I think this raises an interesting question of how much information about projects should museums and organizations post on the internet?

Anyone know 630's statistics: Boiler pressure, cylinder diameter, driving wheel size, tractive effort etc.......etc.........

Thanks Andrew. So she is quite a bit more powerful than 610 and just a wee bit bigger size wize, maybe good for 8 to 10 cars on the Chattanooga to Summerville trips.

It seems very interesting to me that with a minor exception or two, no one here is part of the TVRM staff or a regular volunteer. Disclaimer: I am not currently active, but have been very much so in the past, including during the last years of 4501's service and the last significant work done to her. I do not speak for TVRM or anyone there, though I do keep in contact with several folks there. It was and is where my heart is with regard to preservation (though part of me can't seem to leave Roanoke out). Mr. Merriman and Mr. Soule built something in Chattanooga that became greater than both of them, thus its survival today. Ms. Green, Gold, and Immortal has obviously inspired more than a few of us (including one Mr. Moorman) and I am forever grateful.

That being said, yes, 610 has been running for the better part of 20 years, but she has had some lengthy out of service periods for 1472 inspection, new rear flue sheet, new corners, lower side sheets, door sheet, running gear work (it's a LOT easier on an engine that is square, trammed, and not completely worn out). Yes, she will need some work, but they all do from time to time. Her time at TVRM has not come close to putting her in the shape that 630 and the Famous are/were in.

The Famous will need the amount of work appropriate for her intended service - will that be on the order of kicking around selected locations for display and PR close to home or multi-week romps to the far flung ends of the NS? I'm not sure even NS is completely certain at this point. Not being critical, just noting that there are many as-yet-undecided details that seem to be remaining.

The Famous does have many, many improvements that have been made piecemeal as she served the Southern, NS, and TVRM. 26L brakes, tender, front flue sheet, Master Mechanic's front end, main bearing temperature sensors, ash pan, and the list goes on and on. She will need firebox work, some course pitting repair (as a result of the newer part 230) and at least some running gear work. The plague of hot driving journals has a solution, though it has only been implemented on the #1 driver. There is a second pair of new crown brasses that are cast and on hand ready for machining and installation, leaving 4 more to have made. With the wheel shop machines available and close at hand, a quick run for all drivers through at least the journal lathe and possibly quartering machine for a light clean-up cut would be in order. Could use a new pony truck wheelset and go all out with pedestal truing, shoes, wedges, springs, frame bolts, equalizers, and so on, but the driving boxes and crown brass for #2, #3, #4 and the hub faces for #1 drivers are the primary sources of need for the running gear. A thoroughly repaired boiler and the most pressing running gear work would make a reletively reliable runner for a year or two, then return for upgrades to running gear over a 8-10 month period including a winter. The bottom line is money - I hope the NS Foundation will be generous in its handling of TVRM (as it has been in the past).

Best to all,
Mike

Working for Cornelius Beaver
Elkhart, Indiana

To go along with Mike's last post. It doesn't surprise me that there aren't many people from TVRM commenting here. I have read and don't know how true it is that TVRM knew about the 21st Century Steam program for a while but had to sign a confidentiality agreement until the press release was made on June 30. Plus the fact that none of the locomotives planned on being used are ready to operate yet, with the exception of 610 which is getting close to the end of its running time before its boiler inspection.

Furthermore, the much rumored coaches that I have heard NS has purchased probably have to be upgraded and painted in Altoona. I don't personally expect to hear anymore official news until 630 is within 24 hours of making its first test run on TVRM trackage. I know a lot of people are still speculating at this point and especially what this new venture means for the 2 N&W engines at the VMT, but it remains to be seen how successful the program will be and I'm sure the board of directors at NS will evaluate it from time to time to determine if it is worth continuing and whether or not to expand it (i.e. implement larger locomotives and a larger schedule).

As far as 4501 goes, I hope that her running gear problems can be relieved. I know the last 4 years from 1991 to 1994 that she operated, it was hit or miss actually seeing her on the train as diesels or occasionally TVRM 610 would substitute as motive power. She only made a few trips in April and May of 1994 before she was sidelined, missing a scheduled appearance at the 1994 NRHS Convention in Atlanta alongside the 611 and Frisco 1522.

I have been following this post too...looking for TVRM to comment. A lot of local people have been wondering "who is going to run the museum when everybody is out playing choo choo on the mainline"? And "how are they going to get even one choo choo running when it takes them 7 years to restore a coach"?

None of these thoughts are mean-spirited or terse, mind you. But TVRM is just not known to do anything fast nor to do much advance planning. For example: I cannot remember a year when they did not say "the 630 will be finished in 6 months". I have no idea why they have NOT finished by now...certainly I have never restored a choo choo to operating condition. Some factual comments from them would be interesting.

I think members would especially like to hear some clear answers from the operating team. I think members would like to know how (or if) they can get involved. It seems like they might want volunteers? Yes? No? Maybe?

So this is not meant to be terse or snarky...just looking for some real answers.

By the way: Beavers BITE!

T7

I guess I am wondering why you think its important for anyone from TVRM to post an official reply here? This is nothing but a bulletin board where rumors seemed to get turned into fact overnight. I challenge you to offer proof any official TVRM press release announcing the 630 would be finished in "6 months". I am not aware of such a release. You're probably referring to more rumor mill stuff.

By the way, if you want to speed up the restoration of some of any project discussed on this board, then send your favorite restoration project a huge check in the amount of thousands of dollars.

I understand that NS will be launching a website soon that may include a live webcam of the TVRM shops. Once this site is up and running, all of you should get perodic updates.

Mark,
Your comment is right on the money, not just for TVRM, but for most of the railroad restoration projects in this country. The vocal majority seems to comment for the industry, even though they themselves are not actively or major financially involved. I always had high hopes for this board to not turn into a typical railfan board, but alas it is strongly headed that way.

Mike Tillger

So Mike, how would you suggest we proceed to prevent it from becoming a typical railfan board. Because I really, really don't know.

Doug

As the June 30th press announcement indicated, NS "is in negotiations with" TVRM. It would be inappropriate for TVRM staff to engage in public commentary about the NS steam program until the final contract details are settled. That being said, I belive everyone at TVRM appreciates the excitement in the railfan community that this announcement has generated and as Mark indicated above, NS intends to launch a web site later this year that will keep you informed about "21st Century Steam."

Also keep watching the TVRM web site for further information about next year's Fiftieth Anniversary events, including the Labor Day weekend Tennessee Valley Railfest.

Alan Maples
TVRM

Interesting. As my questions went more towards what would happen to TVRM "when everybody was out running choo choos on the mainline" and so fourth. No doubt NS knows what they are doing. My questions are about TVRM operations. As a non-profit educational organization with lots of dues paying members you would think members would know what was going on and how they could get involved.

Again...this is not snarky or mean. These are valid and honorable questions.

So I should wait for a NS webcam to find out how a volunteer can get involved? Interesting.

By the way...the "6 months" is the standard fare told to crowds on the local who come over to the shop to see what is going on. I hear it every time I ride the local. Words mean things.

Hugs not drugs.

T7

On the subject of whether TVRM should be posting here or not:

In ANY line of legitimate business I've been in--heck, probably in any illegitimate business as well--the party with the money does the talking.

ALL the talking.

If you have to come back and say, "Er, we found we're going to have to replace the boiler first..." or "Sorry, but the only place we can get the flue material is North Korea now..." or whatever, you are under contract to say that to the party offering the money to lease or buy your locomotive or services. Not the public.

If a Hollywood studio wants to lease your railroad to film a movie, somewhere in the contract it will most likely specify how much you can say about it, and when. (If it doesn't, check the credentials and see that the check cashes--it's probably not a real studio.) If they are OK with the publicity, you can blabber or blog all about how Meg Ryan and Harrison Ford (or Justin Bieber and Lady Gaga, whoever) filmed a "steamy" scene on your train and operation that week. More likely, you're under a gag order until the studio authorizes publicity.

A certain party on this board was famous for quoting the World War Two propaganda slogan "Loose lips sink ships!" You could note with some irony that he violated his own motto recently, with slightly embarrassing results..........

Linn, Kelly, and crew: Can you loan your infamous "chalk" to the TVRM folks? <:-)

[For those who don't get the reference: When Strasburg began work on N&W 475 years ago, they finally had to chalk "DON'T ASK WHEN!!!!" on the boiler as it sat out behind the shop for months/years......]

Whatever TVRR does will be done well and it will take whatever it takes and however long. I'm not at all concerned about their ability to watch their own store while NS runs some leased power away from home, neither should anybody else on this or any other list be. A partnership between TVRR and NS brings together a lot of real world expertise and can make what they want to happen happen. What they want to happen and how.........we will be told in due course.

FWIW, Indian Railways just finished a 3 month rebuilding of a 155 year old Bury boilered 2-4-2 hulk missing most of its running gear, by trial and error fitting, using engineering staff with NO steam experience, and she is now undergoing shakedown runs with a schedule of operations planned. They have national standards and practices and a legacy British bureaucracy to contend with.....we have it almost easy in comparison IF we stop shooting ourselves in the foot and being our own worst enemies.

Leave these guys alone and let them do their work well in peace.

dave