Those 8 axle QTTX flats will cost almost $1000 a day or more to rent. You're talking almost $30,000 for two cars for 14 days. Then there's the cost of a crane company in LA and IL.

It would cost more to flat car than it would to run it.

Maybe TTX will make a deal for a good cause.

In 2009, CSRM shipped ATSF 543, an H12-44TS former Dearborn Station switcher and a Winton V-12 to IRM aboard a QTTX. I have no idea about the costs but the fact that IRM was able to leave it on their interchange track for about 2 months until it was convenient to unload suggests that it was unlikely the clock was ticking at $1000 a day for anyone.

Steve

Demand for the equipment elsewhere might play a part too, don't you think? When something heavy gets moved can be as important as how. It could be TTX had no pressing need for the cars. There are even occasions when storing equipment on a museum siding is a win-win.

Also, the beginning and endpoint make a difference. If you have to rent a crane and pay an operator, the picture is different from being able to go to a crane on off hours when it has to be manned but isn't doing much.

How to make money on the way, how to lessen the impact of liability insurance, how to defend again the "one part of the company says yes, one says no" problem--they're all part of the equation. This is not only about 3751, or this year, or Trainfestival. If we ask the right questions now, things will be easier in years to come. If we don't, they won't.

Becky,
I liked your post and found it relevant to the discussion even though someone else shot it down. Moving 3751 and other steam (like 734) via flatcar is becoming more of a necessity and may be the only solution for some steam in the future for events like Train Fest.

If there was a way to have a flat that could be loaded with a ramp (i.e. Best Friend of Charleston), that would save the need for a crane at both ends. A piece of equipment like that may exist, I'm not sure. I do appreciate the discussion of what could be done even if it won't be done.

So many on this board are so quick to say "it can't be done" or "it's cost prohibitive and therefore can't be done". They may be correct but optimism sometimes helps overcome barriers.

Finally, I believe there is value to BNSF in having ATSF 3751 in Rock Island. In the end, that may help win the cause.

OK, at the risk of being flamed and/or being called a wet blanket, here's a question to ponder...

Why bother?

3751 is an incredible engine, don't get me wrong. Trainfest is a wonderful event, and I wish them all the sucess in the world. But here's the issue I see:

Running 3751 to Trainfest with a train full of passengers creates lots of excitement, and also hopefully some revenue as well...

Hauling 3751 to Trainfest, whether by rail, barge, or a fleet of blimps creates lots of effort and expense, but no revenue.

Is there no other engine closer that would also be a worthy addition to Trainfest? Yes, I know, 261 is out of service, but there's no big steam closer than L.A.?

Financially, it would appear that shipping her is a non-starter, unless there's some very significant revenue to be made at Trainfest. It would APPEAR that the group would be better served by investing the money in running trips in the Los Angeles area again, or even a trip up the coast a ways.

How about this? 3751 from Los Angeles to Sacramento, then the passenger train continues on to Trainfest from there as part of a regular Amtrak train and/or a special but diesel powered. No idea is it's possible, just a wild concept....

No need for a ramp. Take a double ended siding at XYZ facility. Cut it, excavate a hole in the ground and lay some temporary track from your existing siding down to that lower level. Simply push the unloaded or loaded car into the hole and roll your equipment on or off from the other end of the siding.

Chris Vitz

That works for loading. What about unloading? What about when you need to load in more than one location?

It's usually a lot cheaper to build a ramp track on temporary cribbing/fill than it is to dig a hole in the ground, lay the track, etc.

However, in both cases, you may find that crane rental, even though expensive, ends up being cheaper than creating a hole or ramp track, and it also eliminates the problem of the equipment getting hung up or high centered on the ramp track or hole track.

No matter what option you choose, it's adding more cost to an already expensive proposition.

It's easier to justify if it's a long term relocation rather than a short visit.

> A piece of equipment like that may exist, I'm not sure.

Sure, lots of MOW crews have them for easy loading and unloading. They're not that hard to find.

Oh, you want one rated for a 4-8-4? Yeah, well, that's not so easy.