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N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
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Author:  gcrr [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 8:16 am ]
Post subject:  N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
I recently heard about a couple of N&W Y6b's that survived in a scrap yard into the 1970s. Rescue efforts were unsuccessful and the locos were scrapped. Is this true? That was the first that I had ever heard of that. Are there photos out there? What engine numbers was it?

Thanks
Matt Helton
Author:  johnacraft [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 9:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
The story as I've heard it is that, in 1975 or 76, there was a semi-successful effort to obtain one of the two Y6s in the Virginia Scrap Iron & Metal yard in Roanoke. It would have joined no. 611 at the Roanoke Transportation Museum. Sam Golden, the scrap yard owner, was said to harbor some animosity against the N&W for some reason, and cut the engines up rather than allow one to be saved.

How much is true? Well, two Ys were scrapped in the mid-70s. How much more of the story is true, I don't know.

Wes Barris used to have a page on steamlocomotive.com about the ones that got away. I don't know if it's still there or not, but that page had some information on these two.

JAC
Author:  Erik Ledbetter [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 10:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
Wes IDs them as 2143, with no tender, and 2174.
Author:  Richard Glueck [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 12:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
Ziel and Foster show one in "Steam in the Sixties", a Mike Eagleson photo. The locos were pretty scarred up, missing parts and looking almost burnt. At least one was missing the tender. Regarding the relationship between the scrapper and the N&W, I think it was pretty good. He held 5 locomotives on the site for 50 years, and assorted other equipment. The office was full of locomotive parts, purely a display. Nice stuff. he also cut up a huge number of N&W locos, so there was a good business relationship as well. I wonder what is still laying under the mountains of metal in the yard corner!
Author:  Gary Gray [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 1:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
I'll try to give as much of the story as my ageing memory will allow. First, the two locomotives were owned by Roanoke Scrap Iron & Metal, which was a different company from Va. Scrap Iron & Metal, owned by the late Sam Golden and home to the "Lost Engines of Roanoke". There was a preservation effort made by the Roanoke Chapter, NRHS. The then leaders of the Chapter had a verbal agreement with the owner of the yard to purchase the 2174 for approximately $20,000. The Chapter was slowly raising funds through traditional NRHS methods, i e sponsoring excursions. The agreement was open ended on time. Unfortunately, the gentleman who owned the yard passed away unexpectedly. His estate sold the yard to a British company. When the Chapter leaders went back to the new management of the yard, they were given a ridiculously short deadline to raise the money. The engines were scrapped a couple of months later. The scrapyard later went bankrupt and closed. The "Boss" (Bill Purdy) came up and salvaged a few of the appliances for the then Southern Steam Program. Thus was lost the last Y6b.
Author:  Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 1:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
If RyPN ever had a FAQ page, this perrenial should be in it.

J. David Conrad's epic "Steam Locomotive Directory of North America has two pages listing steam locomotive scrappings since 1965 or so.

Conrad IDs the Roanoke scrap victims as 2143, 2174, and 2189, scrapped ca. 1976.

Among the other spectacular scrap victims identified are two C&O 2-8-4's, a C&O 2-8-2, a couple Burlington 4-8-4 parts sources, three Shays, and a DM&IR 2-8-8-4.
Author:  wilkinsd [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 3:28 pm ]
Post subject:  The C&O Engines
Alexander D. Mitchell IV wrote:
Among the other spectacular scrap victims identified are two C&O 2-8-4's, a C&O 2-8-2, a couple Burlington 4-8-4 parts sources, three Shays, and a DM&IR 2-8-8-4.


I have slides of the the C&O locomotives being scrapped. I believe they were scrapped at Russell, Kentucky in the early to mid 1970s. From what I know, these were locomotives held by C&O as possible donations for displays, museums, parks, etc, that never were donated. I know that members from the Kentucky Railway Museum salvaged appliances from one of the 2-8-4s, including an extra booster engine.

I guess what suprises me the most, is that nobody wanted the 2-8-2. There was/is somewhat of a glut of 2-8-4s around from the C&O, but the 2-8-2 would have been unique.
Author:  Mike Stillwell [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 3:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
3 Shays? I think the only Shay scrapped since the Twin Seam Mining (ex Meadow River #5) Shay in 1963, was ex-Mower Lumber #6, at Cass. This engine was pretty much destroyed (C&O train derailed on top of it) before Cass re-acquired it in '78. There are also still many parts left of this engine (trucks, driveline, engine, etc.)
GCRR #1926 was listed for a while as scrapped, but it too has survived, in a semi parted out state.

Mike Stillwell
Western VA RR Preservation Soc.
Author:  Greg U. [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 5:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Other Scrapped engines
Lets not forget the tragic loss of Grand Trunk Western 4-6-2 5629 and the CB&Q 5632 thanks to Dick Jensen not wanting to give them up to a better home. What a loss.
Also I believe there was a man that had a couple of NKP Hudsons saved and when he died his wife scrapped them. Does anyone know about these engines or have more info on when they may have been scrapped?
Author:  JimBoylan [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Other Scrapped engines
McHugh Bros. operators of New Hope & Ivyland RR cut up ex-Virginia Blue Ridge 9 (an old Army? 0-6-0) in the middle of 1976. The parts were sent away in a Conrail gondola car! You need a lawyer to sort out all the details. Len Smolsky claimed that when the boiler was cut apart, the flues had never been touched with water since its last rebuilding, before 1963.
Author:  nathansixchime [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Other Scrapped engines
As previously mentioned, Steamlocomotive.com has information on some of these "lost ones." I ran across these last night.

The stories behind the politics and business end are pretty interesting and aren't as one sided as some think...

Required reading:

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/union/jensen.shtml

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/lists/recent-losses.shtml

Even a few W&LE Berks survived for a term!

A photographer friend of mine has a photo of Jensen's GTW locomotive, with a chain and lock around it's running gear, apparently put there by the Cook County sheriff so no one could touch it...until, of course, a torch did.

He also mentioned the locomotive was landlocked, right in the middle of the yard, with the switch torn out a few feet before the locomotive.

Image


-Kelly Lynch
Author:  whodom [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
Gary,

Your version of the story squares with what Preston Claytor told me many years ago. He also mentioned something about someone making an "unauthorized attempt" to "preserve" builders plates and whatever else could be removed from the locomotives in dimly lit (i.e.- nighttime) conditions and hauled over the fence.... :-)

Sadly, these "preservation" efforts were unsuccessful. Glad to hear Mr. Purdie saved something off the engines.

Regards,
Hugh
Author:  Ryan Beck [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Other Scrapped engines
Well Greg, There is alot more to the story than that. Reportedly he had set aside $400,000 to start a R.R. musuem in Louisiana. This was stated in his will. However all the pages of his will were not signed and the court deemed the contract invalid. Now as far as saving the engines it was said in R.R. magazine that there were alot of lookers but the they required a $300 deposit to save a loco from the torch. They only received a few deposits. It was also reported that Blount tried to save the engines and he did save alot of the parts, hardware etc. but the Illiniois Central refused to move them(why after moving them in?) The whole story has never been told and I doubt ever will be. The judge (or lawyer) that ruled, was involved on the case refuses to say a word till this day. The only info I have is from Louisiana railfans and magazine articles I have collected,not usually more than a paragraph or so long. By the way he owned 3, yes 3 NKP hudsons. But it was rumored that one never made it to the Louisiana Eastern it was scrapped in New York, due to the fact that he only wanted engines that were in top mechanical condition. I am sure no easy feat at the end of the steam era.
Ryan Beck
Author:  Gary Gray [ Tue Mar 29, 2005 11:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: N&W Steam Scrapping in the 1970s
Hugh, Preston and I walked out on the Walnut St. bridge while the scrapping was going on. It was sad to look down on the yard and see 2174 with her boiler gutted like a fish. I don't think any of us had the heart to take pictures of her death. If she had survived a few more years she would probably now be beside 611 & 1218.
Author:  Greg U. [ Wed Mar 30, 2005 12:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Other Scrapped engines
Ryan,
What was this guys name? You didn't put it in your post. I would like to find out some more info on this failed operation.
Greg
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