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 Post subject: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questions
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 7:40 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:37 pm
Posts: 298
I had the chance to visit the HQ of the Middletown & New Jersey RR this past Friday. Harold Rassmussen shared the news that the railroad's sale to the new owners had been settled that afternoon and that an official announcement would be made this week. The good news is that the new owners will use the railroad to haul revenue freight as part of a trash recycling concern and the operation will remain intact.

No word on disposition of ex-Bath & Hammondsport RR 2-6-0 No. 11, though it is still locked up securely in the Middletown shop. I also curiously noticed an old steam loco tender that was bastardized into a M-O-W flat car, obviously acquired by the M&NJ from a class 1 work train consist of some kind.

As I looked around the depot office, I was reminded of ESRM's old steam tourist operation on the M&NJ back in the 60's.

I was curious as to the roster of equipment that was used by the Middletown & Orange from 1962-1966 and stored there from 1967-1971.

They rostered the following:

Ex-Sumpter & Choctaw 2-6-2 No. 103
1 ex-C&NW Combine (now at Mid-Continent)
2 Boonton Coaches (what were the numbers? Are these at Valley RR?)
ex-Cotton Belt wooden caboose (Where is this car these days?)
ex-NYO&W RR wooden caboose (Where is this car now?)
Open-Air Gondola (is this the ex-L&NE gon at Essex?)
Ex-Pullman car "Arsenal" (bunk car - owned by RMNE?)
M-55 Brill Railcar (Did this car ever run on the M&NJ?)

Did they roster any other pieces of equipment? I have heard they leased Erie Stillwell coaches during their first year of operations (1962).

Howie P., any insights?

K.R. Bell


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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 8:05 pm 

Arguably of greater significance is the M&NJ records themselves. As I understand, the day-to-day records dating back to 1900 (or so) remain intact for this railroad - a truly unique and valuable resource. Kurt, do you know if these records still remain and if there are any plans for them?

Tom Cornillie


  
 
 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 9:03 pm 

Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:06 pm
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Location: Thomaston & White Plains
....

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Last edited by Howard P. on Tue Feb 14, 2006 9:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 9:08 pm 

Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:06 pm
Posts: 2567
Location: Thomaston & White Plains
OK Kurt, here ya go----

103 arrived at Middletown on Southern 50 ft flat 51346 on March 24, 1962; it was shipped from Alabama. ESRM-M&NJ operation was 1962 through 1966, May-October of each year. 103 was shipped on a flatcar from Middletown to Saybrook in early 1971 (it may have gone in the special move "hospital train" over PC in late 1970-- I don't remember right now). Made first (test) trip on VRR the night before VRR's inaugural run, July 29, 1971. Last operated on VRR in 1976; is now owned by RMNE and is currently on display at Essex.

Yes, Erie Stillwells were occasionally used; one of the Friday night Port Jervis trains would drop the deadhead cars at Middletown and pick them up again on Monday morning.

The other stuff: a hospital train special move was made in Dec 1970 of much of the ESRM equipment at Middletown. It operated via EL to Maybrook, then Maybrook-Poughkeepsie Bridge-Old Saybrook over PC (NYNH&H routes-- seems like ancient history to describe this now...). In that move were the cabooses-- NYOW 8301, Cotton Belt branchline caboose, CNJ outside braced boxcar, DLW troop sleeper bunk car, LNE gon, CNW 7409 combine, and one DLW Boonton car. The Brill Model 55 had moved in Nov 1970 on a flatcar.

The Brill was not a passenger configured car (as it is now); it was built for Sperry as a rail test car and went to Remington Arms in Bridgeport as an interplant self-powered "boxcar".

The Arsenal Tower Pullman (8 section, 3 double BR, 1 drawing rm) was not at Middletown, that I recall. Nor was the NYC-D&H heavyweight diner (D&H 154). Both those cars were stored at CNJ's Elizabethport shops, and were shipped to Essex in 1969-- they were on-site in the weed-filled Essex yard in July 1969, along with a CNJ coach owned by Steve Bogen and CVRA's NH RPO. The "AT" was actually used on a couple of ESRM trips to Montral from GCT in 1965-66, on the "Montreal Ltd". It came into RMNE ownership in 1985, and was traded by RMNE to Steamtown NPS in 1994.

The CNW 7409 ran on every VRR train from 7/29/71, as Conn Valley 409. It came into RMNE ownership in 1985, and was sold by RMNE to Mid-Continent in 1990.

The LNE 728 gon was also a regular on the VRR trains until 1992 or so.

Cotton Belt branchline (not "drovers") caboose was not used in train service on VRR; it went into RMNE ownership in 1985, and is currently stored by RMNE and is available for sale. RMNE has had inquires from Texas groups.

The Boonton coach was lettered "Middletown & Orange", and was one of the older DLW cars (standing seam roof, wood windows, etc.). I recall it was vandalized at Middletown, and never saw service at VRR (VRR bought 4 nice, newer DLW Boontons in early 1972, fresh out of service at Hoboken). It was scrapped about 1986.

The NYO&W 8301 caboose was sold to ESRM member and VRR engineer Elliot Ferris about 1971; he and his family used it as their quarters at Essex. His son Kurt sold it about 1990 to VRR engineer Bruce Edgerton, who moved the car off the VRR to his home property in Deep River.

The CNJ boxcar was traded to Steamtown NPS in 1992 for a Central Vermont outside braced boxcar; the CNJ car and a former RMNE DLW 36-foot wood box were loaded on TTX flats and shipped from Saybrook to Scranton along with Arsenal Tower in 1995. The DLW car is now restored and on display inside the roundhouse-- it's the "Phoebe Snow" boxcar.

The DLW troop sleeper bunk car was used for many years by VRR and RMNE personnel, first at Essex, and later at RMNE's Saybrook Yard. It will be moved to the Naugy, perhaps later this year. It may eventually be fit for human habitiation again.

There was an LIRR wood caboose at Middletown at one point; it was burned to the trucks and center sill by vandals and the remains were cut up on site. The NYO&W cab was slightly damaged in that incident.

So, does that cover it?

HP

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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:28 pm 

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 7:57 am
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Location: Faulkland, Delaware
Howard,

You are amazing!

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Maybe it won't work out. But maybe seeing if it does will be the best adventure ever.


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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:33 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:54 am
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Location: NJ
Howard was there-


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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:40 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
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Howard:

Was (is?) L&NE 728 a mill (drop end) gondola? Why did VRR stop using it?

Les


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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 11:44 pm 

Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:06 pm
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Location: Thomaston & White Plains
Whoa, there, EDM... when 103 rolled off that SOU flat, I was 10 years old!!! The little old girl was the third hot steam locomotive I ever saw, in May 1963 (Strasburg 31 was #2, in summer of 62, and #1 was at Freedomland, a Monson 2-footer in the BRONX!!!). Never realized I'd be shovelling coal into 103 nine years later....

I did see the stuff getting prepped at M&NJ in fall 1970, and first became involved in this crazy biz in the early daze (yes, daze) of the VRR startup in 1970-71.

The LNE gon is a 40-footer, with steel outside bracing, wood side planks, no drop ends, not a mill gon. ESRM cut out a walkway in one of the corrugated steel ends. The car always ran on one end of the train, and the loco was coupled front-end against the uncut end of the gon for the return to Essex. VRR replaced the old trucks with roller bearing leaf spring jobs to ease the ride (it was quite bouncy and jiggly-- the engine crew got some "interesting" views of some of the warm-weather female riders!), but apparently a mid-1990s FRA inspector did not care for a freight car being used in passenger service and it was parked. Perhaps J. David can shed some more light on this?

A rebuilt DL&W MU car has become the VRR open air car; it has a roof and back-up provisions, no windows and few window posts. Popular with the passengers and a very nice job, indeed.

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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 8:41 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:54 am
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Location: NJ
Howard, sorry, I didn't mean to make you older than you (and we) really are. Age comes quick enough by itself.

Re the LNE gon: Both Black Biver and Strasburg used LNE gons as open air cars as well. They were cheap and in good supply in the early 1960s. Strasburg's gon was replaced early on by a converted MP-54, but Black River's car was used into the early 1970s behind 148, which for some reasond didn't throw a lot of cinders.


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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 9:20 am 

Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:06 pm
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Location: Thomaston & White Plains
There are still some LNE composite gons at Wanamaker Kempton & Southern; I think WK&S uses one on the train and has two or three others on the property.

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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Another Que
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 11:19 am 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:25 pm
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I am curious about an FRA inspector nixing the L&NE gon from the Valley passenger consist because she was a freight car. I know that other lines use gons or flats for open air cars. Why was this car forced to be removed from service? Was it the local FRA man's rules interpretation only?

We are considering adding an open air car to our train. IF I can ever find a mill (drop end) gondola, which would be the easiest way to go! But if there is some type of FRA restriction against this type of freight equipment being used to carry passengers, it would be good to know before we get into it.

Les Beckman (Hoosier Valley Railroad Museum/North Judson, Indiana)


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 Post subject: Re: M&NJ RR - Records
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 2:22 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 2:35 pm
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Location: NJ
One of the consultants working for the buyer (now owner) last year offered the records to the M&NJ Railway Historical Society.

Mr. P. Rassmussen's death, his widow was very gracious and contacted members of the society to review and save items they wanted to discard, to make sure nothing of significance was getting pitched. The station was loaded with stuff, some significant, but a lot was not. The old safe I believe labelled MU&WG was a prominent object in the station.

Hopefully the new owners will allow the records and other historic items to be preserved. And I think at this point in time they also would understand the value of having a steam engine (albeit in a million pieces) and offer it for sale, if it was indeed included in the purchase. My guess is that with the new operation, the "New" engine house will be needed for new power and repairs and they will need to be cleared for use.

22 flat cars for the garbage transfer service are supposed to arrive this week. Once loaded, I doubt the 44 tonner will be able to drag more than a few at a time.

Chris


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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 6:47 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 7:37 pm
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Howard, that was exactly the info I was looking for! Thank you VERY much. Damn, you have a amazing recall for dates and events!

K.R. Bell


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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 12:25 am 

Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 9:06 pm
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Location: Thomaston & White Plains
Thanks KRB, but I admit to looking at 103's waybill in the file folder to see the arrival date and car number....

Are you doing an article or something?

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 Post subject: Re: Middletown & Orange on the M&NJ RR - Some Questi
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 11:41 am 

Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 3:11 pm
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It will be interesting to see how long it takes the new owners to straighten the place up. Pete Rassmussen had set up a lot of non-rail corporations to hold some of the assets. Some of the unused line was nearly lost several times at tax sales. The line has never been formally abandoned - I'm not sure it was ever imbargoed either. Several years ago a covered hopper showed up routed to Johnsons, about 3 miles beyond the active line! About 1/2 mile of th line was pulled up and sold at the south end to provide access to the Appilation Trail - even though no authority for abandonment was ever granted. While there is no economic reason to reopen the line all the way, I have often looked at all that open land along Route 6 and I-84 and thought this would be ideal for rail service.

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