trackage rights

TheYardLimit · **Joined:** Thu Mar 03, 2016 2:04 pm **Posts:** 4

ctjacks wrote:

This question gets asked frequently on sites such as these - should this go in the FAQ section?

First, starting with a loaded passenger train, not a deadhead/empty train move: when this question gets asked, it usually is along these lines: "Railroad X has trackage rights over CSX or UP, so can that railroad operate a steam excursion over CSX/UP?" The short answer is, CSX or UP would never allow that to happen. I doubt CSX would even allow a detour of 10 feet over their tracks with a loaded passenger train these day. And it is unlikely any other railroad would allow an excursion via trackage rights either.

Second, regarding deadhead moves, it needs to be clarified that deadhead moves are completely different animals than loaded passenger trains. With the exception of CSX, most railroads are approachable about deadheading an empty train, even with a steam engine. Again, I highly doubt CSX would ever allow a steam engine to move over their lines, trackage rights or not. And moving passenger cars over CSX is increasingly a non-starter as well.

It is an oft-repeated chestnut that JJJ has "trackage rights" or some sort or other agreement to operate over the G&Y ex-OC lines. It is interesting that if he does, he never uses them. And as to if G&Y would ever allow a steam passenger excursion over their lines: from my dealings with them, I highly doubt it.

Chris

It's a moot point now, but NKP 765 has deadheaded over G&W property twice. Back in 2011 it deadheaded over the TP&W. This was about a year before TP&W joined the G&W fold, but they did use the Tazewell & Peoria to get between the TP&W and Iowa Interstate. They didn't have a diesel either. But like you said deadheading is a completely different animal.

Robert Opal · **Posted:** Sun Feb 05, 2017 12:31 am

An interesting subject. Let me give a little more technicolor.

1. Trackage rights agreements are effective in accordance with their terms. In other words, if Railroad XYZ gives trackage rights to Railroad ABC that are broad enough to encompass passenger trains, then that agreement is effective. There are lots of "old" trackage rights agreements which go back to the glory days of passenger service and aren't restricted to freight service. The catch is that the operator of the passenger train must be the railroad that has the trackage rights. In other words, in my example, the passenger train must be a Railroad ABC train and Railroad ABC must take responsibility (including liability ) for the train while on Railroad XYZ in accordance with the underlying agreement. If Railroad ABC is unwilling to treat the excursion train as its own train while on Railroad XYZ, then the trackage rights agreement won't apply.

2. Plain "friction" bearings are permissible under FRA regulations. However, they are prohibited in interchange by AAR rules. But AAR restrictions like this don't apply if the parties to the interchange have made a contrary agreement, In other words, two railroads can lawfully agree with each other to accept "plain" bearing equipment, but they can't be compelled to do so. Also, a trackage rights train on a foreign railroad may not actually be "interchanged" with the foreign road.

3. Running an excursion train as an Amtrak train is often more acceptable to a host railroad than the railroad dealing directly with the excursion operator. The reason is that there is a statutory limitation of liability for Amtrak trains (and also contractual agreements on liability between Amtrak and the host) which may not be otherwise available to a private excursion operator or its host railroad.

Trainkid456 · **Joined:** Thu May 05, 2016 6:30 pm **Posts:** 240

I just thought I'd post this here to inform you of a possible management change at CSX.

A post on my Instagram a couple hours ago stated that this may be occurring on this coming Friday: the president of CP wants to take over CSX. In addition to Instagram, several recently published online news articles have said the same or similar things. However, I doubt if this is going to happen it won't happen this soon.

This whole topic of the CSX/CP merger has been going on for a while now, but if this ongoing talk of a merger in the near future becomes reality, could this mean the new CP lines (ex-CSX) could see steam excursions once again?

Thomas Dyrek

bigjim4life · **Posted:** Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:44 am

I saw this posted to the Ft. Wayne group's Facebook page yesterday and wanted to share it - with both this and with their assistance in Ravenna, KY - it looks like CSX is making baby steps towards being even more steam-friendly again.

choodude · **Joined:** Wed Jun 29, 2016 11:58 am **Posts:** 327

scwillis51 wrote:

FYI, every diesel locomotive has plain bearings between the traction motor and the axle. Plain bearings run the industry, just not holding up the weight of the unit.

For the moment, plain bearings on the axle to the wheels / frame are the big bugaboo. Hopefully we all understand there are many plain bearings in use on any locomotive.

To quote a certain Star Wars villain, "I'm altering the deal, Pray I don't alter it further."

Brian