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| Air conditioning challenges? https://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=19219 |
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| Author: | Robert Reid [ Wed Dec 07, 2005 10:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | Air conditioning challenges? |
What are the challenges with trying to air condition coaches for tourist trains, dinner trains, etc.? I'm interested both in the challenges of operating and maintaining existing a/c systems as well as the problems you might encounter trying to add or retrofit an a/c system into a car that did not previously have a/c?(This is research for the novel I'm working on about a scenic railroad in Virginia, where a/c is essential for summertime operation)Thanks in advance. |
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| Author: | Trainwire [ Fri Dec 09, 2005 12:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Air conditioning challenges? |
There are lots of problems with putting A/C on passenger coaches.1) Power. If you are using modern closed loop refridgerant systems, the power demands are huge. When we installed the one on the car we have here, it took a 50 amp three phase 240 volt circuit. Where are you going to get that? Head end? On board Gen? Mice in a wheel? 2) Space. To air condition an uninsulated coach, with a door that opens and closes constantly, with lots of people in it, takes a corresponding size of evaporator and condensor. Both are sometime the size of a refridgerator. One on top of the car, one underneath. The fans to move the air around are huge.3) air flow. If you look at AAPRCO's web site, at the older coaches you can tell the ones that a/c is an afterthought. They are the ones with only half a clerestory. The other side has a curved roof down to the side of the coach. What was done in the first gen of a/c's was to use half of the clerestory as a large ductwork. Put a roof over it and open the windows in the coach. Return air was usually handled by cutting vents in the doors of the cabins and a hole in the ceiling under the fans.There are lots of other problems that come with this project, but these will get you started.Steve aka Trainwire. |
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| Author: | scrmcurator [ Wed Dec 14, 2005 12:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Air conditioning challenges? |
The problem we have with our diner (or had before we sidelined it for suspension work -- which is just about done now) was simply keeping the damned system running. Every 3-4 months something would crap out on us. We had it working and decided to add a thermostat -- BIG mistake! Refrigerant leaks are also a problem. If the a/c doesn't cause problems, the genny does. Sludge in the fuel tank plagued the Mountain View for all three Santa Train days. We never had that problem with the diner (knock on wood) but we did have constant problems with dead batteries, blown circuits, and all manner of other stuff. I'm beginning to wonder if air-conditioned cars are worth the bother. But then, it's not the middle of August right now, either. :o) |
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| Author: | Howard P. [ Wed Dec 14, 2005 1:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Air conditioning challenges? |
Ah, air conditioning... at the Naugatuck, we like the 40-25 air conditioning system: 40 windows open at 25 mph. It's a real simple system, no Freon leaks, electrical problems, condensate leaks, etc. In my opinion, our visitors are usually coming to ride an old train (except for special things like a dinner train, etc.), and expect to ride in old cars. They usually didn't have a/c; and the open windows are so different from what people now can experience on a train. If you're running heavyweight, pre-1940 cars, why do you need a/c? Now, don't get me wrong, I think a/c is great stuff- that's what I do in real life (HVAC contractor). But if you're sealed up in an a/c coach, you don't get the full effect- especially if your motive power is steam. |
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