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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630, then 4501
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:13 pm 

Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:08 pm
Posts: 417
Location: Amherst, OH
John D wrote:
Some musings...

I understand that the initial area for excursions is Chattanooga. I don't understand two things:
(1) 2-8-0s and a 2-8-2...everything I've read about NS's earlier steam program indicated that locomotives of this type just weren't right for mainline steam. Branchline rambles, maybe, but not mainline. Am I missing something, or are lessons of the past forgotten?


From a post on TrainOrders it doesn't sound like large engines are needed. The intent it not to bring back the steam excursions as before. I've reposted the information below.



Quote:
To provide a little insight into what we are doing, pending the necessary agreements with TVRM (a fantastic partner by the way), we are contemplating limited steam excursions over reasonable distances at locations throughout our 22-state network. Some of the trips will be for the public, some for employees, and some for customers. There will also be opportunities to view the equipment in static displays. As a word of caution, this program will not resemble NS' former steam program, in that the number of trips will be fewer and the trips themselves will be more modest.

Rudy Husband
Norfolk Southern


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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630, then 4501
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:28 pm 

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:30 pm
Posts: 1080
Location: Bucks County, PA
Quote:
To provide a little insight into what we are doing, pending the necessary agreements with TVRM (a fantastic partner by the way), we are contemplating limited steam excursions over reasonable distances at locations throughout our 22-state network. Some of the trips will be for the public, some for employees, and some for customers. There will also be opportunities to view the equipment in static displays. As a word of caution, this program will not resemble NS' former steam program, in that the number of trips will be fewer and the trips themselves will be more modest.

Rudy Husband
Norfolk Southern


That actually sounds really really nice. Not some huge mainline trips, but the "reasonable distances" trips sound good. Is Philadelphia to Harrisburg a "reasonable" distance? Perhaps a Strasburg steam engine out running on NS trackage? Just some random thoughts...


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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:55 pm 

Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 3:11 pm
Posts: 371
Since Wick Moorman became the CEO, NS has been quietly supporting historical groups and museums representing NS predecessors. There has been a lot of support for TVRM and the North Carolina Transportation Museum as well and both organization can list senior NS officials as members and even directors of these groups. The RRMPA has also benefited from this kind of support and other smaller groups as well. TVRM has a great shop and its own small line - perfect to restore and break in steam locomotives.

Can I also be a heretic here? I would love to see Bennett Levin's PRR E units or the NY&GL Erie E unit out there in the appropriate locations or other historic diesels from NS predecessors (too bad there aren't any Lackawanna Trainmasters left).

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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:14 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:10 pm
Posts: 1182
Philly to Harrisburg would be via Amtrak's main line, on which passenger trains run at 100 mph or better, on the very busy NS freight route via Reading. Not exactly the place for a 40-50 mph steam locomotive. How about Harrisburg to Perryville, Md. via the Port Road along the Susquehanna River (It would drive the chasers bonkers!) or Harrisburg-Williamsport instead?


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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:21 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 8:10 am
Posts: 2499
I would take #4501 running at 35mph Allentown to Jim Thorpe and not complain. Could you imagine the meeting of the green and the blue prima donna's at old Mauch Chunk?!?!?

Seems wise to rely on TVRM rather than build an internal steam dept. I like the idea of this benefitting an established museum.

Now, would Linn ever let #475 return to ol' Virginny?

Rob

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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 9:27 pm 

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 7:57 am
Posts: 2598
Location: Faulkland, Delaware
It seems that if they are going to have a program that relies on "hired guns" a pair of NKP berks might find some work here and there. The NKP is part of the NS heritage.

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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return- Hopefully with T&P 610??
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 10:24 pm 

Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 2:19 pm
Posts: 58
I know this is a major long shot, but they should consider T&P 610. Would be nice to see her out on the high iron again.


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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 10:52 pm 

Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 8:33 pm
Posts: 121
G. W. Laepple wrote:
Philly to Harrisburg would be via Amtrak's main line, on which passenger trains run at 100 mph or better, on the very busy NS freight route via Reading. Not exactly the place for a 40-50 mph steam locomotive. How about Harrisburg to Perryville, Md. via the Port Road along the Susquehanna River (It would drive the chasers bonkers!) or Harrisburg-Williamsport instead?


The Amtrak route would be a real stretch. On the NS routes (to Philly or Allentown) east of Harrisburg, maximum track speed is 50 MPH, so traffic wouldn't be impacted any more than a coal train does. The NS Harrisburg Line was converted to Rule 261 signals (signals in both directions of traffic for both mains) several years ago, so there would be adequate capacity and/or flexibility there.


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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2010 11:02 pm 

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:30 pm
Posts: 1080
Location: Bucks County, PA
CP O'Shea wrote:
G. W. Laepple wrote:
Philly to Harrisburg would be via Amtrak's main line, on which passenger trains run at 100 mph or better, on the very busy NS freight route via Reading. Not exactly the place for a 40-50 mph steam locomotive. How about Harrisburg to Perryville, Md. via the Port Road along the Susquehanna River (It would drive the chasers bonkers!) or Harrisburg-Williamsport instead?


The Amtrak route would be a real stretch. On the NS routes (to Philly or Allentown) east of Harrisburg, maximum track speed is 50 MPH, so traffic wouldn't be impacted any more than a coal train does. The NS Harrisburg Line was converted to Rule 261 signals (signals in both directions of traffic for both mains) several years ago, so there would be adequate capacity and/or flexibility there.


That's what I meant, with the NS routes. Obviously not the Amtrak line.


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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:08 am 

Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:11 am
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Location: Missoula, MT
I'd say the meeting of the black and blue. I'm a fan of 4501 in her service colors.

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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 12:13 am 
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I am so happy to log on and see this today. TVRM will always hold a special place in my heart for teaching me about railroading and 610 will always be family. I'm in IL now, but planned on going to see 630 as soon as she is ready, now maybe i can plan on seeing her in new territory.

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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 2:00 am 
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Posts: 2696
Location: Pac NW, via North Florida
jimwrinn wrote:
Isn't it a wonderful day to be alive?
Jim, is it an omen that I just finished reading your Steam Camelot book last week? I swear I read parts of it often. I rode some of the later trips and missed the “good old days” of green and gold (I’m only 40). I think you have another book waiting to be written and I for sure will be buying a copy when you do. I bet this will make for one heck of a story.
Foamery aside, I think I read that website a dozen times before it really sunk in. I doubt I’ll ever ride one of the new trips as I live in the Northwest US, but I’m so happy for all my pals on the East coast. One of my buddies back in Florida is one of the biggest SRR steam program fans there ever was. I had to call him at home a few minutes ago. Sucker was cackling like a fiend when I told him the good news. I think I made his year with that phone call, he’d had no idea.
I got a cab ride on 630 back in 1981. I was 11 at the time. My parents grew up near Elizabethton, TN where she worked as # 207, so that engine will always hold a special place for my family. To see her running again at the head of a NS excursion? Man, I might cross the country to see that...

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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 9:06 am 

Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 3:03 pm
Posts: 35
Location: North Georgia
Maybe at some point, an official accounting of this announcement will be editorialized or overviewed in the pages of TRAINS, but let me throw a few personal comments out there.

First, the old saying Rome was not built in a day, firmly applies here. It has taken years of quiet diplomacy and dedication to craftsmanship, reliability, and safety to show we want to be taken seriously with our museum activities in all forms. Of course, there were also changes at NS over time. Even though there was the odd hint around the shop on the weekends at the possibilities, it was never wise to comment about them and possibly jinx things.

Also, if you were a weekend volunteer, you would see that 630 has undergone some serious rebuild work. From the new welded smokebox to the 26 brake m.u. hoses on the pilot, you'd see she will not be quite the same as the last time it ran in excursion service. There is new driving boxes, brasses, shoes, wedges, lubrication, frame repairs, cylinders bored, roller bearing lead truck, and a new tender tank being built, just to mention a few things. She is a fairly heavy 2-8-0, so we will see what kind of train can be pulled over the road.

I'm sure that with this limited opportunity, we will do what we can and see where it takes us and NS. Hopefully, this relationship will last a long time, maybe helping others along the way. We would hope for good patronage at/on any events, and will be putting our best foot forward all the time. Safety will be a high priority, as our industry as a whole, and TVRM more pointedly, have a vested interest in being accident free.

BTW, don't forget our other pet project, 6914. While she is not as far along as 630, it's still moving forward as well. Maybe it will see limited exposure some day too.
All my opinion. Mike Overlander


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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 1:13 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 8:31 am
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Location: South Carolina
Wow- I'm away from the 'net for one day and this crops up. I understand that hell is complaining about a problem with their air conditioning this week. :-)

This seems like a possible opportunity for NKP 765 as well.

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The Ultimate Steam Page
http://www.trainweb.org/tusp


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 Post subject: Re: Norfolk Southern steam to return with SR 630,than 4501
PostPosted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 1:24 pm 

Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 10:28 pm
Posts: 292
M_Overlander wrote:
Also, if you were a weekend volunteer, you would see that 630 has undergone some serious rebuild work. She is a fairly heavy 2-8-0, so we will see what kind of train can be pulled over the road.


Speaking thereof Mike, any word on how the rebuilding of the C&C line to Summerville is going after the floods last year? Even with the NS thing going on, it would be a shame to lose that line for excursions, especially with the money that Summerville put on that turntable. Any estimates as to how long it will take to get it back in service?
Kevin


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