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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:17 am 

Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 4:18 pm
Posts: 427
Location: Illinois
Photo 207 is likely taken near Union Interlocking in Rahway, NY. This is one of the best 1970s photos I have ever seen: note the overgrown trees, the muddy ballast, the dumped tires, and the hazy sky. If any modeler wants to model the 1970s on his layout I would recommend using this as a guide.

Chris.


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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 6:37 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:42 am
Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
More Photos:

Photo #209: Class POC85 16 seat diner (buffet)-35 seat lounge observation #1126 (Budd, 1940), scrapped in 1968. Location unknown.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142118

Image

Photo #210: Class D78f streamlined heavyweight 32 seat diner-10 seat lounge #4498 (builder and year?) at Chicago:

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142119

Image

Photo #211: Class PS442A Plan #4069B 4DB-4C-2DR sleeper #8011 Imperial Park (P-S, 1938), scrapped in 1968. Photographed at Denver on Tuesday, August 14th, 1962.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142120

Image

Photo #212: Class PS21A Plan #9010 21RM sleeper #8294 Wilkinsburg Inn (AC&F, 1948), scrapped in 1966. Location unknown.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142121

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2015 5:48 am 
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Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
First, some additional info:

On Friday, January 2nd, 2015, 8th Post on Page #2, Rainier Rails wrote:
More Photos:

Photo #52: GN 30' RPO-baggage #1107 (AC&F, 1950, Red River):

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4071893

Image


When the latest issue of TRP arrived in the mail the other week, on page #7 (the GN-NP-SP&S-CB&Q article) was a photo of the same train:

The caption states that these 2 photos were taken by Stuart J. Sutton, looking west from the Rice Avenue bridge, with Jackson Street Roundhouse behind him. The train is identified as #23, the Badger, led by E7A #505. However, I believe this is incorrect, both due to the location, and due to the fact that the #1107 seen above (and the round end observation mentioned in the caption, the #1147) were built for the Red River, not the Gopher/Badger. Plus, the Badger, at least in the earlier years, was longer at 5 cars; this train consists only of #1107, 50 seat chair-galley #945, and #1147.

Interestingly, the #945 was 1 of 6 cars (#944-#949) reconfigured in 1950 (or 1952, depending on source material) from 58 seats, all of which were assigned to the Gopher/Badger starting in 1952. #944 and #945 were reconfigured again in 1963, with the galley expanded and seating reduced to 44. However, looking at the windows of the #945, I'm thinking these photos date from before this second reconfiguration, as the first pair of windows next to the vestibule on the hallway side (opposite the men's smoker) were retained, but the next 2 pairs of windows were blanked when the galleys were enlarged. Another interesting detail, on the first set of these later-to-be-blanked-out windows, 1 of the windows has already been removed; in the 1950 configuration, this was where the first row of seats was located, and after 1963, this was the edge of the new galley counter.

Does anyone have more info on Stuart Sutton, or on his photographs? Among the Al Chione duplicates I purchased were a number of GN slides taken in the Twin Cities; I'm thinking more than just the one identified so far were taken by Stuart Sutton, so receiving more information would be very helpful!

Anyways, back to the current batch of PRR slides:

More Photos:

Photo #213: Class P70R 80 seat coach #3646 (builder and year?), not on the 1954 roster. Location unknown.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142122

Image

Photo #214: Class POS21 Plan #4133 1DB-2MR sleeper 25 seat buffet lounge observation #8419 Mountain View (P-S, 1949). Sold in 1968 to High Iron Company, later (when??) resold to private ownership #800419, then (when??) to the Railroader's Memorial Museum in Altoona. After HICO, was the Mountain View owned by Bennett Levin or another party? Location unknown.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142123

Image

Photo #215: Class PS442A Plan #4069B 4DB-4C-2DR sleeper #8016 Imperial Range (P-S, 1938), scrapped in 1968. Painted in UP Armour Yellow 1939-1940 and in Golden State Red & Silver 1948-1951. Location unknown.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142124

Image

Photo #216: Class Z74C business car #7502 Chicagoan (ex-Z74 Washington [1st], builder and year?) at Chicago. In circa 1940, the #7502 and Class Z74A #7508 switched names and assignments: #7508 was renamed from Chicago to Washington (2nd), and the #7502 was renamed from Washington to Chicagoan.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142125

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2015 8:23 am 

Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:06 pm
Posts: 2164
Location: Thomaston & White Plains
PRR P70 3646 is at Sunnyside Yard in Queens, NYC.

Howard P.

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 10:43 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:42 am
Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
Thanks, Howard, for identifying the location of photo #213!

Some additional info for the car seen in photo #205, the Poplar Heights:

On Saturday, March 28th, 2015, 15th Post on Page #7, Rainier Rails wrote:
More Pictures:

Photo #205: Plan #4060A 6S-6DB sleeper #8580 Poplar Heights (Lot #4624, 1921, rebuilt in 1937 from Plan #2411C 12S-1DR-1C Antiphon). Withheld from lease on 2/14/1966, and listed by Wayner as sold to Railcar Leasing Corporation. This car has not been mentioned before in the "Surviving Pullman" thread; does anybody know if this car is still extant? Thanks in advance! Photo likely taken in Denver.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142114

Image


The Poplar Heights is not an extant car: I received information from the former owner of the car, Bob Havens, which I've included here.

Bob Havens wrote:
I purchased the POPLAR HEIGHTS from the PRR in Feb. 1967. Its last moves in passenger service were from Trenton, NJ to Philadelphia, PA and Philadelphia, PA to NYC Sunnyside Yard, where it was interchanged to the LIRR and moved to eastern Long Island. I sold the car to Railroad Leasing Corp. in exchange for a controlling interest in the Company. It was repainted, inside and out at that time. Stock sales in the Corp were insufficient to do the mechanical upgrades needed, and I gave it up. The car was donated to the Long Island Sunrise Trail chapter of the NRHS, who sold it to Naporano Iron and Steel in, I think, 1969- so it is not a surviving heavyweight.


More Pictures:

Photo #217: Class P85b 44 seat chair #4137 (Altoona, 1947) in Philadelphia. There were 70 of these chairs (#4100-#4169) built at Juniata: 65 were ordered in June 1945 and the remaining 5 were ordered in September; cars were delivered between December 1946 and July 1947. PRR had planned to reconfigure all of these cars to 60 seat chairs in the #36xx-series, but only #4100 was completed as #3600 in 1965. The reason: it was discovered that these cars had serious structural issues, and as a result the other 69 cars were retired and scrapped between 1965 and 1969; the #4137 was retired and scrapped in 1966. The one reconfigured car, #4100/#3600, was renumbered to PC #3700 and lasted until being retired and scrapped in 1976.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142126

Image

Photo #218: Class B70a end door-equipped baggage-express #6096 (builder and year?). Location unknown.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142127

Image

Photo #219: Class P70g 68 seat chair #4365 (builder and year?) at Chicago:

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142128

Image

Photo #220: 8 seat lunch counter-buffet-38 seat lounge #1148 (P-S, Lot #6819, Plan #7596, 1950) at Chicago. Ordered in November 1946 by the Pere Marquette as part of the massive C&O order, sold before completion to the Rio Grande in February 1949, and delivered in August 1950 as D&RGW #1291 Royal Gorge. Sold to PRR in 1967 as #1148, renumbered to PC #4448, sold in 1974 to Amtrak as #3361. Sold in 1981 to Standard Industries, later (when??) to California Rail Tours #800380 (Salinas, CA), then (when??) resold to Wade Pellizzer-Virginia City Rail Corporation (Pioneer, CA). EDIT: please note, as posted by Topfuel, that the Royal Gorge is still owned by Wayne Yetter-California Rail Tours.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4142129

Image

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Ted Brumberg


Last edited by Rainier Rails on Fri May 15, 2015 11:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 10:51 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 4:49 pm
Posts: 346
Unless something has happened in the last few weeks that I don't know about, the Royal Gorge has not been sold to anyone and is still owned by Wayne Yetter/CA Rail Tours.


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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 11:37 pm 
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Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
Thanks, Topfuel, for the correction!

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2015 5:59 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:42 am
Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
More Photos:

First 4 from the last set of 20 slides.

Photo #221: Class PS106 Plan #4140 10RM-6DB sleeper #8317 Octoraro Rapids (P-S, Lot #6792, 1948), to PC #4350, scrapped in 1970. Photographed in Chicago on Saturday, October 5th, 1969.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145035

Image

Photo #222: Class PS106 Plan #4140 10RM-6DB sleeper #8321 Schuylkill Rapids (P-S, Lot #6792, 1948), scrapped in 1968. Photographed in Chicago on Friday, September 14th, 1962.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145036

Image

Photo #223: Class MPB54bE3-TC baggage-40 seat coach #4574 (builder and year?). Photographed in Philadelphia on Sunday, September 6th, 1964.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145037

Image

Photo #224: Another view of #8321 Schuylkill Rapids.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145038

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 6:24 pm 

Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 4:18 pm
Posts: 427
Location: Illinois
I think #223 is in Elizabeth, NJ - see the CNJ station tower over the first car.

I am still very curious as to where photos 209 and 212 were taken. And 224 above is another stumper to me. I think quite a few of these photos were taken on extra trains (charters, detours, Boy Scout trips, etc.) so they feature equipment in places where they usually wouldn't be.

Chris.


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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 7:11 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:42 am
Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
Chris,

Thanks for the location of #223! The presence of the CNJ tower means that photo #217 was also taken in Elizabeth, seen just to the left and above the vestibule of #4137.

As for #224 of the Schuylkill Rapids, I guess I should've notated that like #222, it was taken on 9/14/1962 in Chicago. These 2 photos show opposite sides of the car. I'm thinking they were taken at different times of the day, however, and it appears that the consist was turned in between, as the car seen to the right of the Schuylkill Rapids in both slides is the same car (minimal amount of lower side fluting), but that the Schuylkill Rapids has been turned so that in #224 this car is coupled to the opposite end from #222. Was it common practice for roads to turn sleepers at end points to allow viewing of preferred scenery on one side of the route in both directions, but to turn the sleepers independent of the rest of the consist, leaving other cars (coaches, diners, etc.) in the same direction as before? This would explain why this minimally-fluted car is at opposite ends.

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2015 10:42 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 4:49 pm
Posts: 346
"Was it common practice for roads to turn sleepers at end points to allow viewing of preferred scenery on one side of the route in both directions, but to turn the sleepers independent of the rest of the consist, leaving other cars (coaches, diners, etc.) in the same direction as before?"

The answer to this is no. A car like a 10-6 would always - except in some extenuating circumstance - be placed in consist based on the orientation of the roomettes, so the roomette passengers always rode facing forward.


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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2015 8:25 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:42 am
Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
Thanks, Topfuel, for the info!

More Photos:

Photo #225: Class PS106A Plan #4129 10RM-6DB sleeper #8313 Little Miami Rapids (P-S, Lot #6792, 1949), to PC #4322, scrapped in 1970. Photographed on Tuesday, November 1st, 1966, location unknown.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145039

Image

Photo #226: Class PS125A Plan #4066B 12DXSB-5DB sleeper #8022 Major Brook (P-S, Lot #6538, 1938), scrapped in 1967. Photographed in Denver on Wednesday, August 1st, 1962.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145040

Image

Photo #227: Class PS106A Plan #4129 10RM-6DB sleeper #8304 Conestoga Rapids (P-S, Lot #6792, 1949), to PC #4305, transferred in 1971 to MofW department as #27057. Current status unknown. Photographed in Chicago on Monday, May 17th, 1965.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145041

Image

Photo #228: Class B60b baggage-express #9181 (builder and year?). Photographed in Dallas on Saturday, September 24th, 1966.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145042

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2015 6:01 pm 

Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 4:18 pm
Posts: 427
Location: Illinois
I think photo 225 is in Harrisburg.

227 is an interesting one: I think it is in Grand Rapids, not Chicago. Again, must be another special move if it is from the mid-1960s.

Chris.


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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 2:10 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:42 am
Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
More Photos:

Photo #229: Class PS124 Plan #4130 12DXSBD-4DB sleeper #8382 Crane Creek (P-S, Lot #6792, 1949), sold in 1968 to Judge Roy Hofheinz/Astrodomain, later scrapped. Photographed in Denver on Saturday, July 9th, 1966.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145043

Image

Photo #230: Class PS125A Plan #4066B 12DXSBD-5DB sleeper #8035 James Hay Reed (2nd) (P-S, Lot #6566, 1939, ex-Moor Brook), retired in 1966 and sold to Herman H. Kennickell, Jr. Was Herman the owner of "Kennickell's Pullman Palace" in Richmond, VA? The Pullman Palace also had a heavyweight sleeper, which I have yet to identify, nor where these 2 cars ended up. Photographed in Denver on Saturday, May 15th, 1965.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145044

Image

Photo #231: Class PS6LB Plan #4086A 6DB sleeper-23 seat buffet lounge Birch Falls, in parlor service as #7159, ex-#8129 (P-S, Lot #6612, 1940), scrapped in 1968. Photographed in Chicago on Saturday, May 1st, 1965. The Birch Falls was renumbered to #7159 for parlor service the same month that this slide was taken.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145045

Image

Photo #232: Class PS13 Plan #4071B 13DB sleeper #8002 Hamilton County (P-S, Lot #6572, 1939), sold in October 1968 to Long Island as Class P80A parlor #2059 Napeague, retired in 1975 and sold to Tuman Demolition, scrapping likely took place in 1976. Photographed in Denver on Tuesday, September 14th, 1965.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145046

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Al Chione Slides
PostPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2015 2:52 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2013 2:42 am
Posts: 1676
Location: Seattle, WA - Land of Coffee
More Photos:

Photo #233: Plan #7484 64 seat coach #1409, ex-NYC #3144 (P-S, Lot #6721, 1946), acquired from NYC in 1967, to PC #1409, no disposition information. Photographed in Chicago on Thursday, June 27th, 1968.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145047

Image

Photo #234: Class POS21 Plan #4133 1DB-2MR sleeper-25 seat buffet lounge blunt end observation #8420 Tower View (P-S, Lot #6792, 1949), sold in 1968 to the RR Museum of PA. Photographed in Chicago on Saturday, June 22nd, 1963.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145048

Image

Photo #235: Class PS105A Plan #4072C 10RM-5DB sleeper #8081 Cascade Echo (P-S, Lot #6610, 1940), scrapped in 1966. Photographed in Chicago on Saturday, June 22nd, 1963.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145049

Image

Photo #236: Class PS442A Plan #4069D 4DB-4C-2DR sleeper #8008 Imperial Crest (P-S, Lot #6571, 1939), sold in 1964 to Jones Properties as the Lane Woody, later resold to the Sonora Baja California, initially as #7813-20, then renumbered/renamed to #5013 Juarez as of 8/8/1967. Interestingly, SBC added corrugation to this car. Photographed in Denver on Tuesday, August 14th, 1962.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4145050

Image

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