The photos do not seem to confirm your description of the work done by the County. Prior to the grading work, was this a track with all rail and useable ties removed, and only some unusable ties remaining?

It never ceases to amaze me how these local petty Politicians like to throw their weight around, and cause more harm than good for their communities. How do IDIOTS like these end up in office, anyway? WHY can they not see the benefit of having the rail line INTACT, instead of fighting it every step of the way?

Just keeping tabs on the petitions. As of 11:30 PM on Sept. 6, 2013, the trail people have 1,589, the railroad people have 2,051.

Rail:

http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/ulster ... by=7898224

Trail:

http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/maketh ... l-mountain

Petition signed & forwarded to some like minded friends. Someone needs to teach county officials the rule of law- preferably someone from that county.

You say the County removed 540 of track without your consent, and you are demanding that it be restored. When you say this was done under the guise of bridge repair, you make it sound as though the County removed your track without your permission, and acted under a false pretext. Yet your photographs do not seem to support your characterization of the incident.

Without a clear explanation, it strikes me as an attempt to simply broaden your grievance with the County in order to give it more weight. I suggest it would be wiser to focus your grievance in order to maximize its weight.

Track was intact once week before and now the rail, ties, and subgrade are gone, which is clearly shown in the photos. Why do you say the photos do not support this?

This is what the track looked like beforehand:

http://photos.greatrails.net/s/?p=64037

EH

From another thread:



I've said it before, and I repeat it again, "We don't get no respect, no respect at all," and this Catskill Mountain and Adirondack flap is "You don't get no respect" writ large, underlined, and in bold type, and by so-called "responsible" adults, too.

Having said this, it's notable that the comments sections that follow letters and articles on this in the papers there seem to trend strongly with the railroad. My own opinion of this is that the trail forces are relatively small but well organized and well funded, which translates to political support, never mind how dumb some of it may be. It doesn't help matters that most politicians are so cowardly of someone funding their opponent that they make me look like Audie Murphy.

That's what we have to live with, I'm afraid--always being second-class citizens in the public world. The carriers that have transcended this--Strasburg, Cumbres & Toltec, Durango & Silverton, Cass, and others--have not only had superior management over time, but have had the time to become established and to recover from mistakes. It would be much more difficult to repeat what these companies have done today; very likely many would not even be given the chance if they were starting out new today.

At that, even some of these have had to deal with people who want them to go away; think of smoke issues on Durango & Silverton, New Hope & Ivyland, and Western Maryland Scenic, think of trail issues back in 2004-2005 on WMSR, think of that road that was forced to abandon in Michigan (I've forgotten its name just now) because of real estate developers who didn't want a train running past their sales prospects' back yards, and who accused the road of being a "junk yard" (photos taken just before closure put the lie to that accusation) . .

"WE DON'T GET NO RESPECT, NO RESPECT AT ALL!!"

Respect has to be earned, not demanded unilaterally. Places like the Strasburg, Grand Canyon, Cass, and TVRM have well earned the respect they are accorded. Places like Pemberton.... not so much.

As someone with more than a cursory understanding of bridge engineering and access to a few bridge databases (official and not), I'll ask for more details on the alleged "emergency bridge repair." What bridge? Why? What supposedly constituted the "emergency"?

I'm perfectly aware that this reasoning could simply be a ruse to destroy track with malicious intent. I'm also acutely aware of what constitutes a legitimate "emergency" in bridge parlance--a spalling and failing abutment, potential collapse due to erosion, partial failing into a flood-controlled waterway, striking of an overpass by an overheight vehicle, etc. Is there a "rest of the story" that's being deftly excluded simply to make the county look malicious?

Okay, I understand your original comment now, and the photos do support it. I had initially interpreted you to be saying that the County shoved the track aside in a destructive manner. You said:

"Ulster County (our landlord, who are separately trying to terminate our lease) removed 540 feet of track, ties, and even the subgrade pushing it into the creek to make a ramp."

But now, I gather that they only pushed the subgrade to the side and made a ramp in one place. What I still don't understand, however, is whether the County's action violated an agreement with your organization, or whether it amounted to desctruction of your property.

Well, I really dont know what to make of this now. If the county is outright trying to destroy your ambitions... Something needs to be done, ore we are gonna have another Royal Gorge on our hands... alright maybe not as violent...

That's hyperbole. As I understand it, the county owns the railroad and leases it to CMRR. At best, the County is breaching the lease agreement, provided CMRR hasn't already voided the lease agreement by failing to return 1 mile a track per year into service, as reported.

This isn't a case of a county government coming onto private property and destroying that property.

Hmm, now I understand. But that's still an underhanded thing to do... atleast in my eyes it is.

Well... We COULD get some pitchforks and torches...

Thank you for your grasp of the obvious.

The point I am making is that other tourist and heritage roads, including Strasburg, Grand Canyon, Cass, TVRM, and others very likely wouldn't even get the chance to earn respect today. Others, and I would include Catskill Mountain and Adirondack Scenic, work quite hard at this, and STILL don't get respect from the political and other types who want them gone.

And where was the respect for Western Maryland Scenic when the State of Maryland cut out its support for track maintenance? This was for a railroad that paid its bills and has managed to operate since then without that support. What did the State of Maryland support? A golf course and resort that cost over $30 million to build and couldn't pay its bonded debt, and then incurred an additional $30 million of debt. That $60 million would have done a world of good for WMSR. Where was the respect for their management in providing positive results, both financially and socially in being a tourist attraction?

And while on the subject of WMSR, what about the trail flap there in 2004-2005? Thankfully that got resolved favorably to all parties, but for a while we were threatened with the loss of the WMSR for a trail, just like we are having problems in New York--and this was a railroad with a double-tracked right-of-way. Where was the respect for them then, when they were already well established?

What about the complaints about smoke on the New Hope & Ivyland, the Western Maryland Scenic, and the Durango & Silverton? The last one in particular is world-famous, makes money, is a wonderful heritage railroad, but that didn't matter to the people who foolishly built McMansions on property near the right-of-way. Hell, this is a railroad that OWNS it right-of-way, and it STILL had to deal with a threat of being shut down.

I'll admit to a bit of personal peavishness with this, having attempted a number of things and failed at all of them, and getting nothing in return except insults for one of them. At the same time, though, I do see these carriers and others, some less respectful, others more so as you've noted, going through the same rubbish and more than I did.

Let's admit it, we are "red-headed stepchildren" in the eyes of some of the public and certain politicians, and will never gain the respect or support they pay to pro sports types and others, even when the pro-sports people or big-box store people consume huge amounts of public money for their facilities or in tax breaks. We need to face that and deal with it appropriately. How, I don't know, having been a failure myself, and failing enough that I think my parents brought me up wrong, that being respectful of others wins no respect in return, and is nothing but a handicap.

I can only say this is something we do have to deal with, and it does no good to sweep it under the rug or blame some of the others who may be a source of embarrassment. Recall the nutsos who run around with no shirts and body paint at football games who aren't considered nuts, but just enthusiastic. . .

Saturday September 7th

At Mt. Tremper, Conductor was Ray Farrell, Engineer was John Prestopino, brakeman was Dan Howard, Gary Lowe was Ticket Agent.

In Kingston, John Patane led a crew consisting of Al Schoessow, Jim Bruck, Tyler Carelli, Harrison Balduf, Jarrett May and George Bain. They inserted 24, plated and partially spiked 10, fully spiked one tie.

George Peck led a crew that installed more rails at Campground Curve. He was joined by Franc Libihoul, Neil Remsen and late in the day by Al Johnson.

Al Johnson continued painting CMRR No. 1 "The Duck" at Longyear Siding.

Ryan Lennox continued work brush cutting at 26 curve.


Sunday, September 8th

At Mt. Tremper, Conductor was Bob McDonald, Engineer was Walt Otto, Brakeman was Anthony Bocchino, Car Attendant was George Bain. Gary Lowe was Ticket Agent.

George Peck continued work at Campground Curve.

Mark Glaser led a crew that included Al Schoessow and Tom Whyte. They inserted and spiked one more tie, and spiked all 23 remaining ties inserted Saturday. They estimated 25 more ties to be inserted to complete the 209 extension, and marked 13.

Earl Pardini and Ernie Klopping worked on the backhoe at Cornell St.


Ernie Hunt
Volunteer Coordinator
CMRR