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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 2:44 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am
Posts: 456
A June 14, 2017 article in the free Syracuse New Times weekly newspaper: The Hills Are Alive. The article describes summer activities in the 6-million-acre Adirondack Park and includes this wonderfully succinct description of the railroad:
Quote:
The Adirondack Scenic Railroad ((315) 369-6290; adirondackrr.com), a Utica-to-Lake Placid line built by industrialist William Seward Webb in 1892 as the Mohawk and Malone, now offers service and tours from Utica and Thendara to Carter Station north of Old Forge. Service from Saranac Lake to Lake Placid has been suspended while a decision about that section’s future is decided. (New York state wants to convert those 34 miles to a hiking/biking trail.) Scenic excursions from the headquarters at Thendara come in many varieties, including rail and boat trips, canoe and bicycle journeys, and many forms of entertainment, including a “Beer and Wine” train. With resumption of service that began in 1992, the line now serves more than 600,000 passengers a year.

(I believe that the 600,000 passengers a year stat is a typo.)


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 2:55 pm 

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 4:02 pm
Posts: 966
Location: Back in NE Ohio
Chris Webster wrote:
A June 14, 2017 article in the free Syracuse New Times weekly newspaper: The Hills Are Alive. The article describes summer activities in the 6-million-acre Adirondack Park and includes this wonderfully succinct description of the railroad:
Quote:
The Adirondack Scenic Railroad ((315) 369-6290; adirondackrr.com), a Utica-to-Lake Placid line built by industrialist William Seward Webb in 1892 as the Mohawk and Malone, now offers service and tours from Utica and Thendara to Carter Station north of Old Forge. Service from Saranac Lake to Lake Placid has been suspended while a decision about that section’s future is decided. (New York state wants to convert those 34 miles to a hiking/biking trail.) Scenic excursions from the headquarters at Thendara come in many varieties, including rail and boat trips, canoe and bicycle journeys, and many forms of entertainment, including a “Beer and Wine” train. With resumption of service that began in 1992, the line now serves more than 600,000 passengers a year.

(I believe that the 600,000 passengers a year stat is a typo.)


600K is like 3 times the best year on the Cuyahoga Valley Scenic, which is in a major metro area.


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:06 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am
Posts: 456
A June 19 article from NY Upstate dot com about the Adirondack Scenic Railroad starting its 2017 season:
Quote:
Despite a pending court decision that could permanently end part of its North County operations, the Utica-based, Adirondack Scenic Railroad is set to begin its season July 1 with regular runs from Utica to the greater Old Forge area.

The railroad will also feature trips from the Thendara (Old Forge) station to Otter Lake and Big Moose Lake. However, the stretch from Big Moose to Tupper Lake will be closed this season due to needed track repairs, said Mark Piersma, the railroad's marketing director.

In addition, the railroad has alreadt had several 3 1/2 hour "wine and beer" train trips already this year on its tracks from Utica to Remson. The once-a-month excursions feature local beers and wine, along with a live band on the train. The next scheduled trip is July 21.

However, the railroad is on "pins and needles" this month, Piersma said, awaiting a decision on a lawsuit filed by the railroad against New York State, challenging its controversial plan to rip all the railroad tracks between Saranac Lake and Lake Placid for a "rails to trails" plan. Franklin Superior Court Judge Robert Main was slated to give his decision on June 6.

Link to the full story: Adirondack Scenic Railroad on 'pins and needles,' some rides will begin July 1


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:00 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:07 am
Posts: 655
Location: Philadelphia Pa
PaulWWoodring wrote:
Chris Webster wrote:
A June 14, 2017 article in the free Syracuse New Times weekly newspaper: The Hills Are Alive. The article describes summer activities in the 6-million-acre Adirondack Park and includes this wonderfully succinct description of the railroad:
Quote:
The Adirondack Scenic Railroad ((315) 369-6290; adirondackrr.com), a Utica-to-Lake Placid line built by industrialist William Seward Webb in 1892 as the Mohawk and Malone, now offers service and tours from Utica and Thendara to Carter Station north of Old Forge. Service from Saranac Lake to Lake Placid has been suspended while a decision about that section’s future is decided. (New York state wants to convert those 34 miles to a hiking/biking trail.) Scenic excursions from the headquarters at Thendara come in many varieties, including rail and boat trips, canoe and bicycle journeys, and many forms of entertainment, including a “Beer and Wine” train. With resumption of service that began in 1992, the line now serves more than 600,000 passengers a year.

(I believe that the 600,000 passengers a year stat is a typo.)


600K is like 3 times the best year on the Cuyahoga Valley Scenic, which is in a major metro area.


They carried 78,000 in 2015, and almost 93,000 in 2016


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:59 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2050
it sounds like the popularity of these trains here and catskill is growing. Are you hearing something new york?


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 4:16 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am
Posts: 456
Article in NewYorkUpstate.com wrote:
Franklin Superior Court Judge Robert Main was slated to give his decision on June 6.

While we're still awaiting that ruling, the Adirondack Daily Enterprise has an update on a property issue:
Quote:
SARANAC LAKE — The state plans to use Environmental Protection Fund money to acquire a section of its proposed Adirondack rail trail that currently is owned by North Country Community College.

In a May 17 letter to village Mayor Clyde Rabideau, state Department of Environmental Conservation Region 5 Director Robert Stegemann said his agency is “contemplating the purchase” of a parcel owned by Essex and Franklin counties and the college.

The 11-acre parcel, located in the North Elba section of the village, is currently assessed at $94,400, according to Essex County records. It straddles the railroad tracks from Brandy Brook Avenue to just past the college’s Sparks Athletic Complex.

The state’s lack of ownership of this and other parcels of land emerged as an issue last year in a lawsuit filed against the state by the Adirondack Rail Preservation Society. The group, which operates tourist trains under the Adirondack Scenic Railroad name, is suing the state over its plan to remove the railroad tracks between Tupper Lake and Lake Placid, replacing them with the multi-use recreational trail.

Link to full story in the July 13, 2017 Adirondack Daily Enterprise:
State to use EPF to buy rail trail land - NCCC president believes college community backs trail plan


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:32 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2050
Quote:
The state plans to use Environmental Protection Fund money to acquire a section of its proposed Adirondack rail trail that currently is owned by North Country Community College.


That's stealing. The plan is apparently they have a lot of money now to work this project, there is no reason to steal off funds from another agency whose funds are targeted in another direction. This is like taking money out of social security.

This project is coming down to absolute thievery


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:01 pm 

Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:20 pm
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Quote:
This is like taking money out of social security.


Nobody would do that.............would they?!


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:36 am 

Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2004 10:52 pm
Posts: 134
Location: Greenwich, NY
dinwitty wrote:

This project is coming down to absolute thievery


And that is pretty much what the rail advocates have been saying all along. People are finally starting to see it outside of the rail advocate crowd, but we can only hope it's not too late. As of this writing, the judge has STILL not ruled on the case.


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:41 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am
Posts: 456
Another update:
Quote:
ALBANY — Field work is starting for a 34-mile-long rail-trail in the Adirondacks from Tupper Lake to Lake Placid.

The state Department of Environmental Conservation says personnel involved in the final design and construction of the multi-use trail will be working in the corridor starting Monday.

Work such as engineering surveys, wetland mapping and property boundary surveys is expected to go on for two months


Link to the full August 6, 2017 article in The Post Star: Field work starts for 34-mile Adirondack rail-trail


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 1:10 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
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are they saying rail AND trail?


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 6:27 pm 

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dinwitty wrote:
are they saying rail AND trail?

They're saying Rail from Utica to Tupper Lake (for now) and Trail from Tupper Lake to Lake Placid.

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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 6:29 pm 

Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:45 am
Posts: 456
A letter to the editor of the Adirondack Daily Enterprise:
Quote:
To the editor:

You mean, they’re just now getting an idea of what the cost will be? It is only after assessing and surveying the 34-mile stretch that the Department of Environmental Conservation can have any idea how much work will have to go in to constructing this travesty.

I’d like everyone to keep in mind what the rip-up-the-rails proponents assured us when the debate began: Ripping up the rails and replacing them with a multi-use trail will cost NOTHING because of the value of scrap iron derived from the rails! Currently, a gross ton of scrap rail — delivered! — is worth $175*. The rails of New York Central weighed 254 pounds per yard**, giving us 223 tons per mile (counting both tracks) — which comes out, after 34 miles, to be 7,600 tons. Bear in mind that the cost of removal from the remote areas through which this railroad travels will be an additional cost, as will the disposal of rail ties. Let’s just imagine, though, that we can get $175 per ton for these rails. This gives us $1,329,944 altogether.

How much do you think the reconstructed trail is going to cost? Well, one thing to bear in mind is that nothing ever costs less than we imagined at the outset. Proponents of the trail say it will cost $8 million for 34 miles (Lake Placid to Tupper Lake.) Oddly, the trail from Lake Placid to Saranac Lake was once given an $8 million price tag, and it was never built. One wonders how much the price will rise after the work DEC is to begin today. I would wager it’s going to be a lot more than $8 million. In fact, I’d guess it’ll cost a lot more than the rehabilitation of the rails would have cost — but we won’t be able to go back. We’ll have learned a bitter lesson.

Emmett Hoops
Saranac Lake

Sources:
* http://www.877ironmike.com/metal-prices
**https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_profile


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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 7:02 pm 

Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2004 2:50 pm
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Location: Northern Illinois
At 254 pounds per yard, the gentleman seems to be doubling the amount of scrap... and I somehow doubt that this particular line was laid with 127# rail, so there will be even less scrap, although other track material may make up some of the difference.

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 Post subject: Re: Adirondack Park Agency oks scrapping RR line to Lake Pla
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 7:15 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
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Location: Baltimore, MD
Dennis Storzek wrote:
At 254 pounds per yard, the gentleman seems to be doubling the amount of scrap... and I somehow doubt that this particular line was laid with 127# rail, so there will be even less scrap, although other track material may make up some of the difference.


I believe he is counting two 127-pound-per-yard rails per route-yard of track...........


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