I am also going to add my few cents worth here.

First - Thank you Dave.

I am sure that most of the regular readers here are fully aware that I use a pseudonym on this and several other boards as does my eldest granddaughter. If you search the Bar Registry you will not find a George Edwards, Esq. engaged in the practice of law in the region where I live or the area where my firm is located. That was one of the reasons I chose the name. Both my granddaughter and I have e-mail addresses under the pseudonyms and these addresses are checked regularly. As a rule we will answer most of E-mail's which we receive (at least those which are generated by human beings) as long as they do not ask for specific legal advice.

I use the pseudonym so that the comments which I have made here will not be confused with a position being taken on behalf of client and in my granddaughter’s case the pseudonym is used on the boards where she occasionally posts so that her comments will not in any way be attributed to the jurist for whom she is currently clerking. I am not going to post on a matter which is on our calendar and Meghan is certainly not going to discuss anything which is related to anything being heard in their vicinage.

This simply makes everyone’s life easier and the boards do not get thrown back at us by someone who is trying to confuse what ever the issues happen to be. Imagine what would happen if the Superintendent at Steamtown made an of the cuff remark about the K4 restoration under his own name. We would probably spend many billions of electrons here discussing whether or not he was speaking for the Park Service.

While I do agree with Brother Roland that most of the problems on this board are generated under false names I do not believe that requiring real names will make a difference. A quick sampling of the member list (2 pages, 100 names) shows slightly more than fifty percent using a name which might allow me to find them in the phone book. Only two had enough information to serve a subpoena. We can extrapolate from this that roughly half of the total posts are under some form of identification other than the poster's given name.

Someone who wants to cause trouble can sign in under a different name each time and unless this board were to become a full time job for one of the moderators there would be no way to stop him with out shutting down the board. We all probably know without doing more than glancing at the heading which threads we want to read and which we are going to pass by. I know, for example, that posts by a particular person will probably be links to various photographs which will probably be worth looking at. I know that another name will be a gentleman who seems to share my exasperation with the lunatic fringe of the hobby. I can come up with many others like that. I can also come up with one or two people who will probably be whining about how somebody else should be spending their money and even one person who I think is posting from another planet. Which name is used will not change this.

In the past I have compared this board to a lively conversation in my living room. The fate of western civilization is not being decided here. We are a group with some commonality of interest which gets together now and then to discuss that interest, share information, swap war stories, and if you are not enjoying it - why are you here?

There is however a down side. I was at an industry conference a while back and the luncheon discussion turned to whether fans are a blessing we should be taking advantage of or the second coming of Satan. (There seems to be no middle ground on that one.) One of the people at my table made a very favorable comment on some postings George Edwards had made explaining some or another point of law as it applied to railroads, and I could not accept the compliment!

GME

P.S. Trainlawer is a screen name. George M. Edwards is a pseudonym. A ghostwriter is somebody who you have hired to write for you under your name. One of the better known modern example is Alex Haley (ROOTS) writing the AUTOBIOGRAPHY OF MALCOM X.

P.P.S. The above was written before the last three posts above were entered.

1. Sandy, I wish you luck. (I have the paper to seize an almost mint Mustang convertible if we could get to it. You are a step or two ahead of me.) I’m sorry you feel as you do about the use of pseudonyms, Benjamin Franklin had how many different voices on his letters page? Truth is I would rather be using my real name here.

2. Ross, Most gracious. Thank you. By the way we are acquainted in real life and my grandson misses the ice cream stand.

Names are not really important for most posts. If you are debating the value of placing a GG-1 on display in Washington Union Station or the operation of a Big Boy in fantrip service the name probably does not matter so much.

If you are going to "call someone out", John Doe really screwed up old 97 when he burned out the rod bearings or I used to help out on this project until so and so screwed me over, then step up and use your name. Be a man not a baby and don't hide in the shadows.

I may be wrong about this but I believe that the "as told to" was added after Haley became a best selling author in his own right. It was Haley's first commercial success. The listings I just pulled up (Firestone Library at Princeton) use the term "with the assistance of Alex Haley" and show Malcom X as the author. Be that as it may I used it because it is a well known book, a well known author, and a well known ghost writer.

GME

I just want to take this opportunity to assure you all that if you choose not to read my postings because I do not sign them with my full correct name, I will not be offended in any way, and will still be glad to talk with you at railroad related events whether I know your correct name or not.

m.x.data

This series of threads eminates from a more or less continuous commentary about Steamtown that invariably includes the following two assertions:

1.) Steamtown is ineffective and inefficient and too bureacratic.

2.) The solution to this alleged "problem" is to involve private entities.

If you think that questioning someone's business acumen, operating record and personal motivations are personal attacks-then so be it.

Nonetheless, as one other poster posited, some of us need our jobs because we have the unfortunate habit of eating.

I strongly agree with mr.superheaters numbered points 1&2 above as I believe anyone with any common sense would. As to the personal attacks whilst hiding behind a phony name issue, I feel well satisfied by the thorough manner that many others have spoken to this issue, and am confident any future incidents will be promptly and effectivly handled by our moderators.
Principles over personalities!
Ross Rowland.......no s please............

I don't agree with those assertions. I'm categorizing them only to answer Mr. Mitchell.

The reasons for remaining anonymous have been thoroughly explored here-if you choose to ignore those perils, thats your choice. I choose to attend to my economic, professional and personal responsibilities. Understanding where one's responsibilities lie is being a man, not foolishly reacting to baiting from total strangers-to whom nothing is owed.

Perhaps nobody on this board qualifies as a "foamer", but the odds are against it. You know, the guy who'll turn beat red if you suggest engine X is better than engine Y. There's always the chance that some nutjob will track you down, because they think blowing off steam on a chatboard actually changes anything. We all know the type that loves to put their finger in your chest.

If one "calls out" somebody or something, one should disclose any personal biases that he/she might have

Agreed Supe, but the offenders involved very seldom let considerations like rationality or civil discourse modify their emotional rants. Asking them to change their behavior is unlikely to be more effective than my telling my cats how to wash the dishes. Their postings are easy to ignore, and our moderators seem to catch them pretty quickly. The system we have in place works well.

Steamtown and its practices are just one of the threads that has evoked some heated commentary recently, Texas State looked like it might be headed that way. In both of these situations, it seems something isn't working as well as we wish it might, and the continued health of these operations may be threatened as a result. Considering and discussing them may or may not define or solve the problems, but might help others down the road. Seems well worthy of our time. Besides, there are some really well versed people who contribute here from a broad cross section, whose input is of great value. Imagine if we could form a task force and personally go out and work on these things!

The public / private dichotomy is a frequent common denominator, and is timely besides. It can work beautifully in either case or in combination, or work not at all. Also worth considering how both these - as well as other - approaches to management structures can be effective or not.

So, if we want to consider Steamtown - Ross has an idea that money could be saved and the visitors experience could be improved by privatizing part of the operation. I don't know if Strasburg is interested, or even aware he is promoting them as an operating entity (wanna move to Scranton, Kelly?) but let's consider any potential entity. Could they make a difference? Would it be a positive difference? Might it actually decrease taxpayer cost, thus rendering it less likely to falling to political pressures, while attracting more tourists (and their money) to the area? Does it matter whether or not we are considering this proposition as a result of percieved inefficiencies within the NPS system, or policies that prevent effective pursuit of the market, or for any other reason? In any case, let's focus on how we might effect a positive outcome without the fingerpointing, please.

dave

As I see it, posting with one’s real name a matter of personal responsibility, on par with avoiding egregiously bad grammar, spelling, and practicing good network etiquette. And, like grammar and etiquette is not easily policed by anyone other than the poster. It is not something that anyone can be forced to do - but something that should be done because it is the right thing to do.

The best reason for this, is that if you are spending time refining your ideas and crafting your statements – then stand up and take credit for them. Being able to associate an idea with a real person helps in having them included in future discussions (for some reason it is easier in a meeting to say that I heard John Smith say something than MILW-FM-458).

Finally, it helps to add to the credibility that RYPN has to the general public. Like it or not, RYPN is one of the front doors of railroad preservation (go to Google to see for yourself). Having a higher percentage of people signing their posts and/or using their real names for a handle lends the site (and therefore the movement) an immediate appearance of respectability and credibility - even if none of the posts are read.

Tom Cornillie

I don't post here very often, because I usually don't have too much of value to add. But I felt compelled to put in my 2c to this. Simply, there is a very good reason I don't use my "real" name on the boards anymore.

On another board there is a somewhat mercurial moderator (for lack of a better term) who has made a very bad habit of posting the full names, addresses, email addys and even the telephone numbers of people he disagrees with...even, or perhaps especially, those of people who don't participate on his forum anymore. Surprisingly, he still has a small following of loyal readers, not all of whom seem to have both oars in the water either.

I don't like getting anymore spam than I have to, but there worse things - like vitriolic emails, and even several harassing and hang up phone calls in the middle of the night - that have resulted from his behavior. Now, my "true identity" is somewhat of an open secret, especially to those who know me from other boards, but if I was REQUIRED to post my name and email, then I most likely wouldn't participate at all.

Personally, I look at the argument this way- Do you eat the contents of the can, or the name on the label?

Like it or not, branding (for lack of a better term) is ingrained into our society - and I think the approach (where one considers the source before considering the content) is the norm.



Labels can be important - is it chunky stew or dog food with extra gravy?

Tom Cornillie

Steamtown and its practices are just one of the threads that has evoked some heated commentary recently, Texas State looked like it might be headed that way. In both of these situations, it seems something isn't working as well as we wish it might, and the continued health of these operations may be threatened as a result.

The problem I see lies in exactly what you've said. A lot of people approach Steamtown as an abstract concept, that is, it is supposed to live up to subjective expectations. The fact that something isn't (if I may use your quote) "it seems something isn't working as well as we wish it might" rather than accept the fact that there are a variety constraints-some imposed by legislative mandate, some by economic concerns, etc.

As to Strasburg, I love the place and go a couple times a year because its just neat. Nonetheless, there's a big difference between running at restricted speed on relatively flat terrain with complete ownership over the locomotives, i.e., you do what is best operationally with reference to things like collection policies, historic structures reports, etc. (Note: I'm not SRR isn't faithful to integrity of the machine or doesn't have its own documentary requirements).

Consider another case i.e. the ex-CB&Q 4960 on GCRR. When it emerged from reconditioning, there was quite a hullabaloo about its changed appearance. GCRR responded that locomotive was an operating asset, not an accessioned relic and therefore as fee simple owners, they were free to alter it in anyway. Thats the difference thats not taken into account in comparing SRR or any other private operation with a government one.

I disagree and apparently a significant plurality of others agree.

My "personal responsibility" here doesn't even begin to compare with the need to stay employed pay my bills and not subject my family to the potential of some nutjob saying to them - "you're that %$&^ing &&%%'s relative?".

With all due respect, the preservation "community", needs far more than signed names to dispel the the "FRN" image amoung professional railroaders.