Do or should you use detergents in boilers? Is so what kind? Would laundry soap or dishwasher soap work? Inquiring minds want to know...

Seems to me as though that would cause major foaming....

Slightly different, but all I can remember is back in my teen years when I put two bottles of dish soap into my parents hot tub, and filled the entire deck, and driveway full of foam...

I can only imagine something similar happening inside the boiler, and with foaming, once it starts sucking down the dry pipe, it will not only put you at risk of hydro-locking, but also suck the water out of the boiler like crazy.

What exactly are you trying to accomplish with detergent or soap?

Obviously there are boiler chemicals designed to remove scale, and chemicals keep the water safe and balanced for the boiler, but why detergent or soap?!?

What is the purpose of adding detergent to your boiler. What are you attempting? If it isn't neutralized then you could have some serious foaming issues as another poster mentioned

NO. Trust me on this one. I have been doing water treatment on steam boilers everyday for over 30 years and think I can safely say this is not something you want to do. What are you looking to do exactly or what information are you seeking? I would be glad to answer any questions you might have if I can help you. Send me a PM so we don't clog up the works in here if you want.

W.

..... thus assuring your future RyPN screen name?

Sorry, couldn't resist. <:-)

I know all about the foam! :)

No, nay, never! Call your local boiler treatment company or send me a PM and I'll be happy to get you some information on boiler water treatment. I am a stationary engineer, locomotive fireman, and train people on boilers for a living.

Phosphates (an ingredient in some soaps) maybe...But regular detergent? Images of a locomotive with bubbles coming out of the stack (as in Willy Wonka or something) come to mind.

Phosphates are used as a water softener in boiler water treatment. Phosphates react with the alkalinity of boiler water, these products neutralize the hardness of water by forming tricalcium phosphate, and insoluble compound that can be disposed and blow down on a continuous basis or periodically through the bottom of the boiler.

Bruce Mowbray
Springville, PA

From a recent thread re: ATSF 4-6-2 in Kansas, italics added for emphasis.



So here is a recent example of the use of detergent in a boiler(?).
Wesley

Rug Doctor in a boiler doesn't work either.

Other substances you don't want to get in boilers are milk (BEEEG foamy mess),sugar syrup (blown tube in heat exchanger bundle leaked sugar syrup back through condensate,looked at gauge glass and boiler water was pitch black from carbonized sugar) or water from a fire engine tanker with a product called "SLIP", a water anti-friction additive. Ask anyone who rode the infamous 24 hours of R&N 2102 trip a few years back to Jim Thorpe about this one.

One of the ways of cleaning a boiler - is a "boiler wash". This is NOT done with detergent or soap. I worked for a national water treatment company for 30 years or so - but not directly in this area. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but, here goes: Boiler water treatments should be designed based on the type of water you use (hardness, magnesium, calcium, clorides, sulfates, etc), and the metallurgy of the boiler. There is a whole industry built around utility/industrial boiler water treatments. Many of these companies got their start treating the feed water going into steam locos in the 20's and 30's.

Suggest you contact one or two reputable national water treatment companies for advise/recommendations. There may be companies that specialize in steam loco's - don't know - but its kind of a limited industry.

Same thing with diesel cooling systems. Proper additives are based on hardness/feed water content - and the metallurgy of the system being treated. These same companies are probably able to recommend for that as well.

Bob

I thought soap was a bad idea. I once put a small bottle of Dawn dish soap in a laundromat machine to help clean my greasy pants. I returned about an hour later to see foam out to the street. It was cool. I left the pants. I see the issues in locomotives but have heard of this in recent news, 3415 I believe it was. Just curious and thank you to everyone who chimed in.

On a side note, What would excessive oil in the boiler do? I understand that is why the 3415 used soap in the first place. How would you get the soap residue out?

The oil from tapping, reaming, etc., is just de minimus compared to the damage from adding detergents. Wash the boiler out good with plain high-pressure water after the rebuild, add the recommended treatment for that boiler for filling - different from the daily treatment, of course - secure it and fire it up.

Where there was excessive accumulation, say, on firebox sheets, we have hand-wiped oil away with highly evaporative solvents. But that is it. Better yet, use a good tapping compound that is not oil-based and there won't be the problem.

Oil in a boiler is probably not a good thing either. Heat transfer from metal/water will be impeded by scale formation (which is why scale is bad), foam (which provides an air layer - and impeded heat transfer), and anything else that would form a film on the metal surface of the boiler that impacts heat transfer. Most boiler treatments enable a thin coating of a passivated metal oxide to form on the surface of the metal.

Scale is bad because not only can it hurts heat transfer - but because corrosion can occur unchecked (and inaccessible to treatment compounds) underneath the scale.

Again, not an expert - and suggest that you contact a reputable water treatment company

Bob