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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 11:59 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 4:49 pm
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"Here's the page for NYC #2600/CMRY #703 on Ozark Mountain Railcar: http://www.ozarkmountainrailcar.com/det ... Coach--NEW"

That car looks to be in remarkably good condition, considering it is a rare pre-war Pullman-Standard built steel coach. It also looks to be fairly complete inside and out.


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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 3:57 pm 

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Location: B'more MD
It is good to hear that NYC 2600 is still around, and even for sale over on Ozark Mountain's site. The late Ted Church purchased the car from a party in western Ohio or eastern Indiana, many years ago. I had lost track of the car, after Ted sold it. Nice to hear it's still around.

G.F.Payne
Baltimore, MD

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 10:52 pm 
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Thanks to Joshua, Topfuel, and George, for the info!

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Ted Brumberg


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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 9:19 am 

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Sorry, Ted, I was confusing two different collections of former NYC coaches. The ones previously leased by the NYS&W were in the NYC 2900 series and are owned by the Western New York Railway Historical Society.

Their page for these cars:

http://www.trainweb.org/wnyrhs/passenger.htm

Here's their lineage:

NYSW 520 NYC 2906
521 2915
522 2932
523 2941
524 2918

NYC 2933 was not part of the other five leased to the NYS&W.

Joshua

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 6:06 pm 
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Thanks, Joshua, for the info!

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 8:03 pm 

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Ted,
When you get down to the postwar sleepers, here's NYC 658 ex NYC 10623 Rippling Stream - it went from Amtrak through a couple of private owners, now to Austin Steam Train Association, in weekly excursion service. It's been restored inside and out, and is a beautiful car.

Attachment:
NYC658.jpg
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Bradley Linda
Waco, TX


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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 8:41 pm 
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Thanks, Bradley, for the info and photo of Rippling Stream!

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Ted Brumberg


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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Tue Oct 07, 2014 11:07 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
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Location: Baltimore, MD
Rainier Rails wrote:
#10588 Chittenango Falls renumbered in 1958 to #10641* reconfigured in 1961* to parlor buffet lounge #647 sold in 1964 to Ted Church (Erie, PA). Current status unknown.

*Randall has this car listed as #10641, and Link has this car listed as #10647. Randall has the reconfiguration date as 1961, and Link has the date as 1958.

Reported in this Facebook post to Abandoned Rails FB group as "rusting away at Wapakoneta, OH just off US-33 east of I-75" . . . "has been sitting there for over 20 years". . .

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... =1&theater

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2014 5:10 am 
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Thanks, ADM IV, for the info and photo of the #10588 Chittenango Falls!

Does anybody know the identity of the second car in Amtrak Phase I?

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:43 am 

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Location: Baltimore, MD
From the Abandoned Rails FB page:
Quote:
I think the Amtrak car is a former B&O Columbian baggage-dorm.

Others at the Ahead Of The Torch FB page say:
Quote:
The car next to it was an Former Northern Pacific Baggage/Dormitory Car off the NP's "Mainstreeter" train, built by PS 1947.
The Bag/Dorm car was owned by Indiana Hi-Rail many years ago, it was purchased by the Late Bill Fruehring of Bellevue,Ohio and loaned ro Dennis Shroyer who owns the NYC Car.

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2014 8:28 am 
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Quote:
The car next to it was an Former Northern Pacific Baggage/Dormitory Car off the NP's "Mainstreeter" train, built by PS 1947.
The Bag/Dorm car was owned by Indiana Hi-Rail many years ago, it was purchased by the Late Bill Fruehring of Bellevue,Ohio and loaned ro Dennis Shroyer who owns the NYC Car.


Thanks, ADM IV, for the info and photo!

This is the NP #425 (P-S, 1947, Lot #6765, Plan #7533). There were a total of 6 of these cars built in that Lot as 30' RPO-dormitories, #425-#430 (1st). NP owned the #425-#429, and CB&Q owned the #430 (1st), which was renumbered to #479 in 1954. Only 1 of the 6 (the #425) was sold to Amtrak (in 1973) as baggage-dormitory #1540, listed as retired in July 1981.

Sources:

1. "Streamliner Cars Volume One: Pullman Standard" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1981)

2. Northern Pacific RY Historical Association website: http://www.nprha.org/

3. Mike Palmieri's Amtrak rosters

4. "Amtrak by the Numbers" by David C. Warner and Elbert Simon (White River Productions, 2011)

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Wed Oct 08, 2014 9:42 pm 
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Quote:
The Bag/Dorm car was owned by Indiana Hi-Rail many years ago, it was purchased by the Late Bill Fruehring of Bellevue,Ohio and loaned ro Dennis Shroyer who owns the NYC Car.


Bill Fuehring's [sic]* company was Golden Age Railway Equipment, which used the GOLD reporting mark, at least on his ex-UP chairs, some of which saw use with the old SOU/NS steam program. Did the NP #425/AMTK #1540 also receive the GOLD reporting marks?

*Is the proper spelling Fuehring or Fruehring?

Bill Fuehring owned 5 AC&F-built ex-UP 44 seat leg rest chairs, all of which had been sold to GTW in 1969 and converted to 74 seat commuter coaches with #48xx-series numbers.

AC&F Lot #3812, 1953:

UP #5455/GTW #4802/SEMTA parts source/GOLD #4802 (#800541) (saw use with SOU/NS steam program)/Mad River & NKP/Cuyahoga Valley & Hardin Southern/Ray Kammer-Lake Central Railtours/TCRM.

AC&F Lot #4095, 1954:

UP #5460/GTW #4803/SEMTA parts source/GOLD #4803/Mad River & NKP/RBBX #40015.

UP #5461/GTW #4804/SEMTA parts source/GOLD #4804 City of Bellevue (#800540) (saw use with SOU/NS steam program)/Mad River & NKP/RBBX #40016.

UP #5464/GTW #4805/MofW #85391/SEMTA/GOLD #4805/Mad River & NKP/RBBX #40017.

UP #5467/GTW #4806/SEMTA parts source/GOLD #4806 City of Huron (#800542) (saw use with SOU/NS steam program)/Mad River & NKP/Cuyahoga Valley & Hardin Southern/TCRM.

Bill Fuehring also owned an ex-UP café lounge (AC&F Lot #3813, 1955):

UP lunch counter diner #4001/café lounge #4001/Amtrak #8398/Indiana RR Museum (Noblesville)/GOLD #800543 Lake Erie/Mad River & NKP/Western New York RHS.

Sources:

1. "Streamliner Cars Volume Three: ACF - Other Builders" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1982)

2. Don Strack's UP passenger car roster pages: http://utahrails.net/pass/pass-index.php

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2014 12:51 am 
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Part One: Prewar Lightweights, Continued:

Diners:

6 Cars, P-S, Lot #6544, Plan #7405, 1938, NYC Lot #2129:

Ordered in July 1937 and delivered in May 1938. Built with 38 seats, seating increased in 1942 to 44. Retirement dates from Randall, sale and scrapping dates from Link.

#680 retired in 1959 and sold in April 1960 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

#681 retired in 1959 and sold in December 1960 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

#682 retired in 1959 and sold in April 1960 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

#683 retired in 1961 and scrapped in September 1962.

#684 retired in 1959 and sold in December 1960 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

#685 retired in 1959 and sold in December 1960 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

4 Cars, Budd, Lot #96206, 1941, NYC Lot #2146:

Ordered in January 1941 and delivered in November 1941 with 44 seats. Numbers applied in 1952. Retirement dates from Randall, sale dates from Link. Randall lists these cars as sold to Jones Properties for NdeM; whereas Link does not mention Jones, lists 2 cars each sold to NdeM and SCD.

#686 George Clinton retired in 1960 and sold in August 1960 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

#687 DeWitt Clinton retired in 1960 and sold in August 1960 to SCD. Current status unknown.

#688 John Jay retired in 1960 and sold in August 1960 to SCD. Current status unknown.

#689 Horatio Seymour retired in 1959 and sold in April 1960 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

Mail-Baggage Cars:

4 Cars, P-S, Lot #6545, Plan #7406, 1938, NYC Lot #2130:

Ordered in July 1937 and delivered in May 1938. 60' RPO-baggage.

#5017 to PC #6496 retired and scrapped in 1971.

#5018 to PC #6497 retired in 1971 and donated to Indiana RY Museum (French Lick).

#5019 to PC #6498 retired and scrapped in 1971.

#5020 to PC #6499 retired in 1971 and transferred to MofW, number unknown. Current status unknown.

2 Cars, Budd, Lot #96209, 1941, NYC Lot #2143:

Ordered in January 1941 and delivered in November 1941. 60' RPO-baggage. Numbered applied in 1952. Randall lists names removed when renumbered to PC.

#5021 Alonzo B. Cornell to PC #6500 retired and sold in 1971 to Strates Shows. Current status unknown.

#5022 John A. Dix to PC #6501 retired and sold in 1971 to Strates Shows. Current status unknown.

Sources:

1. "Streamliner Cars Volume One: Pullman Standard" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1981)

2. "Streamliner Cars Volume Two: The Budd Company" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1981)

3. Terry Link's NYC passenger car roster pages: http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-MODELS-PASS.htm

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2014 4:06 am 
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Part Two: Postwar Lightweights:

Sleepers:

10RM-6DB Valley-Series:

19 Cars, Budd, Lot #9660-023, Plan #9510, 1948-1949, NYC Lot #2200:

Ordered in December 1945. Madden lists cars as built between December 1948 and January 1949. Randall lists cars as delivered between December 1948 and March 1949. NYC Lot #2200 consisted of the 10-6 sleepers constructed in both Lots #9660-023 and #9662-023, a total of 40 cars. As listed by Randall, names were retained when renumbered to PC and sold to Amtrak.

#10136 Missouri Valley to PC #4276 sold in 1973 to Amtrak #2836. Planned for conversion to HEP #2896, which was cancelled. Car stored until listed for sale in September 1991. Sold to Artrain and converted to display car ARTX #101. After Artrain ceased operations, acquired along with other ARTX cars by MRLX.

#10102 Navajo Valley to PC #4252 sold in 1973 to Amtrak #2834. Planned for conversion to HEP #2895, which was cancelled. Car stored until listed for sale in September 1991. Sold to Colorado Railcar (along with Tonawanda Harbor), recently listed for sale on Ozark Mountain Railcar.

#10114 Pine Valley to PC #4259 sold in 1973 to Amtrak #2835 (not applied). Retired in March 1976 and sold to Tuman Demolition.

#10116 Yosemite Valley to PC #4261. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1971. Listed by Madden as retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Honduras as of 2/1/1969. Current status unknown.

#10117 Zoar Valley to PC #4262. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1971. Listed by Madden as retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Indochina as of 12/10/1968. Current status unknown.

#10135 Minnesota Valley retired and scrapped in November 1967.

#10100 Mohawk Valley retired and sold in 1968 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Escocia as of 10/25/1968. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10101 Morning Valley wrecked in August 1967 on the D&H.

#10104 Onondaga Valley wrecked in March 1968.

#10103 Orchard Valley retired and sold in 1968 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Holanda as of 12/15/1968. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10106 Peaceful Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1968. Listed by Madden as retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as #578 Liberia as of 2/1/1969. Link lists retirement date as 1968, and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10107 Peach Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1968. Link by Link as retired and sold in 1968 to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10139 Putnam Valley retired and scrapped in 1968.

#10108 Round Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and sold in 1966 to Jones Properties and renamed Louvetti Green, later resold to NdeM. Listed by Madden as retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as of 8/23/1967. Madden lists 2 possible NdeM names for this car, Valle De Mexico and Kenia. Link lists retirement date as June 1966, and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10105 San Joaquin Valley retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Bolivia as of 10/9/1968. Randall lists the retirement date as 1968, Link lists the retirement date as December 1967, and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10109 Schoharie Valley retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Argentina as of 10/2/1968. Randall lists the retirement date as 1968, Link lists the retirement date as December 1967, and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10138 Skyland Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and sold in 1966 to Jones Properties and renamed Richard Lane, later resold to NdeM. Listed by Madden as retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Mali as of 10/3/1967. Link lists retirement date as June 1966, and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10110 Sonoma Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1966. Listed by Link as retired and sold in March 1966 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

#10115 Tully Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1968. Listed by Link as retired and sold in 1968 to SCD. Current status unknown.

21 Cars, Budd, Lot #9662-023, Plan #9502, 1949, NYC Lot #2200:

Ordered in December 1945, delivered between January and March 1949.

#10129 Keene Valley to PC #4271 sold in 1973 to Amtrak #2832. Wrecked on 10/2/1979 on the eastbound #4 Southwest Limited at Lawrence, KS, and subsequently retired (presumed scrapped) in 1980.

#10122 Klamath Valley to PC #4266 sold in 1973 to Amtrak #2830. Retired in 1976 (Palmieri) and sold in November 1977 (Warner) to Tuman Demolition.

#10123 Lebanon Valley to PC #4267 sold in 1973 to Amtrak #2831. Retired in October 1981 and sold to private ownership #800183. Current status unknown.

#10137 Maple Valley to PC #4277 sold in 1973 to Amtrak #2833. Retired in October 1981 and sold in 1983 to NdeM (SCD) #751 and renamed Aragon. Current status unknown.

#10121 Caribou Valley to PC #4265 retired and scrapped in 1971.

#10132 Cherry Valley to PC #4273 retired and scrapped in 1971.

#10118 Canary Valley retired and sold to NdeM. Listed by Randall as retired in 1967, listed by Link as retired in December 1966. Current status unknown.

#10126 Castle Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and sold in 1968 to Indiana Railroad Museum (not Railway), listed by Link as retired and sold in December 1967 to the Railway Exposition Company. If Link's listing is correct, than is this car still at the RY Museum of Greater Cincinnati, or has it been moved elsewhere? Current status unknown.

#10119 Cedar Valley retired and sold in 1968 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Costa Rica as of 12/8/1968. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10127 Central Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1967. Listed by Link as retired and sold in November 1967 to Edwards International. Current status unknown.

#10134 Chagrin Valley retired and sold in 1968 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as #574 Guatemala as of 11/11/1968. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10120 Champlain Valley retired and sold in 1968 to NdeM. Current status unknown.

#10130 Cumberland Valley retired and sold in 1968 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Ecuador as of 2/1/1969. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10111 Eden Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and sold in 1966 to Jones Properties, reconfigured to 6DB-3MR, and renamed Richard Warner. Listed by Link as retired and sold in June 1966 to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10112 Eventide Valley retired and scrapped in 1968.

#10128 Genesee Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1968. Listed by Madden as retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Colombia as of 2/1/1969. Link lists retirement date as 1968 and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10133 Happy Valley retired and sold in 1968 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Canada as of 11/2/1968. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10131 Hunting Valley retired and sold in November 1967 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as #565 Brasil as of 12/21/1968. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10113 Keuka Valley retired and sold in 1968 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as El Salvador as of 11/9/1968. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10124 Maumee Valley. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1968. Listed by Madden as retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Cuba as of 2/1/1969. Link lists retirement date as 1968 and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10125 Meadow Valley retired and sold in 1968 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Dominicana as of 1/3/1969. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

Sources:

1. "Streamliner Cars Volume Two: The Budd Company" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1981)

2. Terry Link's NYC passenger car roster pages: http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-MODELS-PASS.htm

3. Tom Madden's Pullman Project CCR database: http://pullmanproject.com/Database.htm

4. Mike Palmieri's Amtrak rosters

5. "Amtrak by the Numbers" by David C. Warner and Elbert Simon (White River Productions, 2011)

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Additions and corrections are welcome. Thanks in advance.

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 Post subject: Re: Surviving NYC Lightweight Cars
PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2014 6:37 am 
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Part Two: Postwar Lightweights, Continued:

Sleepers, Continued:

10RM-6DB River-Series:

97 Cars, P-S, Lot #6790, Plan #4123, 1948-1949, NYC Lot #2190:

Ordered in December 1945. Randall lists cars as delivered between September 1948 and March 1949, Madden lists cars as built between August 1948 and March 1949. CN acquired 20 of these cars in March 1965.

#10141 Powder River to CN #2075 Exploits River to VIA #2075. Current status unknown.

#10144 Penobscot River to CN #2076 Margaree River to VIA #2076. Current status unknown.

#10152 Miami River to CN #2077 Mabou River to VIA #2077. Madden lists this as one of two possible cars that were sold to NdeM as Paises Bajos, the other was Little Miami River. Current status unknown.

#10157 Winding River to CN #2078 Sable River to VIA #2078. Current status unknown.

#10161 Agawam River to CN #2079 Restigouche River to VIA #2079. Retired and sold (198?) to the New Brunswick RY Museum (Hillsboro, NB).

#10162 Deer River to CN #2080 Petitcodiac River to VIA #2080. Current status unknown.

#10165 East River to CN #2081 Riviere de Loup to VIA #2081. Retired and sold (198?) to the New Brunswick RY Museum (Hillsboro, NB).

#10167 Manistee River to CN #2082 Riviere de au Renard to VIA #2082. Current status unknown.

#10174 St. Regis River to CN #2083 Riviere Rouge to VIA #2083. Retired and sold (198?) to Jack Deasy #800272. Current status unknown.

#10188 St. Francis River to CN #2084 Riviere Raquette to VIA #2084. Retired and sold (198?) to Memphis Transportation Museum as MTM #2084 Dolly Wurtzburger (#800074) (Collierville, TN). Current status unknown.

#10197 Licking River to CN #2085 Nipigon River to VIA #2085. Current status unknown.

#10199 Chicopee River to CN #2086 Pembina River to VIA #2086. Current status unknown.

#10213 Hocking River to CN #2087 Saskatchewan River to VIA #2087. Retired and sold (198?) to private ownership #800361 Saskatchewan River, resold to Hartwell-Lowe Corporation as HLC #1904 and renamed Norma Peterson (#800361). Current status unknown.

#10215 Huron River to CN #2088 Prairie River to VIA #2088. Current status unknown.

#10216 Housatonic River to CN #2089 Peace River to VIA #2089. Listed by Madden as sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Finlandia. Current status unknown.

#10218 Niagara River to CN #2090 Smoky River to VIA #2090. Retired and sold (198?) to private ownership #800213 Niagara River. Current status unknown.

#10222 Saugus River to CN #2091 Skeena River. Converted in 1975 to track inspection car #15050 Sandford Fleming, later renumbered to #1060. Listed by Madden as sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Checoeslovaquia.

#10223 Scioto River to CN #2092 Hay River to VIA #2092. Retired in 1982 and sold in 1983 to Excursion Lines Limited (Rochester, NY), resold in 1987 to New Georgia RR as NGRX #2000, sold at New Georgia auction in 1995 to Tom Whitted. Rebuilt to 6DB-1RM sleeper buffet lounge and renamed Palmetto State (Easley, SC). Acquired in 2006 by Roger & Gloria Stabler, painted in NYC Two-Tone Gray, and renamed Two Rivers (#800032) (Woodland, CA).

#10230 Oswegatchie River to CN #2093 Yukon River to VIA #2093. Current status unknown.

#10233 Kankakee River to CN #2094 Rideau River to VIA #2094. Listed by Madden as sold to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Portugal. Current status unknown.

#10208 Allegheny River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Dinamarco as of 12/31/1964. Madden lists spelling as Dinamarca, from the Ottawa River, lists Allegheny River as NdeM Suiza. Current status unknown.

#10209 Amazon River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Bulgaria as of 9/12/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10191 Aroostook River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Irak as of 1/20/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10192 Ausable River. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1967. Listed by Link as retired and sold in January 1967 to Edwards International. Current status unknown.

#10153 Beaver River retired and sold in April 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Islandia as of 9/6/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10154 Blanchard River retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Ursa Major as of 11/15/1964. Randall lists retirement date as 1963, Link lists retirement date as October 1964. Current status unknown.

#10172 Bonne Femme River retired and sold in April 1963 to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Cassiopedia as of 3/1/1965. Madden lists spelling as Cassiopeia. Current status unknown.

#10173 Burbois River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Afganistan as of 2/18/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD, and lists spelling as Bourbois River. Current status unknown.

#10170 Bronx River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Morruecos as of 5/27/1966. Madden lists spelling as Marruecos. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10140 Calumet River retired and sold in September 1963 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Siria as of 4/3/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10220 Cass River. Listed by Randall as wrecked in 1960. Listed by Link as retired in February 1963.

#10202 Chateaugay River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Rusia as of 9/6/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10203 Chicago River retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Taurus as of 7/19/1964. Randall lists retirement date as 1963, Link lists retirement date as April 1964 and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10200 Clinton River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Corea as of 2/7/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10217 Connecticut River retired and sold in June 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Oman as of 3/4/1967. Current status unknown.

#10190 Croton River. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1964. Listed by Link as retired and sold in November 1964 to Edwards International. Current status unknown.

#10171 Current River retired and scrapped in 1968.

#10155 Des Moines River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Rumania as of 8/24/1964. Madden lists Rumania from Grass River and Des Moines River to NdeM Albania. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10156 Des Plaines River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Italia as of 9/12/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10164 Detroit River retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Polaris as of 11/16/1964. Randall lists retirement date as 1963 and Link lists retirement date as April 1964 and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10168 Elkhart River retired and sold in February 1964 to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Capricornus as of 3/25/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10151 Farmington River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Alemenia as of 12/12/1964. Madden lists spelling as Alemania. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10178 Feather River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Egipto as of 3/14/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10149 Gila River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Espana as of 9/12/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10150 Grass River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Suiza as of 9/11/1964. Madden lists Suiza from Allegheny River and Grass River to NdeM Rumania. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10193 Harlem River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as #507 Paises Bazos as of 9/11/1964. Madden lists spelling as Paises Bajos, and from one of two cars: Miami River or Little Miami River. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10214 Hudson River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Francia as of 9/11/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10158 Illinois River retired and sold in June 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Turquia as of 12/23/1966. Current status unknown.

#10169 Indian River retired and sold in June 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Sumatra as of 9/14/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10206 Iroquois River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Albania as of 8/23/1964. Madden lists Albania from Des Moines River and Iroquois River to NdeM Suecia. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10207 Kalamazoo River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Camboya as of 1/1/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10234 Kings River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Belgica as of 12/13/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10159 Little Fox River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Findlandia as of 9/12/1964. Madden lists spelling as Finlandia, and from Housatonic River. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10160 Little Miami River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Checoeslovaquia as of 12/11/1964. Madden lists Checoeslovaquia from Saugus River and Little Miami River as one of two possible cars to NdeM #507 Paises Bajos. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10163 Little Osage River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Yugoslovia as of 9/12/1964. Madden lists spelling as Yugoeslavia, and from Whitewater River, lists Little Osage River to NdeM Norvega. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10166 Mahoning River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Grecia as of 9/11/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10198 Merrimack River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Austria as of 9/12/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10194 Monongahela River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Nepal as of 3/20/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10146 Muskingum River retired and sold in September 1963 to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Aries as of 8/2/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10147 Mystic River. Listed by Randall as wrecked in 1960. Listed by Link as retired in March 1963.

#10148 Neponset River retired and scrapped in 1968.

#10180 Neshannock River retired and sold in February 1964 to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as #238 Aquarius as of 8/2/1964, to SCD #238. Current status unknown.

#10181 Niantic River retired and sold in June 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Libano as of 12/26/1966. Current status unknown.

#10179 North River retired and sold in August 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Yemen as of 3/3/1967. Current status unknown.

#10231 Oswego River retired and sold in March 1964 to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Piscis as of 3/24/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10232 Ottawa River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Suecia as of 9/11/1964. Madden lists Suecia from Iroquois River and Ottawa River to NdeM Dinamarco. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10235 Passaic River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as India as of 4/3/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10201 Pecos River retired and sold in September 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Sudan as of 3/3/1967. Current status unknown.

#10145 Perch River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Arabia as of 4/6/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10142 Platte River retired and sold in April 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Iran as of 3/18/1967. Current status unknown.

#10143 Portage River. Listed by Randall as retired and scrapped in 1966. Listed by Link as retired and sold in August 1966 to Edwards International. Current status unknown.

#10183 Raisin River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Portugal as of 9/13/1964. Madden lists Portugal from Kankakee River. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10195 Roanoke River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Cachemira as of 4/6/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10196 Rocky River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Polomia as of 11/19/1964. Madden lists spelling as Polonia. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10236 Roundout River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Islanda as of 9/5/1964. Madden lists spelling as Irlanda. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10176 Rouge River retired and sold in February 1964 to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Libra as of 9/7/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10177 Sabine River retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Gemini as of 10/6/1964. Randall lists retirement date as 1963 and Link lists retirement date as April 1964 and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10204 Sacandaga River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Jordania as of 4/8/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10205 Salmon River retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Sirius as of 10/7/1964. Randall lists retirement date as 1963 and Link lists retirement date as April 1964 and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10221 Sangamon River retired and sold in August 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Etiopia as of 3/17/1967. Current status unknown.

#10184 Shenango River retired and sold in September 1963 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Thailandia as of 1/30/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10185 Sparkling River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Argelia as of 3/9/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10186 St. Clair River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Inglaterra as of 12/31/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10187 St. Croix River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Pakistan as of 3/28/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10189 St. Joseph River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Birmania as of 12/23/1965. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10224 St. Lawrence River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Hungria as of 9/12/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10225 St. Marys River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Tibet as of 3/9/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10226 Stillwater River retired and sold in July 1964 to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Saggitarious as of 11/16/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10175 Swan River retired and sold in June 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Chipre as of 9/14/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10182 Thames River retired and sold in June 1966 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Israel as of 12/27/1966. Current status unknown.

#10219 Thornapple River retired and sold in February 1964 to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Leo as of 3/25/1964. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10227 Tiffin River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Tunez as of 5/27/1966. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10228 Tippecanoe River retired and sold to Edwards International and resold to FdeP as Ursa Minor as of 8/13/1964. Randall lists retirement date as 1963 and Link lists retirement date as April 1964 and sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10229 Trinity River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Laos as of 12/18/1965. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10210 Westfield River retired and sold in 1968 to Luntz Brothers.

#10211 Whitewater River retired and sold in June 1964 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Norvega as of 9/11/1964. Madden lists spelling as Noruega, and from Little Osage River, lists Whitewater River to NdeM Yugoslovia. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

#10212 Willamette River retired and sold in September 1965 to Edwards International and resold to NdeM as Ceylan as of 1/29/1966. Both Madden and Link give the spelling as Williamette River. Listed by Link as sold to SCD. Current status unknown.

Notes on Electronic Brakes:

Randall lists 13 of the 97 cars as having the electronic brake variant HSCE (as opposed to the non-electric HSC) for assignment to the 20th Century Limited:

#10141 Powder River
#10144 Penobscot River
#10140 Calumet River
#10220 Cass River
#10202 Chateaugay River
#10203 Chicago River
#10200 Clinton River
#10217 Connecticut River
#10235 Passaic River
#10201 Pecos River
#10145 Perch River
#10142 Platte River
#10143 Portage River

However, Madden's CCR database lists a different set of sleepers as having HSCE brakes, a total of 14 cars:

#10161 Agawam River
#10165 East River
#10199 Chicopee River
#10153 Beaver River
#10140 Calumet River
#10220 Cass River
#10202 Chateaugay River
#10203 Chicago River
#10200 Clinton River
#10217 Connecticut River
#10235 Passaic River
#10201 Pecos River
#10145 Perch River
#10143 Portage River

Sources:

1. "Streamliner Cars Volume One: Pullman Standard" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1981)

2. Terry Link's NYC passenger car roster pages: http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-MODELS-PASS.htm

3. Tom Madden's Pullman Project CCR database: http://pullmanproject.com/Database.htm

_________________
Additions and corrections are welcome. Thanks in advance.

_________________
Ted Brumberg


Last edited by Rainier Rails on Tue Oct 14, 2014 2:39 am, edited 2 times in total.

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