I am trying to sort out the numbering system NP used, when numbering or renumbering the heavyweight cars received from Pullman in 1948. I also appreciate information on how these cars ended their careers, whether work service or scrapping.

I have the "CHIEF" series numbered # 300 to 324 (numbered in order, alphabetically by car name). When were these numbers assigned?

Can anyone verify if the following NP cars were reclassed DORMITORY-SLEEPERS, # 793 - 797 (assumed names dropped) and if so which car and when it was reclassed.

302 CHIEF BAPTISTA
303 CHIEF BIG MEDICINE
311 CHIEF LITTLE RAVEN
313 CHIEF MANY HORNS
318 CHIEF SEATTLE

The following 3 cars were renumbered in the 700 series, with names dropped. The following information has been confirmed by Tom Madden's Pullman Project, and Pullman Car List (March 1961). Were any of the other "CHIEF" series renumbered, when new some-sleepers, introduced in 1954 were numbered in the 300 series.


301 CHIEF ARLEE, 1954 (June) numbered # 701, name dropped
304 CHIEF BIG WHITE, 1956 (May) numbered # 704, name dropped
319 CHIEF SPOTTED TAIL, 1956 (Aug) numbered # 716, name dropped


Also were the "POPLAR" series numbered. Out of the 4 cars, I have the following 2 numbered in the 700 series, with the names dropped. The following information has been confirmed by Tom Madden's Pullman Project, and Pullman Car List (March 1961).

POPLAR ACRES, 1955 (April) numbered # 740, name dropped

POPLAR GLADE, 1956 (March) numbered # 742, name dropped

POPLAR GAP & POPLAR HOLLOW are still listed as named, in Pullman Car List (March 1961).

One more question, did any of these cars end up in Burlington Northern service?

Thank you, any help would be appreciated.

Richard--

Here's what is listed by Wayner:

The 37 Chief-series 10S-1DR-1C sleepers were built in 1930 for the North Coast Limited, with NP acquiring 25 of the 37 at the 12/31/1948 divestiture. (The Lot also included an additional 4 cars built for the CB&Q.)

In the 1950's, NP began removing names from both lightweight and heavyweight cars, including the Chief-series. While not all cars had numbers applied at that time, Wayner does list a #700-series number for the entire group of 25 cars; there is no mention of the #300-series numbers. The #700-series numbers were not applied in alphabetical order. Most of the cars are listed by Wayner as scrapped after being removed from Pullman lease (WFL); the only cars that are not shown as scrapped are the cars redesignated as #790-series dormitories (and there is no further disposition info listed for these cars). While several cars remained in Pullman lease until 1966-1967, there is no mention by Wayner of these cars still being extant at the time of the BN merger in 1970. Also, Wayner lists two different cars as renumbered to dormitory #797; I don't have a copy of Lorenz Schrenck's NP passenger car roster, so I don't know if there were 2 different cars numbered #797, or if this is an error in the records.

#700 Chief American Horse WFL 10-1964

#701 Chief Arlee WFL 10-1964

#702 Chief Baptista WFL 9-1958 to dormitory #794

#703 Chief Big Medicine WFL 9-1958 to dormitory #795

#704 Chief Big White WFL 3-1967

#705 Chief Black Foot WFL 5-1962

#706 Chief Charlot WFL 10-1959

#707 Chief Gall WFL 10-1959

#708 Chief Good Lance WFL 5-1961 to dormitory #797 (2nd)

#709 Chief Little Raven WFL 10-1958 to dormitory #793

#710 Chief Many Horns WFL 9-1954 to dormitory #796

#711 Chief Red Cloud WFL 10-1959

#712 Chief Red Leaf WFL 9-1962

#713 Chief Red Thunder WFL 11-1959

#714 Chief Rocky Bear WFL 11-1959

#715 Chief Seattle WFL 9-1954 to dormitory #797 (1st)

#716 Chief Spotted Tail WFL 10-1966

#717 Chief Standing Buffalo WFL 5-1961

#718 Chief Sword WFL 10-1959

#719 Chief Taholah WFL 5-1962

#720 Chief Victor WFL 11-1959

#721 Chief Wolf Robe WFL 10-1959

#722 Chief Black Bear WFL 2-1964

#723 Chief Kamiakin WFL 11-1959

#724 Chief Little Shell WFL 6-1962

The 6 Poplar-series 6S-6DB sleepers rebuilt in March and April 1939 for the North Coast Limited were sold to NP and CB&Q at the 12/31/1948 divestiture. All 6 are listed by Wayner as scrapped after being removed from Pullman lease.

NP acquired:

#740 Poplar Acres WFL 8-1962

#741 Poplar Gap WFL 7-1963

#742 Poplar Glade WFL 8-1962

#743 Poplar Hollow WFL 8-1962

CB&Q acquired:

Poplar Branch WFL 5-1961

Poplar Flat WFL 5-1961

Also, the 3C-1DR sleeper buffet lounge solarium observation Palm Point acquired by NP at the 12/31/1948 divestiture was numbered #749. The Palm Point survived until this time last year when it was scrapped.

Sources:

1. "The Complete Roster of Heavyweight Pullman Cars" by Robert J. Wayner (Wayner Publications, 1985)

2. Tom Madden's Pullman Project CCR database: http://pullmanproject.com/Database.htm

Thanks Ted, for all your information on the NP cars, including the coach conversions in the other thread.

The numbering system in the 300 series was from a magazine (forgot which one), but was very generic in content, but did say say the cars were later numbered in the 700 series. After 30+ years of collecting railway passenger car information, with a lot of it on small pieces of paper, I do appreciate this group for clarifying some of the inaccuricies.

Richard

Attached is a spreadsheet with a list of the Pullman "CHIEF" series, that went to C&EI, IC, L&N and NP.