> To operate trolleys and conventional RR
> equipment you will need a temporal
> separation arrangement with the steam RR so
> the trains and the trolleys do not share
> track at the same time. Fixed signals need
> not be part of the package. The Engineers
> License is not necessary and is not an FRA
> requirement.

> The FRA rules were published in the July 10,
> 2000 Federal Register at 65 FR 42528–42553
> and the joint FRA/FTA policy statement at 65
> FR 42525–42528 The Federal Register site is
> on line at
> http://www.access.gpo.gov/su_docs/fedreg/a000710c.html.
> Scroll to FRA or FTA then select text or
> pdf.

> If there's room, you may find having a
> separate track is a better idea than getting
> into a temporal separation arrangement.

> Track safety and other FRA regulations are
> an entirely different matter.

Operations in Canada are verify similar. Ottawa Ontario will commence a light rail transit test starting August 2001. These "Talent" railcars will operate on an exCPR (actually leased)line through the center or the city. All the operators have been trained and certified. The limited freight operation can now only proceed between midnight and 06:00 when the commuter service is not running. The "Talents" need several waivers to run and normal rail equipment cannot be on the line at the same time. There is still an interesting question surrounding a diamond with VIA that the train will operate over. Running mixed equipment on the same line is a real no-no up here as well..........Paul


paul.bown@sympatico.ca

Good Luck with your project. The P&SR holds a portion of my memory. Every year my family would "chase" it when we went to our summer cabin outside of Ocidental. Of course it was diesel by then.
I tried to find out what happened to the narrow gauge stuff a couple of years ago but only found out that it wound up in "some guy's garage" in Marin. Any one know any more?
Tom

ironbartom@aol.com

Mike - Thanks for the post. Yes, we will need to apply to FRA for permission to operate on shared use trackage and that petition will need to address what they call temporal separation of train operations between Petaluma Trolley and NWP. But we will not have to comply with locomotive certification regs, per the FRA Statement of Policy published July 10, 2000 regarding shared trackage by light rail and regular rail.

Temporal separation turns out to be a simple principle to apply, as discussed in that FRA document. Basically, FRA expects petitioner to define a window of operation for each carrier. They specifically mention dark time for NWP switching plus a daylight window when NWP can switch. We ought to be able to reach agreement with NWP on that issue.

Allen

> Before you proceed, you might want to talk
> to the folks at the new Lackawanna Trolley
> museum which operates over part of
> Steamtown. My friends tell me that this was
> of great concern to the FRA. It was
> eventually decided that the motorman has to
> be a licensed engineer and the tracks had to
> have something called temporal separation.


alantacy@neteze.com

Brian - Petaluma Trolley models its proposed operation on that of Western Railway Museum at Rio Vista. WRM considers itself FRA regulated, primarily because it crosses public roads. We will cross public roads and install electronic signals too. Point is that WRM has a good relationship with FRA. WRM says that FRA absolutely requires compliance with regs govening Hours of Service, Couplers and Draft Gear, Brakes, and Safety Appliances.

If you read the FRA Statement of Policy July 10, 2000, you will see reference to compliance Track Safety standards. WRM says local FRA won't touch that, but CPUC does inspect their track. Obviously we will need to have a sit down with FRA here.

There's an exemption in the FRA reg for passenger equipment that allows historic trolleys to operate without modification over FRA regulated track.

I've heard that OERM operates on Santa Fe track. The Los Angeles folks might want to talk to OERM.
In our case the NWP freight switches on the industrial lead we need to use just once a day and Saturday is the only day of the week there would normally be operational conflicts.

Allen

> A couple of throughts:
> Besides the new Lackawanna Trolley. the soon
> to start up operation of the Los Angeles
> harbor department using replica trolleys
> will operate over FRA trackage. I don't know
> the specifics but it appears that there is
> an application to get the equipment exempted
> from some of the FRA regs.

> The way I understand the FRA regs to
> determine an insular (non-regulated) vs
> regulated railway; if you run parallel
> within so many feet of a FRA railway you are
> not insular. Likewise if you are within so
> many feet of a navigable waterway. If you
> have a crossing with a public road you come
> under the FRA.

> Brian Norden


alantacy@neteze.com

Tom - Most of "the narrow gauge stuff" moved to Santa Rosa 20 years ago with the same guy. I've no idea what the plans are.

Allen
-----------

> Good Luck with your project. The P&SR
> holds a portion of my memory. Every year my
> family would "chase" it when we
> went to our summer cabin outside of
> Ocidental. Of course it was diesel by then.
> I tried to find out what happened to the
> narrow gauge stuff a couple of years ago but
> only found out that it wound up in
> "some guy's garage" in Marin. Any
> one know any more?
> Tom


alantacy@neteze.com