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| EMD to China https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=18654 |
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| Author: | bobyar2001 [ Sat Oct 01, 2005 1:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | EMD to China |
First, it was the model RR manufacturers moving production to China, now it appears the 1:1 scale ones are doing likewise:http://autonet.ca/Facilities/story.cfm?story=/Facilities/2005/09/09/1209419-sun.html |
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| Author: | superheater [ Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
The union has been assured by Electro-Motive that China will not become a competitor and start selling the locomotives globally. "We have been told the Chinese will not become our competitors, but I do not know how they can guarantee that," Berry said. Looks to me like the new EMD isn't running with the same caliber of savvy it was under GM, and certainly with no sense of history geopolitical or otherwise. They ought to examine how ALCO and GE's "gentleman's agreement" fell apart. Somehow in these deals, the smug alpha forgets how precarious pack leadership is....oh well,I'm sure they'll land softly with golden parachutes when they manage to sell out the brand. Of course in a perfect world, these guys would be tossed in court by shareholders for breaching their fiduciary duty by failing to obtain an enforceable non-compete covenant. |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sun Oct 02, 2005 3:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
Ummmmm........ Bob......... re-read the article.They're not exporting PRODUCTION to China, as far as I can tell. That is, they're not packing up the machinery in London, Ontario and shipping it to China.Instead, EMD/EMC has SOLD China 300 locomotives, with the likelihood that many would be ASSEMBLED in China before turnover to the customer.Why, pray tell, is this any different from Conrail's Juniata Shops assembling EMD and GE "kits", which they did in the 1990s? Does it not make more sense to ship uncompleted locomotives overseas in kit form rather than depend on more expensive shipping to send them ready-to-run?I think the proper attitude to take here is that China realized that they are incapable of building a locomotive that was "up to snuff" and that we should be celebrating that they had to turn to a capitalist country to meet their needs. EMC/EMD is having to ADD employees (50-100, according to the article), not lay them off as the jobs go overseas! |
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| Author: | rev66vette [ Sun Oct 02, 2005 4:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
I agree with superheather. This "assurance" is tantamount to assuring that it won't rain in in monsoon season. This country has been gearing up recently to be a major force in global economy. They showed this when they recently attempted to buy a major refinery. Their quest for natural resources is having far-reaching effects. My brother is in the automotive/trucking industry and within the past years had the occasion to work with a Chinese company importing automotive parts, particularly brake components such as rotors and drums in all vehicle applications. The product in question was of good quality and cost substantially less than those produced here. These items are still currently available and most US production of these items has been cut drastically due to their availability. I used to ask him how it was dealing with them and he replied that the robber barons of the past were "choir boys" compared to the head people from China, and last but not least, the robber barons probably had a sense of humor". I'd view this deal with a jaundiced eye, to say the least. |
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| Author: | bobyar2001 [ Sun Oct 02, 2005 9:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
Despite company assurances to their workers, this is probably just a prelude toward total production over there, as the auto industry is in the beginning stages of. Why pay North American workers a living wage when you can pay others 1/10 the amount? Wal-Mart has proven that, even with shipping costs, it is still vastly cheaper to produce over there. And certainly, there will not be any problems with unions in China. No, the production machinery hasn't been moved to China yet, and yes, a handful of workers will benefit temporarily in London, Ontario, but check back in 20 years and the GMD plant will likely have gone the way of LaGrange. Remember how many used to work there? |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
Gee.......I think I'll buy some French wine. That'll convince them to move Champagne production to America.Then I think I'll buy some more tea. That should make them start growing tea in Maryland.Did Japan go to economic heck because they set up American plants to build cars here? I doubt it.Come on, guys. Not to drag political oil and water into this board, but it appears you're fishing for conspiracy theories to confirm your own personal biases. Get a grip. Heck, Randy, delete this whole thread--nothing about preservation here, anyways.So, how 'bout dem cheapo Chinese choo-choos that were gonna replace all these American-built excursion steamers? Hee-hee-hee-hee....... |
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| Author: | Ron Travis [ Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
EMD moving their production to China is one thing. China going into the locomotive production business by purchasing examples from EMD is another thing. Until our standard of living equalizes with China, all U.S. industrial production will move there just as fast as China can ramp up for it. The "sleeping giant" is waking up. |
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| Author: | Alexander D. Mitchell IV [ Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
For the last time: Where in the article did it say that EMD was moving production to China? Nowhere, that's where. Assembly of EMD-produced locomotive kits in another location does NOT equal "relocation of production" unless you're some bureaucrat demanding that "production" of transit vehicles for your state's transit agency occur in said state.Now, "theft of intellectual property" by reverse-engineering EMD locomotives to copy is another matter entirely, and one easily handled by intellectual-property legal teams. But why order 300 when you could reverse-engineer and test 20?(Personally? I wouldn't sell China a used SD35, MRS-1, or RS4TC!) |
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| Author: | Ron Travis [ Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
I agree that the article does not say that EMD is moving production to China. And it also does not say that China intends to become a competitor to EMD. Both prospects are speculation by reading between the lines. The article does, however, indicate that others directly involved are seeing the same thing between the lines according to the following quote:"The Chinese will use our technology and get assistance from us in building and assembling the locomotives," he said. The union has been assured by Electro-Motive that China will not become a competitor and start selling the locomotives globally. "We have been told the Chinese will not become our competitors, but I do not know how they can guarantee that," Berry said.***************************************************The theft of intellectual property is not so easily handled by intellectual property legal teams when they have no legal standing in China. |
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| Author: | doowoppie [ Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EMD to China |
Hi,This is getting a bit off Topic isnt it?Actually it has nothing to do with Preservation at all.Andy |
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