Quote from the paper:

"And though the train would be working for much of the lease period, there's a good chance more repairs would be needed after 15 years. The cost of further upkeep, he said, would fall directly to the city.


"I'm not sure that's what we need," Moore said, "if we can't run it when it gets back here.""

Uh... IT DOESN'T RUN NOW, EITHER!!! (duh).
Maybe someone should offer to lease a California engine - seems the government
might be more receptive towards additional income! Though, hard to top an NYC
engine running in Midwest /East coast. - Fully paid privately, no less.

/Mitch

I would suggest that we all send Mr. Dick Moore, Mayor of Elkhart and email expressing our desire to see the Mohawk return to service. Can we flood his office with positive emails and educate him on just how big of a positive this would be for Elkart if the Mohawk was restored?

http://www.elkhartindiana.org/egov/apps ... 2&path=pro

this is kinda reverse from 765, the city owned it, leased it to the FWRHS, now they own it and take care of it run it etc etc. The NYC museum does not seem to have the interest-motivation-skills to restore the engine, just to have it sit for display.

Whatever, the museum should negotiate in good spirits and be reasonable about it, not like the 261 debacle.

That the city is concerned about the locomotive's ability to run after it is returned in 15 years. They shouldn't worry. It won't be runnable after 15 years. It'll need a new 1472 day inspection and like a LOT of work. Figure $500K or more to put it back on the road after 15 years.

This smacks of the Green Bay "museum's" attitude toward the 261. These businessmen will reported put upwards of $1M into rendering the locomotive operable. This in the mind of the city makes it a "valuable asset" rather than a rusting, cash sinkhole.

It'll be fun (and probably sad) to see where this goes from here.

I think we should look at this from the mayor's perspective. He may be completely unaware of the realities of steam locomotive restorations. We know inside and out how this stuff works, so I suggest writing to the Mayor and educating him on the matter.

Here is the email that I just sent to his office:



Mayor Moore,

Last month my wife and I passed through Elkhart on our way back from Minneapolis, MN and stopped at the National New York Central Railroad Museum. The museum is first class and we were greatly impressed by the quality of the exhibits.

I had heard rumors of a plan to return the NYC Mohawk 3001 to service while at the museum. I then read an article recently stating that you were not convinced that leasing the Mohawk would be best for the city. I come from a railroad preservation background, having worked in the industry for 20 years, and can tell you that if your deal with the lessors is correctly structured, it can reap benefits for Elkhart that you could not imagine.

The Mohawk is in reasonable condition, but will continue to deteriorate sitting out in the open as it has been. At some point significant amount of money must to be spent to erect a shelter for the locomotive and to perform a cosmetic restoration. The museum has a large amount of equipment to care for as it is, and if a third party is willing to restore one of your pieces for you then that is a very good deal. I would recommend that the lease payments and other revenues generated be put into a fund to construct a proper display facility, and when the locomotive returns from its excursion career in 15 years it would have a warm, dry building in which it would be exhibited.

You may not believe the potential that the Mohawk has as goodwill ambassador for the City of Elkhart and the NNYC Museum. Wherever it goes it will create positive buzz about Elkhart and the museum. Simply adding the museums logo to a corner of the tender's side will advertise the museum and the city to the thousands who see this locomotive in service. There is a great merchandising potential for the museum as well, another part of the deal that should be negotiated with the lessors.

There is a huge base of railfans across the country that have been yearning for years to see a New York Central locomotive returned to operation. I suspect that you would see an increase in visitorship to the Museum from these railfans even if the Mohawk is not present as a result of a correctly structured advertising campaign centered around your traveling goodwill ambassador.

One final thought. I would insist that at the end of the lease the locomotive be returned in complete condition, with all parts and appliances in place. Due to FRA rules after 15 years the locomotive would need a complete tear down and rebuild if it were to run again, but that does not mean that the locomotive would be returned looking like a pile of junk. Most of the work the FRA requires is internal, and the Mohawk would probably still be in perfectly operable condition, just not legally so.

I would suggest contacting Steve Sandberg at Railroading Heritage of Midwest America, if you have not already done so. Steve leased Milwaukee Road 261 from the National Railroad Museum in Green Bay, WI and operated the locomotive for the past fifteen years. He would be a wealth of information on how to best structure a lease agreement that would benefit the city, the museum and the lessors. http://www.261.com/index.html

Thank you and I look forward to seeing the 3001 back in service in the not too distant future!

What debacle? Seems to me the result was ultimately favorable no matter the twisting path that led to it. Let's have more such debacles.........if we have more Sandbergs to clean them up.

dave

The dream hasn't died. OCT 2011 article
http://www.etruth.com/article/20111017/NEWS01/710179973

It may not be so expensive, after all plywood streamlining wont be expensive.

Mike Pannell
Cheyenne

I was wondering when this was going to surface here as my phone has been ringing for the past 3 days about the 3001 again. The "plywood streamlining" is actually a pattern for the smoke lifters. Bob Spaugh has wanted them back on the locomotive for years, and at 83 years young it is good to see that he can get out and still work in it. From what I understand there will be some cosmetic work done to it, the smoke lifters some work to the cab and windows.

The 3001 is for the most part not in that bad of shape. Just as any locomotive that has been out of service it will need the necessary ultrasonic testing done. Mechanically it is complete, has roller bearings on all axles however when it was in Texas the grates and stoker were cut out and removed. The sides of the coal bunker were cut down and a fake oil tank welded over it keeping the tender protected from the harsh Indiana winters. The driver tires are worn out and the tender has several rim stamped wheel sets. When it was moved from Dallas Texas to Elkhart in 1986 it made the entire distance with only the main rods disconnected with no problems. To my knowledge the last time it was moved was in 2007 when it made 2 trips outside the fence about 500 feet and back.

If there were ever a place to run it the 3001 is a good solid candidate to be restored. The biggest problem with the locomotive along with anything at the museum is that for years it has been a political football! With the current economic conditions in Elkhart I doubt that there will be any city funds spent on it anytime soon. With all the politics surrounding the museum the volunteer base has been driven away.

The Lake Shore Historical Foundation owns the 3001 and leased it to the City of Elkhart for 100 years in 1987 giving the city total control over the locomotive. Their membership is growing older and there is little being done to encourage new young membership. This is a group that in the early 80s ran the Buffalo Creek and Gully #13 on the Old Pumpkin Vine from Shipshewanna, IN to Middlebury, IN through the Indiana Amish country.

I personally have spent many hours around the 3001 and have hoped that someday it will steam again. Is it possible? yes it is. is it probable? It is doubtful. For now I am happy to see that Bob Spaugh is still taking care of his second love of his life.

They will do a fine job like these guys did



http://talesofthejerseyshore.blogspot.c ... magic.html


....


monikers aside I applaude the folks giving the go, keep the dedication on you will make it.

Regardless of political blockades, which have been seen in recent years with the Pemberton group (and the successful reaction abd planning to deal with the political game of football), so how is Elkhart any different? The only thing I want to know if it may at all be possible to cancel the lease should their be any sort of "failure to launch" in the operations department. However, there is at least cosmetic work that is ongoing. Personally, I can't wait to see the results of the smoke deflectors being put back on, as it will look somewhat how it did when 3001 ran the Boston and Albany's final steam powered revenue train. As for the volunteer base being scared away, I can say that doesn't appear to be the case considering the base factor that there is a small group who is showing the interest and enough initiave to at least take care of the 3001 and work on a cosmetic restoration to make the 3001 more presentable. I look at it like this:

Money+Cosmetic restoration+effective care of the display=Interest in the locomotive and cost reductions in operational restoration with effective care of the display.

The first thing that should be done, before talking about any restoration work, is to construct a single stall pole frame enginehouse to get it out of the weather. If the museum doesn't have the resources to do that, well then there is no hope of doing anything else is there.

I agree then disagree, 765 1st restoration was outdoors.

Focus on the restoration now don't waste time on a building, it will come.

Long time storage, yes. 3001 may be hot with coal and steam sometime, that will help keep the rusting acid away.