mxdata,

That is interesting I always thought those would be the same engines used in a diesel locomotive. Out of curiosity what would be the difference between a diesel unit for locomotives vs those for power production? I always assumed the same units used at the plant would have been used on locomotives, as well as ships.

I know that with turbines for example when building the buyer needs to specify what type of grid power he needs. Is it 60cycle, or 50cycle, as the speeds they run at governs their construction. I would assume that power units for electricity need to be governed very well, does the same hold true for a diesel electric, or does the motor's speed vary with the locomotive? What would make the two units so different?

As for the units usage, they were indeed peakers I can guarantee having seen them come on twice that summer. The whole plant that they were located at was a 1950's vintage oil fired steam units that existed more for capacity at the end of the line for high usage days. The plant itself is only fired some 30 days a year too, and has one 150MW as well as one 400MW, however starting those takes 8hrs, so when 5 or 10MW is needed with in 10-30mins the EMD units in a box come online.

If these units are of any significance they are probably more common then you think. I actually know of at least one other big power plant that has maybe 6 of them in use primarily more so as peakers then as black start. Existing power plants near larger populations often make great platforms to place peakers, as the land, and transmission, are already often already in place. I have also heard that just cause they say these can start the plant black start doesn't mean they really can. The power company I worked at had 2 plants that were black start certified. However during the great northeast power outage in 2003 was it? Both plants failed to start. Apparently from what I have heard most of the system relies on the hydro for its true black start capability. There I have been told most plants either have a crank operated sluice that runs a small turbine, or they have a gas pull start generator that can open a smaller sluice gate.

Adam

No doubt. That's older than government itself. But it's not environmentalism's fault, in the same way that grade crossing accidents aren't really the trains' fault.

I think a lot of it is government functionaries in offices that approve things, trying to make themselves important. Just look at all the trouble railroads have with zoning and building permits.



I'm a smog control geek. I'm installing a '97 engine in an '83 car, in California.

OBDII was made mandatory by law for 1996 model year cars.

OBDII cannot detect emissions at all. Yes, you read that right. Its oxygen sensors can only detect presence or absence of oxygen. Using them to trim an engine to stochiometric is like steering a ship down a river blind except for an alarm which beeps when you are off course to starboard.

Those smog testers at the local garage can only detect HC and CO, not NOx, so they can't detect a car that's running lean. And they test at unrealistic conditions (idle and high idle).

In metro California, there are advance testers with dynos that can detect NOx, but only 2WD cars can run on the dyno and then only at 25 mph, still not representative of real driving conditions.

So as you can see, measuring emissions accurately is >>MUCH<< harder than you think, and very much a black art. That's why they overlap several methods of testing - sniffer test, OBDII and underhood inspections.

But I've now gone WAY off topic for this list :(

Re: EMD stationary power plants. When I visited the Western Pacific Museum at Portola CA, one of the members mentioned that the local power company had some EMD generators in the town as backup, especially for winter when snowstorms would take out the transmission lines. One place where at least one EMD is always "on" is Catalina Island (music fans may remember "Twenty Six Miles") off the coast of Southern Calif. I went to visit the Edison Co. power plant on the east side of the island, and as I came around the bend heard a sound usually associated with SD-40's climbing a hill. Yes, the speed must me closely regulated, even when the load changes (unlike a locomotive). There was aso a Fairbanks-Morse diesel on display from way before the "opposed-piston" era. About 20 years ago I worked in the Vernon Diesel plant, which used German-designed marine type diesels (much too big for a locomotive). What was interesting was the "black start" engine--a natural-gas fueled Winton V-12! I was told that if the whole system went down, this engine would power the air compressor to make enough pressure to start one of the big diesels. From there they could start the other four machines. Definitely a worst-case scenario! (normally the plant would be started from outside connections, and it only ran during peak load periods). Note: the plant went first went on line in 1933.
Bob Davis
So. Calif. Edison (retired)