The problems with this analysis are threefold:
1) Seemingly no good can come from a museum board establishing a "market price" for such an item. If they price it at a mere $1, they are failing their fiduciary responsibility to raise as much as possible from the sale. If they set a price too high, they chase away potential buyers. As much as auctions have going against them, they are legitimate surveys of actual value at that precise moment.
2) The fact remains that no one else besides a scrapper actually showed up to shell out $2,500 at that auction, in spite of your claims otherwise, most likely because no one that wanted one was willing or able to deal with the rather substantial costs of shipping a heavy, non-standard shipment by rail, truck, or magic wand. If this crane is so "valuable" and "useful," where were the bidders? If someone really NEEDS one of these big rail derricks, I can point them to a half-dozen or so that should be "available" from preservation entities that aren't using them......
3) There are actually very few excursion lines for which such a derrick would be "useful." Indeed, one railroad in the past that offered excursion service and used such a derrick had a fatal accident with it in service, killing the (experienced steam mechanic) operator. Using such equipment requires both the maintenance of the machinery and the training for SAFE usage of such cranes. The requisite experience is becoming perhaps scarcer than steam locomotive engineer knowledge, with good reason.

As much as I'd like to see a "big hook" operating, I'm not sure I'd wish it upon even Amtrak in Philadelphia today. There's a REASON Hulcher, R.J. Corman, Cranemasters, etc. exist and are on call.

There's a big (no pun intended) difference between a 120-ton capacity steam wrecker and a 25-ton capacity American crane. The 25-ton machine has LOTS of utility around rail museums/shortlines/tourist roads. And a diesel-electric machine? Very nice machine, indeed, if it was in anything near decent shape.

Too bad that one will die. Wouldn't have minded having that crane at RMNE (only 1200 miles away.....).

Howard P.

Howard -

Agreed! To point this out, I started a new thread which will hopefully include some photographic examples.

Les

Not to stir up more controversy, but I find it difficult to get too excited about someone "missing the boat" on stuff like this. It usually turns out to be a danged if you do, danged if you don't thing.

I am intimately familiar with a particular museum's effort to bring it's "collection" closer to it's mission statement without seeing anything become razor blades in the process.

The equipment collection had several pieces that had nothing to do with the railroad or region that this organization was set up to cover. It also had several duplicates and even a couple of triplicate sets of items. An effort was set in motion to find new homes for these items.

This effort was successful in that a couple of items went to places where they were very much more relevant, and are now undergoing slow cosmetic restoration. The same cannot be said for several more items, which were more common but still not relevant.

After all relevant venues were contacted for trade, sale or donation, with no interest expressed, the next step was to try to sell the items through equipment dealers, at bargain prices. Again, one item was sold; no interest in the others. Finally, the decision was made to scrap, retaining some components.

Bear in mind that this was no "underground" effort. Everything was handled in public Board meetings, minutes of said meetings being distributed to the membership at large in their publication. Also bear in mind that this effort was made over several years, not overnight in secrecy.

All was well until the scrapping started. Several members who had apparently been in hibernation (along with a lot of non-members) raised a huge ruckus, to the point that the scrapping was stopped and the items again offered for trade, donation or sale. Note that, as might be expected, none of the loudmouths had ever lifted a finger or donated a dime.

Once again, no interest from any other group or individual, and no offers by the gripers to donate or do anything to protect these items. Scrapping proceeded, amid howls of protest from the same handful of members and the crowd of non-members.

It ain't over yet. There is still a lot of yammering going on, nearly all of it from people who sat on the sidelines and complained.

I am not trying to make a case that this compares in any way to the Mid-Continent auction. I AM trying to make the case that there will ALWAYS be poorly-informed and/ or less involved parties who will not come alive until far too late. And even when they do, they seldom have anything to offer that is even remotely productive.

Where o where is that "LIKE" button when it is so badly needed.....

ETA

There has recently been a thread right here discussing locomotive cranes. The basic take away from that thread was that there is a relatively large number of cranes out there with no place to call home and they are slowly disappearing to the scrapper. Almost all of these cranes are in the 150-220 ton range and with friction bearings, they certainly aren't going anywhere by rail. And the cost of disassembly and shipment by any other mode is prohibitive to all but the most well heeled organizations. The fact that no one is stepping up to acquire and preserve these machines places them near the top of the endangered list.

Why Mid-Continent, having one of these things (in near working order no less) in the collection elected to sell it off is not logical from a preservation standpoint. But that is exactly the problem. Preservation.

It takes courage to admit that after owning a piece of equipment for 47 years there is no plan for restoration or upkeep in place. It takes even more courage to admit that no plan is likely in the next 25 years. Acknowleging the likelihood that in 25 more years the crane will be simply one more rusted eyesore makes the decision to sell it much easier, however likely it might be that it will end up being scrapped. And much more logical. It is still a shame, however.

There must be a balance between "raising as much as possible from the sale" and their responsibility to try to see that historic artifacts are not destroyed. The board would not be shirking any responsibility by deciding to take a lower price for an object if such object were to go somewhere that it would be appreciated and taken care of. We almost scrapped our GE 80 tonner after trying with no luck for over 2 years to find someone who would buy it and preserve it. But at the "11th. hour" Lake Shore Railway Museum stepped in with a plan to preserve it as part of a collection of Erie built GE locomotives. Even though we got much less out of the deal than we would have if we parted it out and scrapped the rest, our overriding mission is historic preservation and that takes precedence.

A word about auctions. There may have been several parties who would have loved to have that locomotive crane at that price, but to go to an auction is a gamble. You invest time and money to go to the auction, but do not know if stuff will go cheap or sky high. With a fixed price sale you know ahead of time that if you have X dollars you can buy Y equipment. For many, myself included, our time is too valuable to just throw away by going to an auction where you may come back with nothing. Especially this time of year when everyone is scrambling to get things ready to go for the tourist season.

As far as I know, none of the cranes involved were in such decrepit condition that they posed a safety hazard. While it's obvious that no one has taken on the job of preserving those cranes in the past, that's not to say that the possibility existed for someone to take an interest in them in the future. In my opinion, perhaps no other facet of railroad operation was more exciting than the wreck train, that collection of cranes and maintenance of way cars that stood by ready to go out at a moment's notice to a wreck site. While many museums possess a crane and MOW cars, none of them have chosen to interpret that part of railroad history.

Another factor that Les has brought up is the use of cranes in museum projects. Many museums used railroad cranes in the early years but have turned to contractors or modern equipment as time went on.. I believe that the Pennsylvania Trolley Museum is one of the few that still uses their work equipment for museum projects. In the case of Mid-Continent, they've chosen to use contracted help whenever lifting a car or locomotive is involved. I don't know the details of that operation such as whether the contractor is donating his time and equipment. But I have to wonder if it would be more economical to restore and maintain equipment already in their possession for those projects. Plus that would allow the use of volunteer help. Museums used to have pride in accomplishing jobs using their own resources, but that "can do" attitude has gone by the wayside over the years.

It just seems to me that the loss of these cranes is unnecessary and wasteful.

You know, I'm not buying this. (The line of reasoning, not the crane.)

If you're in the legitimate market for a crane such as this, you're investing time and money to go inspect it, see that it really is operable/safe/in good working order, what parts or work may be needed, and then arranging for shipment, etc. That's part of the business. And I'm certain that had you gone and left a registered advance bid up to what you could afford, your offer would have been honored if you were not outbid. Heck, maybe your offer would have been accepted sight unseen!

This is simply the tired, common cliche of an item coming in low at an auction and people lamenting the "bargain that got away" afterwards. If you guys REALLY want a crane that bad, I'm sure we can find a Burro somewhere cheap, or get one donated by a friendly short line......

One could say this case involves special circumstances, you have a 250 ton crane that is landlocked, the cost of moving it by truck any distance would be prohibitive.

It's 10 truckloads if you can dismantle it into 25 ton chunks.

-Hudson

This discussion has gotten confusing because there are three cranes involved, in three different situations.

The the 120 ton capacity Missouri Pacific crane (don't know, it may WEIGH 250 tons) is a wrecker, a type of crane for which there is very little demand these days. Yeah, it could be a nice example of a wrecker for some group that doesn't have one, but it's going to cost an arm and a leg to move, unless reduced to bite size chunks.

The Soo Line X-81 is an 18 ton capacity steam locomotive crane... basically a shop or MOW crane. Being steam, it has little utility, other than a display / demonstration. It seems to fit MCRM's mission statement, except they don't have a reproduction of a major shop. Does every museum need to preserve a full compliment of historic MOW equipment?

The WC 25 ton capacity locomotive crane is almost modern, and isn't land locked at the North Freedom site. I bet they are surprised it didn't sell for further use... but in this day and age, with modern high rail equipped hydraulic cranes, it's dated. Even the Wisconsin & Southern declined to continue leasing it. So, what to do. MCRM didn't need it; apparently neither did anyone else.

Since this thread has already drifted, I'm going to ask for suggestions on just how - in concrete measurable terms, not in conceptual ones which Wesley has already posted - we ought to most responsibly find good homes for our deaccessioned pieces, without placing the burden of endless stewardship until a perfect situation materialized in the meanwhile. Are there specific channels through which notice must be sent? Can only potential acquirers with adequate means to actually take it be sole bidders (for lack of a better term?) Is there a minimum of time between announcing a deaccession through correct channels and disposition if nobody takes it, and if so how long? If multiple bidders do propose acquisition, what criteria are used in what priority to determine the award of the piece? If nobody bids, what is the mechanism for disposal, and in what way in what time frame?

I'm just asking, given there's been a lot of expressed dissatisfaction about some items here, but given no set of rules seems to be universally accepted, by what defensible right are those judgments being made?

dave