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 Post subject: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 12:17 am 

Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 3053
Location: Inwood, W.Va.
News story on a recent move of this locomotive, a 2-6-2:

http://www.kten.com/story/36316169/vint ... in-ardmore

Her Steam Locomotive Info page:

http://www.steamlocomotive.info/vlocomo ... isplay=956

Some other material on her, and a listing of other ATSF 2-6-2s--I'm surprised at how many are still around.

http://www.rgusrail.com/okatsf1108.html


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:40 am 

Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:38 pm
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
Im surprised at how many still exist as well!

If I didnt know any better, I would say that it appears to be a good size for a medium speed heritage line, allowing one or two to be operable and many spare parts (in the way the 557 group have taken spares from 556) to be available!

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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 9:52 am 

Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 11:23 am
Posts: 210
Location: Sheboygan County, Wisconsin
10stewi wrote:
Im surprised at how many still exist as well!

If I didnt know any better, I would say that it appears to be a good size for a medium speed heritage line, allowing one or two to be operable and many spare parts (in the way the 557 group have taken spares from 556) to be available!


I tend to agree with your comment regarding medium speed. While I don't have it right in front of me, I think that the drivers on these were at or around 69". That allowed them out on the mainline sometimes where they were not prone to giving dispatchers fits for tying up the railroad. T.E. was just a shade under 40,000 lbs.


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 10:15 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:19 am
Posts: 5262
Location: southeastern USA
A Santa Fe prairie hauled the Death Valley Scotty special - high speed is no problem for them with a lightweight train. I've always admired their lines, like the FEC light pacifics. They would need to be let out to run meaningful distances at decent speed to do well, however.

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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:44 am 

Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 12:58 pm
Posts: 1197
Location: Chicago USA
That's quite the vehicle. I've never seen that before.


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 12:01 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 3053
Location: Inwood, W.Va.
tom moungovan wrote:
I tend to agree with your comment regarding medium speed. While I don't have it right in front of me, I think that the drivers on these were at or around 69". That allowed them out on the mainline sometimes where they were not prone to giving dispatchers fits for tying up the railroad. T.E. was just a shade under 40,000 lbs.


Here are her specs:

http://www.steamlocomotive.info/vlocomo ... isplay=956


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:58 pm 

Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:58 am
Posts: 9
Every time I am in Brownwood, TX; I go look at 1080, one of my favorite locomotives. I wish there was a place to run her and $$$ to restore her. Maybe if I hit the lotto....


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:45 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 11:26 am
Posts: 3746
Location: Maine
I can hardly believe these Santa Fe "Prairies" were a backbone locomotive on the system. Any explanation as to why so many survived as display fodder? Perhaps they were just on hand, represented less as scrap value, and appeared "old Westy"?

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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:20 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 10:49 am
Posts: 635
Richard Glueck wrote:
I can hardly believe these Santa Fe "Prairies" were a backbone locomotive on the system. Any explanation as to why so many survived as display fodder? Perhaps they were just on hand, represented less as scrap value, and appeared "old Westy"?


ATSF Prairies were used quite a bit on locals and on the many grain gathering branch lines in Oklahoma, Kansas, and Texas. They were also used on local passenger trains. They trod easily on light rail, but could step lively on the big iron when needed.


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 12:03 am 

Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 3053
Location: Inwood, W.Va.
Wow, ATSF had even more, and even more are still around, some of which are fairly large.

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/locobase ... lroad=atsf

In service shot from the 1920s. This is larger locomotive than the 1108:

http://www.mypresentpast.com/images/cha ... f_1882.jpg

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/whyte/2- ... essel2.jpg

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/whyte/2- ... eryear.jpg

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/whyte/2- ... wessel.jpg


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 12:05 am 

Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 3053
Location: Inwood, W.Va.
All of these engines had grate areas of about 53 square feet. For comparison, Southern 4501 has 55 square feet.


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 12:12 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2017 11:27 am
Posts: 11
You need to remember this about some of the states that the Santa Fe ran in. Arizona limited all trains to a maximum of 70 cars in length total. Except for their passes in Raton and Gloriatta NM and crossing Cajon and Flagstaff the Santa Fe really did not have many hard pulling ruling grades system wide. Yeah there was Edelstein Hill in IL at 1.1 and near Marcilene MO it is .8 percent but for the most part it is fairly level overall. This is a railroad that really never had articulated locomotives and it's 2-10-10-2's where rebuilt into a pair of 2-10-2's each. Their primary freight power in the steam era was the 2-10-2 passenger was a 4-8-2 they stayed conservative. Yes they cobbled up some of the first 4 wheeled trailing trucks out there with the Madam queen and embraced diesels fast due to they no longer had to haul water across to Needles CA all the time and the other division points. When it came to steam power they picked good designs and made them work to their ultimate power. I just look at what they did with their war produced 4-8-4's and 2-10-4's those suckers where some of the most powerful engines ever to be made.


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 1:47 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 12:47 pm
Posts: 71
Location: Arizona
Santa Fe had many miles of 1.42% and higher across NM, AZ and CA. There were lots of helper districts out there. One of the big failures of their malleys was they couldn't run fast enough. That resulted in 2-10-2's, 2-10-4's, and big 4-8-4's. The 2900 4-8-4's were the heaviest 4-8-4's over built.

The 2-6-2's were great branchline and local freight power. The AT&SF's equivalent to an Espee Hog (2-8-0) or a PRR H-9. An mentioned, with big drivers, they could get a wheel on trains out on the main if needed.


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:44 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 3:41 am
Posts: 3053
Location: Inwood, W.Va.
The Santa Fe was not the only road to go in for 2-6-2s early in the last century.

Three happened to be the Hill roads, Northern Pacific, Great Northern, and the Chicago, Burlington & Quincy.

CB&Q:

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/locobase ... ilroad=cbq

https://archive.org/download/cbq1950/cbq1950.jpg

https://archive.org/download/cbq2050/cbq2050.jpg

Great Northern class J; from the source, GNGoat.org:

As indicated by the name, Great Northern's Prairie type (2-6-2) locomotives were designed for fast freight service on more level districts. No. 1520, a J-1, exemplifies the class, built by Baldwin in 1906-07. These engines had 69-inch driving wheels and Belpaire firebox boilers. Each engine weighed some 105 tons and exerted about 33,000 pounds of tractive force. In 1921 a program was instituted to convert the Prairies into Class H-6 Pacific type locomotives, but it was well into the 1930's before the 150 engines in the J class had been modified or scrapped.

http://www.gngoat.org/gn_steam_12.jpg

Northern Pacific:

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/locobase ... ailroad=np

http://transport.castlegraphics.com/dis ... =68&pos=28

http://transport.castlegraphics.com/dis ... p?pid=2183

http://transpressnz.blogspot.com/2017/0 ... 2-6-2.html

One of the Northern Pacific engines survives.

http://trn.trains.com/~/media/images/ra ... p-2435.jpg

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.p ... 20&nseq=73

An Eastern road that went in for 2-6-2s, at least for a while was New York Central, primarily through the Lake Shore & Michigan Central.

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/locobase ... ilroad=nyc

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... 907%29.jpg

The Lehigh Valley had the only Camelback 2-6-2s on a Class 1 road:

The Lehigh Valley engines were rebuilt as 4-6-2s; with another series, these were the only Camelback 4-6-2s built:

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/locobase ... ailroad=lv

As built:

https://sites.google.com/site/camelback ... 01-016.jpg

Rebuilt as a 4-6-2:

https://sites.google.com/site/camelback ... 03-014.jpg

There was one other Camelback 2-6-2, a small engine, in some ways like a logging engine, built for a coal company in Virginia; it wound up on the roster of the Norfolk & Western, where it became the only Camelback and the only 2-6-2 on that road. (No photos or statistics locatable on line)

Possibly inspired by the NYC and others, the Pennsylvania Railroad dabbled with a pair of experimental 2-6-2s. These two engines were among the very few on the PRR to have been built by Alco:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylva ... _class_J28

http://prrsteam.pennsyrr.com/images/prr7453.jpg

It's surprising how many roads had the type, some in large numbers.

Generally speaking from what I've read, though, most were not considered greatly successful, even though a lot of them had long lives. One of the things that was considered less than ideal was ride quality. The two wheel lead truck was found not to be as stable as a 4-wheel lead truck at the speeds these engines were intended to run, some had a shorter wheelbase that gave tracking problems partially due to the main rod being connected to the second driver, placing its dynamic action near the center of the locomotive and causing more hunting than was desirable. In the case of the Northern Pacific engines, they were said to be top heavy, causing problems from that source.


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 Post subject: Re: ATSF 1108 Moved to New Location in Ardmore, Oklahoma
PostPosted: Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:21 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 5022
J3a-614:

Interesting info. Thanks for the posting!

In addition, other roads that operated in "Granger country" also had 2-6-2's including the Chicago Great Western, The Milwaukee Road and even the Soo Line. On the other hand, I don't think the Chicago and North Western ever had any. I believe that the Southern Pacific also owned a handful. The logging road 2-6-2's had this same wheel arrangement as the other ones previously discussed, but were a different animal as they were built with low drivers for a completely different job.

Les


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