> I (should've)known about the dec-must be gettin' old! Just curious-did it ever get shipped to Russia or was the order cancelled and the engine kept stateside?


Superheater@rrmail.com

And Melbourne Tramways is the unhappy owner of an unconsciounable number of redundant cars they want to dispose of but legally can't. Moves are afoot to remove the restriction.

Recently, after a couple accidents, the last W5 cars were removed from service for "unsafe brake systems" - basic self lapping straight air. They were well maintained, and have worked beautifully for over a century. Seems the current tram drivers couldn't all be bothered to learn to use them properly, however.....so more unsaleable cars joined the rust fleet.

I love the W5 cars for use in US old style trolley lines.They are built like battleships and those wide side doors allow for ADA accessibility without carving up the carbody.

Dave

> Let's think about the steam engines that ran
> on American rails before being sent
> overseas.

The Turkish State Railways "Skyliners" were tested in pusher on the Lehigh Valley around Wiles Barre Pa. Would that count?

In shipping 22 went courtesy of a LV 4-8-4 and a set of EMD FT pushers as well

Superheater@rrmail.com

Cobwebs and piles of paper cluttering up my brain but I could swear I was sent a letter probably 15 years ago by a group in Rome NY offering Turkish skyliners for sale. Were any successfully repatriated, and are they still available?

We seem to get along well with Turkey at the moment - possibilities?

Dave

In 1917 the Russian revolution was underway, the US decided Russia was no longer a friend, and stopped shipment of the last 200 decapods,including FRISCO 1630,nee USRA 1147 (leased to and operated by the PRR) . I doubt Russia ever gave back any railroad equipment!

Interestingly, since the locomotives were built to a 5' track gauge, extra-wide tires were applied to the wide-gauge wheels for use in the U.S.to get the flanges narrowed to standard gauge, so self-guarded frogs don't work!

pjslks@ix.netcom.com

> Cobwebs and piles of paper cluttering up my
> brain but I could swear I was sent a letter
> probably 15 years ago by a group in Rome NY
> offering Turkish skyliners for sale. Were
> any successfully repatriated, and are they
> still available?

> We seem to get along well with Turkey at the
> moment - possibilities?

There was a post on here a while back which had a link to a museum in Turkey-they did save a couple-not sure when revenue steam ended there.

However, we are amassing tanks there because of common border with Iraq. If you heard the news today, the Franco-Prussian attempt to set aside he mutual defense provisions of NATO for Turkey, might give them something more to worry about- for the moment.



Superheater@rrmail.com

> For the same reason we in the US
> can no longer get Melborne streetcars--no
> problem on this side, but the Australians
> decided after a while to put a stop to that
> form of selling away their historic
> patrimony.

I understand the Australian law is that if an item is in the country for 25 years then it is part of their heritage and cannot be exported. A couple of years ago, a British 4-6-0 managed to be returned to England in its 23rd or 24th year in Australia. It almoast did not get the chance to return home.

Brian Norden

bnorden49@earthlink.net

> And Melbourne Tramways is the unhappy owner
> of an unconsciounable number of redundant
> cars they want to dispose of but legally
> can't. Moves are afoot to remove the
> restriction.

> Recently, after a couple accidents, the last
> W5 cars were removed from service for
> "unsafe brake systems" - basic
> self lapping straight air. They were well
> maintained, and have worked beautifully for
> over a century. Seems the current tram
> drivers couldn't all be bothered to learn to
> use them properly, however.....so more
> unsaleable cars joined the rust fleet.

> I love the W5 cars for use in US old style
> trolley lines.They are built like
> battleships and those wide side doors allow
> for ADA accessibility without carving up the
> carbody.

> Dave

It's a bit unfair to acuse the drivers of laziness - more likely the operators were too lazy to put effort into training.

The W cars are returning to service after modifications to the braking system including the fitting of magnetic track brakes, roller bearings and deadmans control. The main problem was not the original braking system - as dave said it worked perfectly for years. The problem was the fitting of automatic slack adjusters to "eliminate" the need for daily checking and to make the cars more appealing to potential purchasers of the transport system when it was privatised by our warped previous state government. The slack adjusters didn't work properly, no-one maintained the brakes and the odd collision or two was the result. The foreign owners wouldn't take up daily adjusting of brakes and the knee-jerk reaction was to ban the cars. The mods are going in at govt cost - so who gains by privatisation eh? - certainly not the people. But we're getting our revenge, the people are showing their contempt for the previous gov't sacking all the conductors, selling the system to foreigners and installing very unfriendly auto ticketting systems by not paying fares. Already one foreigner has cut his losses, broken his contract and pulled out. The other isn't far behind. (the avoidance figure is quoted in the 20%+ range)

The legacy is that while we had this ludicrous duopoly, they each pursued their own equipment acquisition policies and we now have two sets of new trams (and trains) to maintain and keep spares for - and guess where they came from, local manufacture? no way - imported from the home countries of the foreign owners - now you're getting close!

the situation with the stored W cars is that there is a warehouse full of hundreds of them, displaced by new builds, but unable to be scrapped because of the heritage "greenies" nor able to be sold off. I don't think it is a no-overseas-sale but just a no-sale situation. I understand that they are deteriorating and are unlikely to ever run again anyway. Some day they'll be quietly cut up I guess.

Thanks El - I wasn't aware of the larger political situation. Condolences. Provision of transportation as a private profitable venture isn't too often a reality without seriously damaging the quality and quantity of service as we have seen upover in the airline industry recently as well as AMTRAK.

Damn shame if the remaining Ws all get cut up - we could certainly absorb a couple dozen at least, and of those too badly damaged to restore, we could certainly use a lot of mechanical and electrical gear. Our W5 sits on Boston tunnel motor trucks!

Dave