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 Post subject: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:56 am 

Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2004 11:27 pm
Posts: 303
Location: Texas
What happened to the Rock Island's Pullman-built 2700-series commuter coaches? Are there any left in existence today?


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 11:39 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:35 am
Posts: 8139
Location: Wilton, NY
I don't think any survived, but here's the place to ask, the Rock Island Technical Society's active RITSlist:

http://www.simpson.edu/~RITS/aboutrits/ritslist.html

Many of the CRI&P's earlier "Al Capone" commuter cars from the 1920s did survive, however, and can be found at tourist RRs and museums.


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 Post subject: Reviving thread from 2005!
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:47 am 

Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:20 pm
Posts: 448
Adding to a 2005 thread...

Folks who check the Ozark Mountain Railcar site know there is actually a survivor of this type of car (RI #2702) currently for sale (link). Its condition actually looks pretty good.

Noticing the "Crazy Cleve's Game Train" sign on the car, I googled a bit to see what I could learn. Turns out it was an early 80's video game arcade business with multiple locations in Kansas. The name was trademarked, until cancelled in 1989.

A 11/29/1981 news article about the arcade in the Salina Journal is titled, "Former Herington resident wants to remember the passenger car." I guess this business owner was a sort of rail preservationist! (link)

If you're a coin collector, it looks like you can even find a Crazy Cleve game token out there (see attached).

A Trainorders post from a few years ago has some information about car 2702 when it was an arcade (link).

In any case, let's hope someone continues this preservation project that Mr. Crazy Cleve started. As RYPN member, Mr. Cornillie, pointed out (here), the car could offer an air-conditioned ride to visitors at IRM and make a very nice addition to their collection.

If a reputable place like IRM took on the car, I'd be happy to insert coins into the project.


Last edited by rock island lines on Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:48 am 

Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:20 pm
Posts: 448
Air conditioned comfort to Chicago.


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 10:14 am 

Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:19 pm
Posts: 47
Back in 2005, you likely would have been told that there were likely no survivors from this group of cars. Rosters showed that they were sold as a group to a scrapper at one time and there were photos of them being moved and ultimately scrapped. There are a few books that mention these cars - and their history ends there. Unfortunately this isn't uncommon. Illinois Central's 1920s Electric MUs were scrapped in large groups, the PRR's P85 coaches were scrapped in the early 1970s. As we speak the entirety of former PRR and Reading Silverliner II and III Electric MUs are being scrapped.

The only reason that the 2702 survives is that Gordon Schultz, the person behind "Crazy Cleve's" was able to make a deal with the scrapper to purchase a few cars. He clearly had preservation in mind as he adapted them for use as arcades while retaining the trucks, and some interior fixtures (some seats, window shades, lighting fixtures) which can still be seen on the car today - and even repainted the car in an authentic Rock Island paint scheme.


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 12:51 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 4996
So, is there any interest being expressed by IRM to at least look into acquiring the 2702?

Les


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:20 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2010 12:39 pm
Posts: 28
Les To answer your question in one word: No! As I have told a couple of other people, no one at the museum wants to spend the time moving it at little cost to Irm or no one has stepped up to pay for the move. If it was an electric it probably would have been here by now but middle coach dept management is not interested in going out of state to move any piece of equipment. This will take a lot of money! Anybody willing to donate what's needed, step up and send the check to IRM marked 2702! That's the bottom line. Roger


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:32 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
Posts: 4996
Roger -

Thanks very much for your reply. It seemed like IRM was a "natural" spot for the 2702, but if they are not interested, then so be it. At least we now know where they stand.


Les


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:54 pm 

Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:20 pm
Posts: 448
My read of Roger's post is that IRM might be interested in 2702 if someone or some group offered to substantially fund the purchase and moving cost.

Common sense says this outside person or group would need to talk to the IRM executive director to get an agreement spelled out in writing before any monies are collected from donors.

It sounds like there is no one internal to IRM interested in driving the project, so an outside leader needs to step up.


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:58 pm 

Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 12:58 pm
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Location: Chicago USA
If it was CB&Q, C&NW, or MILW, (the IRM holy trinity) there'd be no question about it. Interest declines the more counter-clockwise on the map you go.

Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:30 pm 

Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 6:45 pm
Posts: 253
rock island lines wrote:
My read of Roger's post is that IRM might be interested in 2702 if someone or some group offered to substantially fund the purchase and moving cost.


Plus pay for the track it would occupy. I forget what the current charge per footage is; somewhere upwards of $75 per track foot.

If somebody wants IRM to aquire this car, they need to come up with funding (Acquisition, transportation, track space, and restoration) and a reasonable proposal and present it to IRM's Board of Directors. That is the only way it will happen. It would substantially help if active IRM volunteers were recruited to support the project.

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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:36 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:45 am
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Location: Illinois
filmteknik wrote:
If it was CB&Q, C&NW, or MILW, (the IRM holy trinity) there'd be no question about it. Interest declines the more counter-clockwise on the map you go.

Steve


Says ONE man, and ONE man only, about an organization that runs a Frisco steam locomotive, CRI&P and DL&W passenger equipment on a regular basis, as well as occasionally running CSS&SB & IC MU cars. (how much farther "Counterclockwise" can you get?)

Your continuing allegations of bias are unfounded in fact, and are (in Wikipedia terms) "Original Research"

Jeff

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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:13 am 

Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 6:45 pm
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Jdelhaye wrote:
filmteknik wrote:
If it was CB&Q, C&NW, or MILW, (the IRM holy trinity) there'd be no question about it. Interest declines the more counter-clockwise on the map you go.

Steve


Says ONE man, and ONE man only, about an organization that runs a Frisco steam locomotive, CRI&P and DL&W passenger equipment on a regular basis, as well as occasionally running CSS&SB & IC MU cars. (how much farther "Counterclockwise" can you get?)


Jeff, He is NOT the only one who says that, I've heard more than a few people make that remark.

Take it as a joke and move on please.

Back to finding a place to preserve 2702 please...

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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:52 am 

Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 12:58 pm
Posts: 1195
Location: Chicago USA
I've never asserted it was a museum only of these three lines. (They went all the way to TX to rescue an SP steam locomotive that was in danger.) I simply stated -- on topic to this thread -- that they'd (we'd -- I am a member there) want these cars if they were from one of those lines. Whether funding could be arranged is another matter but they'd be working on it, not well maybe we'll consider it if someone else picks up the tab. Surely no one seriously doubts this.

Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Rock Island commuter equipment question
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 11:30 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 1:51 pm
Posts: 8354
Location: Baltimore, MD
The allegation, perhaps more succinctly phrased, is, I assume:

Quote:
If it was CB&Q, C&NW, or MILW,

then there would be drive and momentum from within the volunteers and shakers to acquire the car.

That, to my eye, is not a "slam." That's simply a statement of (at least perceived) reality, probably based as much on the geographical location of the IRM, and thus its core of volunteers and members after 50 years, than any inert bias or "Rock Island/IC/Monon/etc. don't get no respect." I would expect the reverse "bias" if the IRM had set up in, say, Chicago Heights, Flossmoor, Gary, or New Lenox.

Should that car end up there? It probably fits their core mission better than a good deal of the stuff that's already there, and there darn well SHOULD be momentum from within to save that car from both a mission and operational standpoint (air conditioning!), as unattractive as it may be. But I can't tell them what to do, and if the support isn't there outside the Museum to save it, so be it. Is there a Rock Island Technical & Historical Society? Maybe Monticello, as IC-focused as they may be, might step in and be more supportive?


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