Kelly,

I have heard the same thing from ajax, everytime in the last 7 years I have called them to get a quote or place an order for tires I have had to argue about getting anything other than DHT. Their statement has been "DHT is good enough for UP and the burg, that's all we sell them, why do you need something different?"

So, you may want to have a chat with them.......

Cheers, Jason

We ordered our tires from Standard Steel if memory serves. They had different grades of HT to offer.

I don't know about any damage...I just happened to be in MtPleasant this morning doing inspections when they left town with an abbreviated consist, and, other than the thing seemed to be trying to prime some, there didn't seem to be any clanks and clunks other than the usual.

Since we are speculating-this guy, who does have the advantage of being there, seems to think they welded up the flat spots.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abYDr4GoVvA

also a supposed news release on the 844:

"HEARNE, Texas – Union Pacific 4-8-4 No. 844 has been sidelined with mechanical issues in Texas and has been replaced, at least temporarily, by UP’s A-B-A set of E9s. The locomotive encountered difficulties at yesterday at Mount Pleasant, Texas during a tour of the south central U.S. as part of UP’s 150th Anniversary celebration. The 844 arrived at Mount Pleasant Sunday from Texarkana, Ark., but was unable to continue to stops in Big Sandy, Tyler, Athens, Corsicana, Thornton, and Hearne, Texas. Reportedly the locomotive developed flat spots on its driving wheels, but UP would only say it had “mechanical issues.”

Union Pacific spokesperson Raquel Espinoza told Trains News Wire “We are addressing mechanical issues with the driving wheels on number 844 and we hope to have them fixed soon. The (steam) crew has been working pretty hard, and we just hope to have these issues addressed in the near future.”

To continue the tour, this morning UP dispatched its E9s, which were in the area on a business train, to take 150th Anniversary car Promontory to Hearne, where it will be displayed until 5 p.m. If No. 844 is unable to continue, the E9s will pinch-hit for the steam engine tomorrow, with the train scheduled to travel from Hearne to Austin, Texas.

This morning No. 844 departed Mount Pleasant but stopped again near Pittsburg, Texas, only about 11 miles from where it started. Espinoza said UP would continue with its planned community celebrations in Texas regardless of 844’s status, with the E9s pulling the train if necessary."

Back in 1975(IIRC) SP 4449 was pulling the American Freedom Train and had flat spots and was sent to Council Bluffs, Iowa where carbide brakes shoes were applied. It was carefully run back and forth to true the tires. Later it doubleheaded westward with the 8444.
I chased it from Fremont, NE to North Platte, about 220 miles.

ASTM A-551 "Standard Specification for Steel Tires" is the standard for railway tires in the US. It identifies seven classes of tires, Class A, AHT, B, BHT, C, CHT and DHT. The standard I have is dated 1988. The standard identifies the requirements for each class of tire and also makes service recommendations.

I believe this standard was developed when AAR dropped M-103, which was their tire standard.

From what i hear all 8 drivers are going to be dropped and returned for turning, 844 will be dealt with at the nearest big shop that can handle this work whilst the E9's will handle the rest of the tour until 844 is ready to proceed.

Mike

In 1975, 4449 was sidelined by an ICC inspector because of its flanges. A Lidgerwood tool was used to correct them. I was not there but that's what was reported. (See Dec. 1975 TRAINS.) According to Jack Wheelihan, the tread was cut too, in order to create more flange to profile to proper shape.

Here is a Lidgerwood cutter. I have no expertise in this area but I think the problem with something like this is lack of control. To correct flat spots you want to remove metal to the same level as the middle of the flat spot and unless there is some sort of adjustable stop something like this is going to move inward on the flat and cut there metal too. Not to mention the need to match all drivers as precisely as possible. So a lathe is far better.

But think of the work that could be saved if there was a way to precisely cut driver tires in situ. If such a thing doesn't exist it should!

Steve

Such a thing does exist, but I have no idea how many of them there are (if any) in the U.S. The Hegenscheidt underfloor wheel lathe allows turning of railway wheels while still installed, and is in fact what American Coal Enterprises intended to use.

http://www.simmons-albany.com/group/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=129&Itemid=146

Railway underfloor wheel lathes have been around for a long time (at least since the 50's) but what's different is that the Hegenscheidt allows centerless turning of the wheels. This would allow the drivers on a steam locomotive to be machined without dropping them or disconnecting the rods.

Now, obviously the trick would be that the drivers not being machined would have to be jacked up to clear the rails (probably not that difficult to accomplish) or you'd have to have 4 of these lathes in a row so that all wheels could be machined simultaneously.

We had one of these (or something similar) when I worked for the Chicago Transit Authority, installed in the then new Rosemont shop on the O'hare line. It did both axles of one truck at the same time.

I also recall that when the Wisconsin Central Ltd. took over the Soo Line shop at North Fond du Lac, they lengthened one bay of the roundhouse and installed something similar. IIRC (and I only saw it once, briefly, while on tour) it could do all three axles of an SD-40 truck concurrently.

I would think, if the machine wasn't located at the absolute end of a track like the WC machine was, that one could do steam drivers in place, one at a time, by dropping the rods, but there may be other technical issues that make a wheel lathe a better choice.

There are stories that the C&NW used a Lidgerwood outfit at 40th St. to maintain the wheels on the locomotives in commuter service. I think the key was doing it often to keep high flanges and tread wear under control. I suspect that bad flat spots required a trip to the wheel lathe.

The Heigensheit (sp?) would be a good fix but the only way to do it with a steam engine would be to drop the rods. Lotta work, but could stop the pounding headache till you got to the main facility. Just have to remember to turn all drivers to same dia.

There exists a similar cutter for diesel locomotive flanges. I once assisted in the re-profiling of flanges of a diesel locomotive in this manner: The truck was jacked up so the wheels of one axle were just off the rail and the apparatus firmly bolted to the frame. The traction motor leads were disconnected and, when all else was ready, connected directly to an arc welder's leads. This caused the traction motor, and wheels, to turn at a fairly consistent speed. The cutting points were then used, carefully and slowly, lathe-style, to turn the tread/flange as needed.

Basically, you turn the wheel/axle assembly into a giant lathe.

The contractor who did this on this particular loco had done this with many short line and industrial locos around the Eastern Seaboard, I was told. As much as it looked and seemed like a solution straight out of the Fiddletown & Copperopolis or Toonerville Trolley, I was told it was pretty much standard operating procedure, and easier than arranging to send a loco to a major railroad's shop when it probably wouldn't be accepted for interchange anyway because of the defects being turned in the first place.

It is well documented that streetcar operators occasionally would repair minor flat spots they caused by applying sand with brakes set with power on while car was in motion. That way they wouldn't get blamed for causing the flat spots.

Streetcars often used wheels with hardened treads. The hardening was not uniform thickness all around the wheel. When the hardened tread wore through into the softer metal underneath, the wheel would develop flat spots where the metal was softer.

I was once involved with using wheel truing shoes on a Los Angeles Ry streetcar at Orange Empire Ry Museum. There were some serious flat spots of about a couple of inches of each wheel. The end result was that the Cast Iron wheels became oval because the grinding shoes smoothed out the corners of the flat spots more than they took down the rest of the wheel tread.

Here is what can be readily searched out online, they have a cutting shoe as well which utilizes a carbide insert for cutting the flange only. I couldn't find anything which is capable of cutting (versus grinding) across the entire tread.

http://www.wheeltruing.com/styles.html