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 Post subject: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:50 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 9:05 pm
Posts: 674
Location: MA
I came across this video on facebook films by an infamous railfan https://youtu.be/Wp2pdEijRL0 from what I've seen and pictures posted elsewhere of that crossing the whole situation is just asking for a collision. Joe public does not expect a train to change course and cut in front of them. What do you guys think about this situation. I know if I was in charge I would have that crossing flaged.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:19 pm 

Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 6:30 pm
Posts: 97
Location: Illinois
Whoever designed that crossing and whoever currently runs the railroad obviously wants cars to be hit. I'm not too knowledgeable about regulations for things like that but I'm almost certain that it's breaking some sort of violation to not have at least a flagman.

Stupid, stupid, stupid orange...

Thomas Dyrek

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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:36 pm 

Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:22 pm
Posts: 41
Location: Northwest Indiana
Wow!


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:56 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 3:01 pm
Posts: 1442
Location: SouthEast Pennsylvania
I wonder why the engine horn was making noise?


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:58 pm 

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:35 pm
Posts: 70
Maybe if he was paying attention to the road and the crossbucks at that crossing and noted that the train is sounding it's horn, it might be easier to put things together.

Crossing information states the last (and only) incident that took place at this crossing was over 20 years ago while the train was shoving and that the motorist stopped then pulled out in front of the train.

As motorists we are taught that if you see a train approaching a crossing you must yield to the train. As train and enginmen we are taught that if you are shoving through a crossing crossing without active warning devices, you must provide flag protection. The the engineer in the video was pulling (engine first) through the crossing and displayed headlights and sounded the horn 15 to 20 seconds before entering the crossing and complied with the letter of the law.

Operation lifesaver, law enforcement, and railroads maintain the stance that "Joe Public" should expect at train in any direction at any time.

So in short, I think it would a bad idea to start flagging it in this situation, lest the public always expect a flagman any time the crossing is used from either direction. A lawyer would have a field day with a railroad that "sometimes" flags a crossing when it's not required.

It's disappointing that "railfan" who is at all familiar with railroad operations would even post the video with such claims. It is also noteworthy that within 6 days of posting the video he had to disable comments, presumably because viewers did not share his opinion.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:05 pm 

Joined: Sun May 15, 2005 2:22 pm
Posts: 1214
There is a crossbuck passive crossing marker there along the road just before it reaches the crossing. I don't see a reason why a driver should not yield to the train in anticipation that the train might cross there.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:16 pm 

Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2005 1:27 pm
Posts: 369
Location: Milford,Mass
Hi
Just watched the video, yes I do agree, they should have been crossing gates or flashers, but the way the video was shot, you are only seeing it from the left-hand side, or drivers side.
We are not seeing the video, from the right-hand side of the car, so they had to be a set of crossbucks, showing the crossing coming up, but we don't see them.
The engineer was blowing for the crossing, and his bell was ringing, on the locomotive, the train did not all of a sudden change its route, magically. The route was already set either by the Train dispatcher, or the company.
Now as for the car, crossing in front of the locomotive, the engineer was blowing for the crossing, the driver of the car was not paying attention, just interested in the chase.
So (IF) there was an accident, at the crossing, but they wasn't, it would have been caused by the car, not stopping for the crossing. Because the engineer was blowing for the crossing.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:27 pm 

Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2017 3:13 am
Posts: 11
JimBoylan wrote:
I wonder why the engine horn was making noise?


Sounding the horn some distance back is (or certainly was) required in the regs to announce the train is approaching the level crossing and now has right of way. In the video, the train driver has acknowledged the car by waving to him, but is probably not expecting him to then be such a dill and ignore the stop sign. Hence the more insistent horn blowing!


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:32 pm 

Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2014 11:12 pm
Posts: 101
At the 3:05 mark you can see from the back of what is appears to be a stop sign before the crossing.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:58 pm 

Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:29 am
Posts: 214
Well, this guy is more than a bit oblivious...
Having been thru that crossing many times, there's a cross buck on the right side of the road...and pavement markings before it...
The engineer appears to be waving at him to stop, not just saying hi...
It's common for people to run in front of the train at this crossing... I've had a few close calls there, but speeds are low, only 5-10 mph... So not much chance of really hitting such morons...


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:44 pm 

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:18 pm
Posts: 2099
havent seen the video yet but its all the same arguement. Its like trying to explain we never landed on the moon. If you can't understand your drivers ed, you can't drive a car, and your not going to find yourself stopped on a railroad track waiting for a train to hit you.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:22 pm 

Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:20 pm
Posts: 130
Google Earth views show both a painted road warning and a cross buck......playing chicken with a train is always a stupid idea.


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:55 pm 

Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2017 2:37 pm
Posts: 32
Nothing wrong with the performance of the engineer nor a need to flag the crossing.

This appears to be the new Tavres, Florida tourist train and they diverge around a wye during their trip. Because is was a forward movement and the engineer had clear visability it was the driver's responsibility to obey the passive warning of the stop sign and crossbuck. In addition the engineer correctly began operation of the bell and his correct whistle caddence atleast the required (by FRA) 20 seconds before entering the crossing.

I thought from the conversation here that someone was making a blind shove (no shove protection), with cars and no one riding the point which certainly is not the case. Nothing at all wrong with safe movement of the train and no need to stop/flag the crossing. In addition, for the few times a day these moves are made across this street it would be cost prohibitive for the city/state to have to to install, LGB (lights, gates, bells) protection.

Drivers be ware, avoid self induced distractions and alway look out for trains.

exprail


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:55 pm 

Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2017 2:37 pm
Posts: 32
Nothing wrong with the performance of the engineer nor a need to flag the crossing.

This appears to be the new Tavres, Florida tourist train and they diverge around a wye during their trip. Because is was a forward movement and the engineer had clear visability it was the driver's responsibility to obey the passive warning of the stop sign and crossbuck. In addition the engineer correctly began operation of the bell and his correct whistle caddence atleast the required (by FRA) 20 seconds before entering the crossing.

I thought from the conversation here that someone was making a blind shove (no shove protection), with cars and no one riding the point which certainly is not the case. Nothing at all wrong with safe movement of the train and no need to stop/flag the crossing. In addition, for the few times a day these moves are made across this street it would be cost prohibitive for the city/state to have to to install, LGB (lights, gates, bells) protection.

Drivers be ware, avoid self induced distractions and alway look out for trains.

exprail


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 Post subject: Re: Railroad crossing blame game.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:11 am 

Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2014 11:12 pm
Posts: 101
So I found the spot, and lo and behold there are markings and signs. This is an idiot who froths a bit too much from the mouth at the sight of trains. https://www.google.com/maps/@28.8021456,-81.7214756,3a,75y,268.43h,63.25t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sV1XrZm0jtML-JObL9c2Giw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656


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