It is currently Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:26 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:30 am 
Site Admin

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:15 pm
Posts: 1260
Location: Henderson Nevada
I need to install a terne metal roof on a narrow gauge passenger car. At one point in the past lead or tin washed steel was available from Follansbee Steel, but I understand they have shut down.

What is available currently?

Randy

_________________
Randy Hees
Director, Nevada State Railroad Museum, Boulder City, Nevada
http://museums.nevadaculture.org/nsrmbc
http://www.nevadasouthern.com/
https://www.facebook.com/FriendsOfNevadaSouthernRailway


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 8:33 pm 

Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2005 9:23 am
Posts: 128
Location: willow grove pa
http://www.eastwood.com/body-soldering- ... -pack.html

Eastwood automotive still offers 30% tin, 70% lead in stick format. Not sure if this meets your requirements but they sell the tools and butter to apply lead also.

I have used the soder pots / lead in many auto restorations, flows nice but not for the novice.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 8:54 pm 
Site Admin

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:15 pm
Posts: 1260
Location: Henderson Nevada
The solder is easy... it is the sheet metal I need. Real terne is a soft sheet iron/steel, with a lead or tin wash. The last known manufacture seems to have shut down. I am looking for alternatives.

I have heard that there is a lead/tin washed stainless, but 1) I haven't found a source, and 2) I have heard that it is stiffer/harder and so seams don't lay down as well.

I suspect I could use copper since it is painted after installation.

Randy

_________________
Randy Hees
Director, Nevada State Railroad Museum, Boulder City, Nevada
http://museums.nevadaculture.org/nsrmbc
http://www.nevadasouthern.com/
https://www.facebook.com/FriendsOfNevadaSouthernRailway


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 9:17 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:56 am
Posts: 341
Location: Northern California
Randy, the last soldered terne metal roofs installed that I am aware were either Milwaukee Lake Shore and Western 63, Copper Range 25 or Copper Range 60, all at Mid Continent Railway Museum. You may need to either give Glenn Guerra or the Mid Continent people a call.


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 9:46 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:20 pm
Posts: 448
A splendid terne roof restoration performed at the NW Railway Museum (Snoqualmie, WA):

http://trainmuseum.blogspot.com/2012/06 ... -roof.html


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 10:12 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 1:02 am
Posts: 104
Location: Northern California
My search suggests that Follansbee Steel has been sold to Revere Copper and that at least the stainless steel version is available. see: http://www.constructionmagnet.com/metal ... ating-line

_________________
Joe Magruder


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Fri Jul 04, 2014 12:16 am 
Site Admin

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:15 pm
Posts: 1260
Location: Henderson Nevada
Thank you Joe, that is what I was looking for... the older Follinsby product was used by Mid Continent and Northwest Railroad Museum projects...

I have heard criticism of the lead washed stainless product. Part of the installation involves hammering down the seams before soldering... the stainless is stiffer... I am hoping for a thinner product to make it more malleable and so allowing proper flat seams... I am also considering using lead washed copper... we are painting the roof, so copper might be an acceptable substitution.

Randy

_________________
Randy Hees
Director, Nevada State Railroad Museum, Boulder City, Nevada
http://museums.nevadaculture.org/nsrmbc
http://www.nevadasouthern.com/
https://www.facebook.com/FriendsOfNevadaSouthernRailway


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:07 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 11:38 am
Posts: 53
Location: Parkton, MD
Randy,

The WW&F Ry Museum in Alna, Maine installed a metal roof on creamery car #65 it built several years ago.

Stewart (Start) Rhine: can you jump in with an answer?

Dave Crow


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:23 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:01 pm
Posts: 98
Location: Bath, Me
Here's a couple shots WW&F # 65's roof. I'll ask tonight or tomorrow at the railroad where the roof material was sourced from.

Brendan

Image

Image

_________________
http://wwfry.org/

http://forum.wwfry.org/index.php


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 4:25 pm 
Site Admin

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:15 pm
Posts: 1260
Location: Henderson Nevada
It appears that the two current options are zinc coated stainless steel or zinc coated copper. Reports are that the stainless is too stiff and seams don't lay down well...

I am currently concerning the zinc/copper material... I suspect that terne was used 120 years ago because it was cheaper than copper, and with limited use, copper is no longer more expensive, that while the stainless might last longer and work well for standing seams, it just doesn't cut it for rolled flat seams... today copper will act more like terne... and since we are painting it will look the same.

Thoughts? (work on several of the cars will be based on Secretary of Interiors standards for historic buildings...)

Randy

_________________
Randy Hees
Director, Nevada State Railroad Museum, Boulder City, Nevada
http://museums.nevadaculture.org/nsrmbc
http://www.nevadasouthern.com/
https://www.facebook.com/FriendsOfNevadaSouthernRailway


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 4:39 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
Posts: 5252
Location: southeastern USA
I think you will find the copper based terne to be more easily applied and equally robust as the stainless, if not moreso. The only difference might be in the event of some projectile penetrating the roof itself, copper being a bit softer than stainless. Soldered repairs are not a problem with either.

dave

_________________
"Techies never minded eating bits and jots of their work. They were grit and grease inside and out and could turn a pile of junk into a magical kingdom."

Andrea Hairston


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:23 pm 

Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 4:29 pm
Posts: 61
Location: Monticello, IL
If you can accept copper, my architect/roofing nerd wife asked if you have found these folks:

http://www.camlee.com/products/industri ... -products/

Note the "lead coated" roof sheet product.

The University of Illinois has purchased the lead-coated sheet for dormer roofs on the main Library, but it was something over a year ago. The U of I is using the lead coated product for its historical appearance as well.

Kent


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:40 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:56 am
Posts: 341
Location: Northern California
Randy, since the pieces are fairly small, have you considered coating the mild steel your self?


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:29 am 
Site Admin

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:15 pm
Posts: 1260
Location: Henderson Nevada
Dave,

I am not sure I am prepared to coat my own material... I suspect that the architectural community has a solution, acceptable to those enforcing Secretary of Interior's standards and guidelines, and I am trying to piggyback on that.

This is likely not a problem unique to the railroad preservation community.

Randy

_________________
Randy Hees
Director, Nevada State Railroad Museum, Boulder City, Nevada
http://museums.nevadaculture.org/nsrmbc
http://www.nevadasouthern.com/
https://www.facebook.com/FriendsOfNevadaSouthernRailway


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Soldered terne metal roofs
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:02 pm 

Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 4:01 pm
Posts: 98
Location: Bath, Me
I was told today that the roofs on the caboose and dairy car at the WW&Fry are galvanized steel.

_________________
http://wwfry.org/

http://forum.wwfry.org/index.php


Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


 Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Yahoo [Bot] and 26 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: