All,

We are looking at trying to move an Alco S1 from the Norfolk area to our site outside of Raleigh and are looking at the option of trying to move it by rail. Since it has friction bearing Blunt trucks, we would have to temporarily replace them with a set of roller bearing trucks.

To date, we have tried Johnson Railway Service, Knoxville Locomotive Works and East Tennessee Railcar, but cant seem to get any calls back. Does anyone know of any other companies in the area that may be able to assist or would be good to contact?

Thanks in advance!

Have you tried McHugh Locomotive and Crane?

Have not yet, but I will pass them along to the project lead so he can. Thanks for the suggestion!

Cheaper, faster, better way:

Put the unit on a depressed center flat car and remove the trucks and ship as two units. We have done this a few times and I would provide you two options. A.) We would bid it and do the job for you start to finish or B.) I would be happy to coach you through the process to get it done.

I can tell you, even if you find replacement trucks, unless that are designed and fit for the unit, the Class I's will be reluctant of taking the unit with "idler trucks". We have gone this route and this is why I can tell you from experience, you will be faster and cheaper to put it on a flat car and move it. Also, NS, UP and the other big guys are now requiring alignment control couplers which your unit may not have.

Happy to help.....if you hire us or not!

Kindly,

I agree with John. Put it on a flatcar. We've had it down a number of times with no problem. Remember Reading 2100 was shipped over 2,000 miles on a flatcar without a problem and it is a huge engine.

Edit: I almost forgot. The Waterloo Central Railway in Southern Ontario had their S3 shipped on a flatcar two or three years ago.... http://waterloocentralrailway.com/solrs ... locomotive

Put it on a flat car?

A few years ago, I was involved in moving an Alco S1 on a flat car. The cost just to have someone tie it to the car was $12,500. This did not include the cost of the 2 cranes at each end, the HIGH RENTAL of the flat car or the shipping rate.

The main problem facing moving this locomotive is that the Alco S1 does not have alignment control couplers, but these can be installed.

One thing to consider. If you purchase a set of roller bearing trucks or convert your own, you will still have them. It may cost you a little more then the cost of moving the locomotive on a flat car.

Much depends on the railroad handling the move and their inspectors.

I recently lost a locomotive sale to a customer because the locomotive I was selling did not have alignment control couplers. When the customer's new locomotive arrived, it did not have alignment control couplers. Even though the class 1 had a policy of requiring alignment control couplers, they allowed the move with "Rubber Alignment Blocks" and these were hanging under the pockets when the unit arrived.

There were some roller trucks around before, but the renting parties were not returning the trucks to their owners in a timely manner, so they quite loaning or renting them.

WHAT?!! No offence, but you were burned my friend! It can be done a lot cheaper than that, especially if you are a registered charity. If you know how to talk to the right people it can be loaded and even shipped for a reasonable cost and even some cases next to nothing. We've done it.

I moved an Alco S6 a few months ago on a set of idlers. One of my service providers welded blocks in the coupler pockets to satisfy the alignment control issue. It cost me more to move the locomotive on CSX than it cost for the cranes to do the truck swap.

There is a pair of blunt idler trucks on Rail Swap that will cost you less than the two cranes on each end of the move plus the flat car rigging. The only "engineering" required is to modify the side bearings to bring the S1 into spec.

If you want more details, my cell number is 301 268 7436.

Rob, we've done this many times too ( one steam locomotive and a bunch of passenger cars).

However, consider the possibility that the locomotive or car is on the other side of the country, assuming it's even in your own country.

Given the logistics of getting enough of your volunteers grouped together for a sufficient time (can they use vacation time without impacting their family?), with housing and transportation, arranging crane service in an unfamiliar location (and having enough trust that they will bring the proper slings, spreaders, etc.), and the need to either transport your tools, rent, or buy new, that $12,500 starts to look like a bargain.

You might get very lucky and have a friendly group willing to help at the other end, but being able to drain their resources for the move could be difficult too.

A couple of years ago we were considering a couple of very desirable cars from CP in Alberta, but didn't pursue it for these very reasons.

Steve Hunter

Mr. k5ahudson:

My job was not a charity job, it was for an industrial customer. Not-for-profits get big breaks from the right parties.

I was involved in moving a steam locomotive some years ago by rail with a non-profit group, I will never go through that again. Getting people who would comitt for the job was a major problem. Then we had to purchase all the material to tie the locomotive down on one flat car and the tender on another. We had to use "cold rollled steel rod" at that time, bend and thread all the rods, weld tie downs to the flat cars and the locomotive/tender, railroad tie blocking, welder on site, 2 cranes. It ended up taking 6 days on site 900 miles from home to do that job. One of the flat cars came in with damage. The railroad official on site told us we could repair the car if we wanted to or he would send it to the riptrack and could not tell us when it would return. We repaired the car at our cost so we could get the job done.

The $12,500 quote was from a firm that would guarantee their work and that the railroad woul except the loading and tie down. This also included all the material to do the job, other then the 2 cranes.

It was an Alco S1 locomotive and it was also not necessary to put it on a depressed center flat car or put the trucks on a seperate load.

I believe that there is a photo on the internet of the locomotive tied down to the flat car and in transit.

The locomotive was the former D&M Alco S1 #646.

You should talk to JC McHugh at McHugh Locomotive and Crane for sure. They've been doing this sort of thing for decades. They are great people and understand and have been involved in preservation as well. Email JC at: jcmchugh@verizon.net

Thanks everyone for the ideas, suggestions and experiences with doing this. Like John alluded to, going by flat car seems to be slowly becoming the better option, especially when considering the issues that could come up regarding the alignment control draftgear, which this doesn't have, and the other comment about the cost of working with CSX.

We will look into McHugh and were also given the Atlantic Locomotive LLC as they have done some work on a SW1000 near us in Winston-Salem.

I was wondering why you all even considered rail shipment to Bonsal. As far as I can tell, you don't have a live connection to the adjacent CSX line, so you would have to truck it from somewhere else and crane it off. So you'd still need a pair of cranes and a truck even if you could ship it on its own wheels. Talk to Earl Pardini up at the Catskill Mountain RR. His group moved an S-1 from Staten Island up to their place by truck a couple of years ago. Talk to the folks at Supor Trucking in New Jersey or Dailey Transportation in Pennsylvania. They do this kind of stuff all the time.

CMRR purchased the S1 (407) that was on Staten Island, and provided volunteer labor to disassemble/reassemble the locomotive, but wasn't involved in the logistics of the move itself. Supor bid also, but it was 3 times more than what it actually ended up costing using other methods.

Correct on no live rail connection to CSX, but we have access to a siding that is about a 1/2 mile from our site and are also fortunate to have a member who owns a crane company. We just recently were given this option and is why we are looking at different shipping options.