We are trying to decide if we are going to do any Christmas trains. I just wonder what you are thinking about on a couple of issues in light of Covid. Like having children sit on Santa's lap and the fact that most coaches don't actually have a ventilation system to bring in outside air and heat it. So people are really going to notice that they are packed in an enclosed area with stagnant air. Another question, will children mind not being able to sit on Santa's lap. Singing is another issue in an enclosed area. Daytime trains would rule out any kind of lighted displays along the track or lights inside the cars.

Have you run your plans by your local public health department and gotten their "buy in"?


Bob H

Is there a NEED to--legally imposed, perceived, or otherwise?

What sets off a large percentage of the American public is that supposed need--mandated or perceived--to "ask permission" from "the government" for increasingly every facet of life--such as repairing your own house (did you get permits? use a licensed contractor?) or starting a business.

Because we live in a society.

Last year (December 2020) we had Santa at the train station where everyone could see him. He sat inside red ropes and talked to everyone and waved at people who drove by. There was a mailbox where letters could be dropped. We also had hot chocolate and snacks for everyone, generally on the ground but aboard the train at some communities along the line. We generally had singing on the train. We let people know the details and choose if they wanted to come or not. We heard of no problems. Ridership was naturally down, but not as bad as the forecast.

We plan to do about the same this year. Most trips are 45 minutes with a quick cleaning between trips. We have everything from old coaches to stainless cars from the 1950s. All cars are decorated in different styles - everything from stuffed animals to lights to greenery.

One advantage we found with Santa off the train is that many people felt that they had a better view of him, and more time since they saw him before and after the trip, not just during a fast walk-through. Snacks on the ground kept the cars cleaner.

We will be operating these trips out of at least four different communities right now, with a few changes between them. The key seems to be do what is locally accepted.

Bart

Maybe the health department should be thought of as a resource rather than an adversary?

It seems to me that this society that you speak of is not doing a very good job as of late, and I think much has to do with the slow erosion of individual rights, actions and responsibilities and an increasing reliance on authority figures to solve our problems. Be it a government agency, president or an old man with a raspy voice, we are finding that these authority figures are just as flawed as we are, have their own personal motivations and may not actually have our individual best interests at heart. We have seen again and again that these authority figures have betrayed our trust, yet for some reason we keep blindly putting our trust in them instead of ourselves.

Our society works best when we all take individual actions to advance our interests. Nobody is going to care as much about ourselves and what we hold dear as we do, so don't wait around for someone else to act on our behalf.

Most societal problems are bigger than an individual can solve alone. The self interest among authority figures you cite is unfortunately real, but it's just how certain people with a very active sense of ego decide to express their self interest - claiming to be the only person who can individually solve larger problems, etc...... it's only in looking beyond the self and towards creating masses actively expressing consensus that can solve large problems based on a dedication towards society rather than simply self. Consider the Greek perspective of the responsibilities required to act as a citizen in a society (as well as the rewards) required for a Democratic Republic to be a practical form of government. I think we've lost this understanding at the altar of our National mythology.

It's too bad that your very legitimate thread got hijacked with a bunch of Political Rhetoric.

Grand Canyon Railway does the full, licensed, Royalty paying 'Polar Express' Train. In fact, we are the largest single Polar Express operator in the country (or at least were before the pandemic).

Our guests have 2 opportunities to interact with Santa. On board the train, Santa passes through quickly to hand out a gift. He does not take time to pose for photos. Back at the depot, Santa is available for 'Family photos'. I think this year our set will use elevation to create a visual effect where the family and Santa are socially distanced, but appear much closer than they actually are. So no sitting on the lap....

Our Christmas Cars are open window cars, but on cold nights those windows remain closed with no forced air circulation. Last year we ran at 30% capacity so lots of space between guests. This year, we are going to full capacity which is between 80 and 90 people per car. Our daily train has been running at full capacity since June with minimal complaints, although those cars are all enclosed with forced air circulation. Of course, we do require mask wearing for all guests and staff as per the FRA and TSA guidelines. And half our Polar trip is geared towards group participation in singing Christmas Carols. So far it does not seem to be a problem with the guests, as we have sold over 50,000 tickets so far. I guess we will see once the first trains roll out in about 3 weeks.

Eric

Gents, you can debate the political/sociological/medical effects of the pandemic all you want, but the bottom line you have to consider is how are you gonna navigate the current situation with an clear and obvious pandemic going on?
I crew down at the Chehalis (WA) tourist RR and missing out on Polar Express last year due to the pandemic and the mandates from the state associated with it (simply stating a fact as the state shut down such activities over the holiday season last year) caused us a great loss in annual revenue over last winter.
We're gearing up for PE at this time, and very recently got most of the 'North Pole' set installed in a field for the upcoming trains. Christmas-themed trains have apparently provided a great deal of operating revenue for us and though this will be my first year of running on them, I know they've done quite well for the operation long before I ever showed up for crew.
But as for interactions on a person level like tykes on Santa's lap, from what little I know about the nuts and bolts of PE, I do not think we're having that close of interactions. And given how I'm reading more and more about kids getting COVID (surprising similar to the 1918-19 Flu pandemic which hit different age groups per season), that sounds like a good idea to keep that to a minimum. I can't imagine your ridership will be greatly affected by something that simple.

Over 70% of the population is vaccinated. There are individuals with antibodies somewhere in that remaining 30%. Successful methods of treatment are also available. There is also a TSA/FRA mask mandate in effect. With all of that considered, I see no reason not to offer Christmas trains. I’d say let the families choose whether or not they want to have their children sit on Santa’s lap. Run the service and give your guests the ability to choose whether they want to ride/participate or do something else with their time and money. I’m confident that there are still plenty of folks willing to ride your Christmas trains. Good luck and Merry Christmas!


I have noticed in my travels this year that more and more people want to and are getting out, going places, and doing things. I have been to the following locations this year and have experienced “normal” attendance and even record crowds.
Mid Atlantic Air Museum’s WWII Weekend Reading, PA
Strasburg RR
Daytona
Myrtle Beach
USS North Carolina
Gatlinburg and Pidgeon Forge, TN
The Bronx Zoo
Old Rhinebeck Aerodrome

People who want to get out and go do things are doing it.

Here is an interesting one - Brightline in Florida has announced that it is doing Polar Express trains.

"Hop on at Brightline’s West Palm Beach or Fort Lauderdale stations to quickly and conveniently get to MiamiCentral Station for your immersive trip on The Polar Express. Dinner at MiamiCentral Station is also an option: grab a bite at Citizens MiamiCentral, where you’ll have a variety of different restaurants to choose from, including Umami Burger, Krispy Rice, Sam’s Crispy Chicken, Cicci di Carne, Sa’Moto by Chef Morimoto, and more."

Why anyone continues to run their Santa season trains using the Polar Express name and thus paying the outlandish royalty it demands is totally a mystery to me.

We did it for 1 year and realized after all was said and done that the royalty payment was far greater than our net profit.

The second year ( 1996 IIRC) we changed the name to North Pole Express carried more passengers and paid ZERO royalties. No one has a copyright on hot chocolate, silver bells, Christmas songs or Santa & Mrs. Claus. We have continued to grow ridership every year ( until Covid) and now offer both a steam powered and diesel powered version ( www.newhoperailroad.com) royalty free.

Here's wishing everyone a great Santa season, and an early Merry Christmas.

Ross Rowland

@Mt. Royal.

"Over 70% of the population is vaccinated. There are individuals with antibodies somewhere in that remaining 30%. Successful methods of treatment are also available. There is also a TSA/FRA mask mandate in effect. With all of that considered, I see no reason not to offer Christmas trains."

I disagree. The third treatment (this is the third treatment, not the boosters) hasn't been distributed yet.

It is important that we maintain a great national consciousness that has served us so well in this unprecedented medical emergency and maintain strict adherence to the prescribed public rituals that show our unquestioned obedience to the great national and world leaders such as President Biden, Dr. Fauci, Mr. Gates and others who have provided such magnificent leadership on this issue.

Until we eradicate COVID and all its variants, we cannot be engaged in such frivolous nonsense as "Christmas trains". It's for the greater good that we suspend our normal ferro-equinological parochialisms. Is that too much to ask in a pandemic?

Do you really want some infected kid leaving some nasal mucous on the window or seat only to have another kid touch it, become infected when he or she ingests it along with the Cheezits mom brought for a snack and then go over to his septuagenarian grandmother? Is that what we want to risk?

Wait until Dr. Fauci or Dr. Walensky says it is safe, then proceed. You don't have impressive medical credentials or a public office, so you shouldn't be suggesting that people make decisions without the explicit consent of those who do possess such expertise or authority.

Thank you for your response. It was very entertaining and brightened my day. Merry Christmas.