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 Post subject: GSMRR #1702
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 6:05 am 

Back in April, there was a thread here that said the the Great Smokey Mountain Railroad's #1702 had to have the roller bearings on its driving axles replaced. They had been installed only a few years earlier and should have lasted MUCH longer.

Did anyone ever get any details of this replacement and/or why the bearings are thought to have failed?

Thanks in Advance,
Hugh Odom

The Ultimate Steam Page
whodom2001@yahoo.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: GSMRR #1702
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 7:33 am 

> Did anyone ever get any details of this
> replacement and/or why the bearings are
> thought to have failed?

Have seen a couple of theories on the failure, but nothing definite.

I'm told they're in the process of going back to crown brass, but I don't know any details.

JAC


  
 
 Post subject: Re: GSMRR #1702
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 2:46 pm 

Just by luck I came across the article linked below today. The bearings are Timken AP and according to the article they were supposed to last 500,000-600,000 miles.

It would be interesting to know how many miles it actually ran with them. I also wonder if there were any problems with the pony truck bearings.

Roger

> Back in April, there was a thread here that
> said the the Great Smokey Mountain
> Railroad's #1702 had to have the roller
> bearings on its driving axles replaced. They
> had been installed only a few years earlier
> and should have lasted MUCH longer.

> Did anyone ever get any details of this
> replacement and/or why the bearings are
> thought to have failed?

> Thanks in Advance,
> Hugh Odom


Timken Bearings Aid Locomotive Restoration
Belpaire@aol.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: GSMRR #1702
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 2:51 pm 

Let me try that linking stuff again.

Roger



Timken Bearings Aid Locomotive Restoration
Belpaire@aol.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: GSMRR #1702
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 3:09 pm 

This may sound strange, but TVRM rolled USA #611 (poppet valves) into East Chattanooga Shop and dropped its #4 driver to retrieve a driving box. GSMR will cast all new boxes using the 611 as a pattern to replace 1702's modified boxes. The 1702 wheels are in St. Louis for axle replacement.

Tennessee Valley Railroad
sfreer@tvrail.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: GSMRR #1702
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 4:28 pm 

> This may sound strange, but TVRM rolled USA
> #611 (poppet valves) into East Chattanooga
> Shop and dropped its #4 driver to retrieve a
> driving box. GSMR will cast all new boxes
> using the 611 as a pattern to replace 1702's
> modified boxes. The 1702 wheels are in St.
> Louis for axle replacement.

Sure sounds like they are going back to conventional bearings. I surely understand the reasons for it but I hate to see it. Seems like if Timken were consulted on the conversion they would be willing to help them out on fixing it. Of course, this may be like lots of other things lately- Timken may have forgotten how to design a roller bearing installation for a steamer in the last 50 years.

Speaking of #611, if TVRM could just see fit to restore the only remaining U.S. locomotive with Franklin rotary cam poppet valves to service, my depression over the loss of 1702's roller bearings would be completely eliminated. :-)

Hugh

The Ultimate Steam Page
whodom2001@yahoo.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: GSMRR #1702
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2003 4:36 pm 

This is pieced together from acouple of reports on how the conversion was made. I don't know how accurate it is but it does identify acouple of problems.

The axle diameter for a locomotive that size would be in the 10-12 inch range. The largest AP bearing is the G class which has a 7 inch diameter. So right off the bat there is a major undersizing of the bearing. Granted the capicity of the bearing is probably more than the wheel loading of the axle one must also consider the forces imparted on the axle from the rods.

The wheel centers were removed and the axle ends turned down to accept the bearings. A bushing was machined to remount the wheel center on the now undersized axle. The bushing adds another location of the wheel to slip or turn on the axle.

I have no idea or reports on what was done with the hub liners. did they maintain the originals? or did they expeart the AP bearing to handle it. I would imagine that if they expected the bearing to take the load that oce something loosened up that the engine would pond itself to pieces rather quickly.

It's an interesting idea but judging from the repairs being undertaken that something wasn't up to the task.


  
 
 Post subject: Re: USA 611
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2003 11:45 pm 

> Speaking of #611, if TVRM could just see fit
> to restore the only remaining U.S.
> locomotive with Franklin rotary cam poppet
> valves to service, my depression over the
> loss of 1702's roller bearings would be
> completely eliminated.

What would you have the "due date" to be? JK
Send money! NK
TVRM is in the middle of a locomotive restoration but it is not USA 611. SR 630 is stripped to the bone...and then some. This is a major undertaking, both in financial investment as well as labor allotment (combined paid staff and volunteer). As with all museums, TVRM would love to have every steamer in its collection restored to operating condition. This is just not feasible nor realistic. When will 611 be under steam? Definately after 630. Probably after 5288. Possibly after 10, 349 & 4501. And of course the "other option": never. We'll have to wait and see. All donations to TVRM are tax deductible. Call us right after you win the Publisher's Clearing House Sweepstakes! We want to be your friend.


Very out of date TVRM shop updates
sfreer@tvrail.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Lottery Tickets
PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2003 6:51 am 

> Call us right after you win the
> Publisher's Clearing House Sweepstakes! We
> want to be your friend.

Ain't it amazing ... It would seem that nobody in "this business" has ever won the lottery! Or have they won the lottery and promptly forgot about "this business" ????


lamontdc@adelphia.net


  
 
 Post subject: Re: 5288 to be a PS-4?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2003 3:23 pm 

> What would you have the "due date"
> to be? JK
> Send money! NK
> TVRM is in the middle of a locomotive
> restoration but it is not USA 611. SR 630 is
> stripped to the bone...and then some. This
> is a major undertaking, both in financial
> investment as well as labor allotment
> (combined paid staff and volunteer). As with
> all museums, TVRM would love to have every
> steamer in its collection restored to
> operating condition. This is just not
> feasible nor realistic. When will 611 be
> under steam? Definately after 630. Probably
> after 5288. Possibly after 10, 349 &
> 4501. And of course the "other
> option": never. We'll have to wait and
> see. All donations to TVRM are tax
> deductible. Call us right after you win the
> Publisher's Clearing House Sweepstakes! We
> want to be your friend.
What are the plans for the 5288? I witnessed the loco pass through Morristown,Tenn on a flat car a couple of years ago on it's way to TVRM.Back then I heard it was to be made in to a PS-4 replica,are those plans still a go?If so would it be possible to make a streamlined shroud like the #1380,The Tennessean engine.I feel streamlining would hide the differences in the CN and PS-4 look.

WINK638@aol.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: USA 611
PostPosted: Sat Jun 07, 2003 10:15 am 

Hey Steve,

I said that about the 611 purely jokingly. I didn't have much idea TVRM would ever consider restoring it.

I realize most people would rather see all those other engines running rather than one more 2-8-0. Personally, I'd love to hear the crack of the exhaust from a poppet valved steam locomotive at least once in my lifetime.

Guess I'll either have to win the lottery and send some cash to TVRM or find some way to make it to the UK and hear the Duke of Gloucester run one of these days.

Regards,
Hugh

> What would you have the "due date"
> to be? JK
> Send money! NK
> TVRM is in the middle of a locomotive
> restoration but it is not USA 611. SR 630 is
> stripped to the bone...and then some. This
> is a major undertaking, both in financial
> investment as well as labor allotment
> (combined paid staff and volunteer). As with
> all museums, TVRM would love to have every
> steamer in its collection restored to
> operating condition. This is just not
> feasible nor realistic. When will 611 be
> under steam? Definately after 630. Probably
> after 5288. Possibly after 10, 349 &
> 4501. And of course the "other
> option": never. We'll have to wait and
> see. All donations to TVRM are tax
> deductible. Call us right after you win the
> Publisher's Clearing House Sweepstakes! We
> want to be your friend.


whodom2001@yahoo.com


  
 
 Post subject: Re: 5288 to be a PS-4?
PostPosted: Sat Jun 07, 2003 1:00 pm 

I think the plan is to convert it into a PS-2. The 5288 is to small to be a PS-4.

jhbohon@yahoo.com


  
 
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