The entire concept of NJT extending it operations to Scranton is based on pure politics, not on reality. In order to secure a commitment from Pennsylvania to assist in acquiring the former Lackawanna Cutoff, it was necessary to dangle the carrot of passenger service from Scranton to New York before the politicians. It certainly does make sense for NJT to extend its proposed operations on the cutoff into Pennsylvania, but the idea that "commuter" traffic between Scranton and New York City will ever be feasible, much less profitable, is laughable. A much better use of taxpayer dollars would see train service to East Stroudsburg, supplemented by express bus service via I-380 and I-80 between Scranton and Delaware Water Gap to meet the trains.

This is not to say that a daily round trip or two from Scranton to NYC may not someday make sense, but let's be honest: a train that takes two hours to cross New Jersey and another 90 minutes or more to reach Scranton is not and never will be "commuter" service. The reality is that when the cost of driving from Monroe County to northern New Jersey or New York City every day becomes unaffordable, residents who fled those areas for Pennsylvania will either take the train or move back!

To bring this discussion back to the subject at hand, the railroad between Scranton and Hoboken would be able to accommodate special passenger trains to attend a dream steam gathering at Steamtown, IF the Cutoff every is rebuilt.

I didn't mean to deny the existence of transit-loose-and-fancy-free preservationists. But mostly, they exist at the mercy of the automobile drivers who drive them to or back from events. I've *been* that guy... painfully knowing that the grace of others is all that separates me from an early departure to catch that last train, or blisters on my feet. Hoping someone will agree to take me. Most have always been happy to help, but I always feared one day they'll all roll their eyes and go "Geez, there he goes, imposing again." This sucks more than you can know unless you've been there habitually.

Mind you there's nothing wrong with being transit-loose-and-fancy-free. Been there, done it, miss it. When a transit rider is in his element, he's astonishingly mobile, often moreso than the Car People. But in Car Land he's as lost, helpless and dependent on his caregivers... as a Car Person would be in the deep amazon. Let's face it, avoiding that is why we spend so much of our disposable income on driving.

As for the practicality of commuting from Scranton generally... well, I was thinking merely of specials run for this event. They wouldn't make many stops. Running express can cut 2 minutes per stop depending. I know San Fran-San Jose is 1:30 with 33 stops, and :45 with 1 stop. Ridden em both.

Ah, but look at me, talking about transit on RyPN. I'm gonna get in trouble for off-topic! :)

Having lived through the many attempts to get the Lackawaana Cut-Off rebuilt and being personally involved in several of them, it is gratifying to witness the project finally making some concrete progress. Anyone who has witnessed I-80 during either rush hour M-F needs no further convincing that a passgr. train would appeal to many.

My guess is that it will eventually happen, but as has been the case to date it will no doubt take MUCH longer than common sense would indicate. Remember you're dealing with multiple public agencies,two states and lots and lots of turf battles.

As to the possible railroading celebration gala at Scranton, it could certainly prosper without folks being able to access it directly from the greater NYCity area via train as Owosso showed dramatically. My guess is that the population within day tripper distance of Scranton vs. Owosso is MANY,MANY times greater and Owosso drew over 10,000 a day.

The 2 biggest hurdles to making a big "do" work at Scranton are getting the politicol backing to facilitate a facility use agreement giving the organizer the flexibility/authority needed to allow it to work, and getting the Class 1's to totally buy-in so that it becomes their showcase. If those 2 hurdles are cleared, the rest is a matter of time&talent.

IMHO-Ross Rowland

In the last several years there were three passenger trains in Scranton, two because of Bennett Levin. First, you had the AAPRACO special that originated in Philadelphia. Now granted it took a rather roundabout trip (I assume for the mileage collectors), but since it came via Easton and Phillipsburg it could be possible to originate a trip in Newark (then via the ex-Lehigh Valley) or Hoboken (via NJT out to Hackettstown then the ex-DL&W to Phillipsburg). The second trip was for the Lexington Group from Binghamton. This round trip was made in a day. Lastly, last year Amtrak moved equipment and PV's from Albany. Some of the PV's were able to sell trip on this trip.

So bringing a passenger train in is possible. It will be in interesting to see if this is done for the NRHS convention, as it is being done this year to Duluth. As Ross mentions, it will need either NS or CP to buy-in to do this.