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 Post subject: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 8:28 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:32 pm
Posts: 152
So on several Facebook groups for F-Units, someone's running around saying the "new" NS F-Units are headed to scrap. Trying to look into this has yielded all sorts of speculation and few facts.
According to AltoonaWorks, they were sent to Roanoke post-Wick and stored pending either auction or donation to a local Roanoke group.
Someone else says they were auctioned. Now the breathless "It's going to scrap" crowd has started.
So, does anyone here "in the know" have info on what in blazes is going on?


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 10:29 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 20, 2011 8:43 pm
Posts: 39
From a Facebook posting: "apparently the former CN #9177 (bought several years ago by NS) has been auctioned off by NS and is headed for scrap".


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 10:29 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8302
Location: Baltimore, MD
To clarify, these are three units that NS acquired in 2012 apparently "on spec" and not the shiny quartet currently in office-car-special service.

From AltoonaWorks.com:

Quote:
SOU 407 F7A 7/49 CNW 4027A -> CNW 407 -> CVAR 407 -> CRLE 407 Acquired 2012 and stored
SOU 9177 F7A 8/52 CN 9088 -> CN 9177 Acquired 2012 and stored
SOU 1019 F7B 2/53 CP 4462 -> CP 6801 -> CP 1019 -> SOU 1019 Acquired 2012 and stored


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 10:41 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8302
Location: Baltimore, MD
dwither1 wrote:
From a Facebook posting: "apparently the former CN #9177 (bought several years ago by NS) has been auctioned off by NS and is headed for scrap".


I follow the Altoona Works Facebook page (unofficial, but with plenty of "inside info" from NS sources there, not your standard "rumor mill"), and this has not been mentioned. I've also stayed atop official NS motive power auctions and deaccessions, and this has NOT been mentioned or offered to my knowledge.

A check of Chris Toth's pretty much authoritative and hyper-rivet-counting NSDash9.com website and FB page likewise reveals nothing new regarding these units.

These units, no matter how gutted or defective, would have at least some value beyond scrap in the secondary market, and NS motive power personnel would know that. If they were going to be auctioned, they'd be listed in the upcoming Blackmon auction in Roanoke.

Color me extraordinarily skeptical.


Last edited by Alexander D. Mitchell IV on Sun Jul 24, 2016 11:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 11:06 pm 

Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:32 pm
Posts: 152
Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:
Color me extraordinarily skeptical.

Likewise, why I turn to only the best in this. My skeptical knob is up to 11 on this, especially with F-units in demand by IPH or possibly JJJ.


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 8:53 pm 

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 12:12 am
Posts: 87
Have any museums asked NS for one or more of them? I can think of a long list of ideal homes for them.


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 9:21 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2013 8:30 am
Posts: 84
I got to go with Alex on this F-units does have some more value in secondary market than scrap because no matter how gutted they are you can always see potential of giving it a second or third life. F-units are becoming rarer and rarer scrap should always be the last resort which we all know. I was beginning to wonder what's in the future for the operating F-units on the NS weren't these new F-units were bought for parts for the operating F-units weren't they? help me out here


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 2:08 am 

Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 12:30 am
Posts: 87
They were planning to expand the fleet prior to some changes in upper management and the severe decline of coal traffic that led to further rebuilds being postponed.

There's little inside of them that's applicable to Norfolk Southern's rebuilt F units that have 16-645E's in the A units (Dating from when rebuilt by MK years earlier), turbocharged 645E's in the B units (One is a 12 cylinder and the other is 16), Interstate Electronic Fuel Injection systems, AR10 alternators, Dash 2 electronics, ECP brakes, new radiator systems, D77 traction motors, etc. They're basically brand new locomotives and have far more in common with GP38-2's/GP40-2's than EMD F units.

And it's not like they needed spare Blomberg trucks, which seems to have been the one major component retained here besides the carbody itself, considering the hundreds of similarly shod 4 axle EMD road switchers in the regular revenue fleet. Parts are readily available and their brakes have been updated to today's single shoe arrangement.


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2016 9:35 am 

Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 4:11 pm
Posts: 270
The B unit if "empty" would make a good generator platform for an executive train set - course they have the "Tennessee".


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 11:32 am 

Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 10:40 am
Posts: 119
They were most definitely put up for sale. No idea if they sold or not.


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2016 2:22 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:40 am
Posts: 107
Any ideas who the buyers are?

Robert


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2016 2:50 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8302
Location: Baltimore, MD
BigBoy 4023 wrote:
Any ideas who the buyers are?


Again, you're getting ahead of yourself.

We have an allegation (without proof such as an online listing, "I have the sale listing offering those units and others here on my desk from XY&Z Department in Roanoke dated XX-XX-XXXX," etc.) that they were offered for sale, with that person explicitly saying "no idea if they sold or not"...........

.............. and you're asking who the "buyer" (who may or may not exist) was.

Several regulars here are, indeed, privy to such things as Class One locomotive sales, auction listings, the interior workings of motive power departments at these railroads, etc. Some of us have been, or are, directly involved with these departments for preservation matters. We try not to abuse these relationships too terribly, but, yes, some of us can indeed just drop a quick call, e-mail, or even text to someone directly involved in matters such as whether or not we could grab another AEM-7, F40PH, business car, high-hood GP38-2, box car, or whatever for preservation.

No one here has confirmed the sale of these "surplus" NS F's, let alone for scrap.

I'm not saying it's impossible. But don't believe everything that you see on Facebook, etc. Or even here. Or even me--I've been wrong before.


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2016 4:00 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2015 12:30 am
Posts: 87
Altoonaworks posted back in June that they were going to be going up for auction. While that's not confirmation that they've been sold or what their fate will be, it's confirmation in my book that at least back in June, Norfolk Southern was planning to dispose of them. They're a reliable source with inside information.


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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 11:31 pm 

Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 8:31 am
Posts: 341
Location: Morganton, N.C.
Quote:
Altoonaworks posted back in June that they were going to be going up for auction.


He posted pix to his Flickr account of 9177 and 1019 with someone asking him back in July if they were going to be rebuilt and he stated that they were going to scrap...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/lrmyers/28412919602/in/dateposted/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/lrmyers/28518252045/in/dateposted/

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 Post subject: Re: "New" NS F-units (SOU 407, 1019, 9177)
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 5:50 pm 

Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:40 am
Posts: 107
Thats a shame. Surely NS knows there is value in them for other operators looking to rebuild F units similarly to what NS has accomplished.

Any ideas as to why NS deems them scrap? To far gone structure wise? The CN unit looks rough but the one behind it is even worse. Is that the CNW unit?

Robert


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