they'd also have a fence to keep from squishing the occasional visitor who got in the way.


Bob -

As I recall on my visit many years ago, there was a wig-wag set up next to the locomotive and it activated before the sound. Also, I thought I remember reading somewhere, that they used a recording of Porter #4 from St. Elizabeth's Hospital for the locomotive sound effects. Apparently, from what I have been reading here, that was not correct.

Les


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 1:00 pm 
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Bobharbison wrote:
I remember that recording being played in the museum. Apparently it was pretty realistic too.
I was a baby the first time I was in the same room as 1401 and didn't get back until I was 19. They'd quit playing the recording long before my second visit.
My Mom has told the story plenty of times that the recording was VERY loud and that you couldn't handle being in the same room when it was playing, it was that loud. She says I started crying as soon as we walked in there from the noise, so she took me to a more quiet part of the museum while Dad and my brother looked 1401 over.
I can't get too mad at her for taking me out of there. I was just a baby at the time, and both my parents more than made up for it by indulging me in my interest in trains for many years, taking me to all kinds of train-related places until I was old enough to drive myself...

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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 4:54 pm 

Hey mark, what does #10 still need? IIRC firebox patches and running gear work. #1401 looks fantastic though!


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:07 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 4996
p51 wrote:
Bobharbison wrote:
I remember that recording being played in the museum. Apparently it was pretty realistic too.
I was a baby the first time I was in the same room as 1401 and didn't get back until I was 19. They'd quit playing the recording long before my second visit.
My Mom has told the story plenty of times that the recording was VERY loud and that you couldn't handle being in the same room when it was playing, it was that loud. She says I started crying as soon as we walked in there from the noise, so she took me to a more quiet part of the museum while Dad and my brother looked 1401 over.
I can't get too mad at her for taking me out of there. I was just a baby at the time, and both my parents more than made up for it by indulging me in my interest in trains for many years, taking me to all kinds of train-related places until I was old enough to drive myself...


Lee -

You are right about that. It was EXTREMELY loud! As I recall (maybe someone can confirm this), the recording was of a locomotive approaching from a distance and then stopping right in front of the recording point as if at a station platform. And then after a short interval, it started up and moved off into the distance. I don't remember any whistling, unless it was in the distance as the locomotive "approached" and after it "left". I recall that the wig wag also stopped working after the engine sound started to recede. It's been a long time, so maybe I am mixing this up with something else I heard.


Les


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 Post subject: Re: Southern #1401
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:24 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 9:42 pm
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Les, it's been 40 years or so, so my memory of the exact sound is vague. I'm certain it made chugging noises. I would expect they'd have included a whistle too, since it's pretty much the signature sound of a steam train, but I really don't know for certain.

I think there was a reasonable pause between renditions, maybe 5 minutes or something, but again we're talking vague memories at this point.


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