I am wondering about the advantages/disadvantages of HEP vs individual generator sets on excursion consist cars. Anyone have any experiences/information that might help?

Thanks,
Boyd Owens

ddg14@attbi.com

Boyd,

With HEP,whether it is locomotive or power car, you have an all or nothing proposition. Also, on some railroads the power car will cause a problem with siding or runaround access, due to length of train. Also, if you have to runaround with a HEP locomotive, the train will be dark during the runaround.

The method used quite sucessfully at the Western Maryland Scenic Railroad is to use individual Stadco generators, but size them large enough and have the proper switchgear to have them able to feed two or three additional cars. This gives redundency if a generator fails, plus the occasional new or guest car that has HEP only without a generator may be used. The MARC Train Service business car is set up the same way, so business development trips may be made on the State owned shortlines without having to send an HEP locomotive out of the commuter pool.

This is a slight commercial plug, as I work part time with Bob Jackson of NW Rail Electric, who is the leading Stadco dealer in the US and Canada. But there are plenty of satified customers out there who have gone this route.

> I am wondering about the
> advantages/disadvantages of HEP vs
> individual generator sets on excursion
> consist cars. Anyone have any
> experiences/information that might help?

> Thanks,
> Boyd Owens


NW Rail Electric Stadco Page
SZuidervee@aol.com

Boyd,

There are some other very significant issues that enter into the mix:
1. The kind of excursions that you have in mind. Are you going on a long distance outing or just a 10 mile tourist turn-around?

2. Are you interested in lights only, or lights heat and/or air conditioning.

3. Are you a diner train with heavy electrical cooking or warming loads.

4. Do you operate in a location with extreme temperatures during your operating season.

Frankly, the maintainance of multiple generators can be an expensive time consuming matter. If your operation does not need heat or A/C, or only needs it for one or two cars, a Stadco mounted under one of your cars should be sufficient with a very simple single conductor trainline. Remember the loads on most cars are greatly exagerated.

There is no simple answer. Most Amtrak certified PV's carry the own generators in addition to the significant HEP cabling that AMTRAK requires.

If you can get away with one or two Stadco sets, it is the easiest and least expensive way to go. But it all depends on your load, and the nature of your operation.

Each of the E-8's we restored has two 350 KW Detroit diesels in them and have the switchgear to be parralled. We have decided that the paralleling switchgear is unreliable and too tempermental and will undertake a program to upgrade the HEP to one 500KW generator. We have never ran with more than one 300 KW on line. We have hauled an 16 Car train with with 13 Amfleets and 3 PV's and just about reached the capacity of the one generator. The trip was run in April in Pennsylvania. Due to the high "People Load" air conditioning was operating but there was a natural diversity so all the compressors did not start or operate at the same time.

There is a lot to consider before making a decision. To be careful to fully define your needs and your operation and then you will find a solution based on cost of System A v. System B. The truth might lie somewhere in between.

v-scarpitti@att.net

It is hard to give you better advice than Steve or Bennett but having built a consist a few years back from bits and pieces on a shoestring I would recommend having at least two seperate power sources available on your train. Redundancy is a fine thing, and much cheaper than the cost of having your train not run while the sole power source is getting overhauled or replaced.

Once you have determined what your operating needs are, the system to serve them will be more evidently logical.

Dave

First, let me say that I hate generators. Second, let me say that we have not found anything as satisfactory for high loads. Wooden passenger cars and generators don't mix but the demands of the ever more sophisticated and pampered public require electricity. We use STADCO gensets on two of our first class cars. We have an automatic switching circuit that allows each car to be powered by the trainline if the generator fails. The trainline is normally powered by whichever generator goes on line first. This year we are switching to a 3 phase trainline which will allow us to take more circuits on the car with the non-operable generator. To date we have had enough power for critical circuits only.

Another of our first class cars is set up with batteries and an inverter. We have no onboard mechanical charger. This car has lights and fans only and the batteries will last 8-10 hours with no charging during that time. The batteries are charged by the trainline when on a train so equipped. This has been a very nice compromise to avoid the noise and maintenance of a generator. We have explored the use of this system on our higher demand cars, but at this time it is not feasible.

We have a pretty strict maintenance schedule for our generators, and STADCO makes an excellent product. That being said, we still have the occasional malfunction which never, NEVER occurs at a convenient time. For that reason, I would recommend a second power source whenever possible.


linnwm@supernet.com

Just wanted to say thank you to everyone who provided the all great info about HEP/individual car generators.

Boyd


ddg14@attbi.com