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 Post subject: NNRY trouble with trespassers
PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 9:47 pm 

Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:24 pm
Posts: 283
Location: New Jersey
Sounds like the Nevada Northern is having trouble with brainless ATV riders.
http://nevadanorthernrailway.net/throttle/throttle042106.htm

I know how I would handle them but I don't think it would be legal nor would the NNRy go alone with it. It involves brakemen armed with M-16s! That would get the message across! hehehehehe :-)

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Eric Bolton
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East Tigard & Southern RR Co.


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 Post subject: Re: NNRY trouble with trespassers
PostPosted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 11:37 am 

Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2004 3:45 pm
Posts: 362
My advice in this situation is one of communication and education. I base it from my experience with the Morris County Central and the NYSW when the Newfoundland ( NJ) engine house was leased to the NYSW Historical society.

The watershed area where the enginehouse was located was a haven for hunters, fisherman, hikers, bikers, horse-riders, off roaders, etc.

In the 70's one of our resident geniuses literally set a booby-trap for the ATV-motorcycle riders. Evidently it worked, because we suffered nemerous acts of vandalism immediately thereafter. Some of this actually occurring when trains were running.

I happened to be active in the 90's when the enginehouse was used to restore equipment. This time we were hospitable to ANYONE we encountered, including bird-watchers, butterfly collectors, and the previously mentioned recreational users. We showed them what we were doing, gave them a tour (There were even steam locomotives stored there) and talked to them, voicing our concerns about their safety, etc. The result was a pleasant surprise, as everyone seemed to get along and we did not suffer any as a consequence of their presence.

The article quoted doesn't seem to mention if any kind of contact was made with these riders, but I would suggest an approach that espouses the thought that "honey will get you farther than vinegar".

R.O.


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 Post subject: Good editorial from Mark Bassett
PostPosted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 4:46 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2004 9:35 am
Posts: 8139
Location: Wilton, NY
I don't think anyone could write a better editorial than Mark Bassett did here. The guy is a master at PR. Perhaps some video of such foolish trespassers could make it to regional TV stations also, for the nightly news. Presentations at local schools could help too. We deal with plenty of such idiots on the real railroads also and occasionally some die. It's too bad, but you can only do so much to discourage them.


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 Post subject: Re: Good editorial from Mark Bassett
PostPosted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 6:15 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2004 5:11 pm
Posts: 373
We also have the same problems. The worst problem is the Track damage for the time being. sooner or later it will get worse. We will injure or kill someone. The injuries could be to the volunteers even. We've had riders come flying out of the woods blind and almost hit track workers twice.
The injuries could also come to the riders next time. I know a few of the track crew will probally start throwing things including punchs the next time it happens. Wrong thing to do but it is a possibilty. This is due to the fact some of our people want to try and keep the riders there till the Sheriff finally shows up. This has taken over an hour in the past and the riders are long gone.
Talking nice hasn't helped at all. Everyone of them has argued the "right" they have to ride there. I'm not joking I've been told "you anit keepin me from riden between my fields", " You can't stop me"," you don't run here much"," I'll never get hurt I'm a safe rider'," I'll sue you', To my faorite one, "I have just as much right to be here as you".
Does any one else have any ideas to cutail this problem? someone gettting hurt or killed isn't the answer. We will probally get sued when that happens.


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 Post subject: Re: Good editorial from Mark Bassett
PostPosted: Fri Apr 28, 2006 8:00 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 1:04 pm
Posts: 625
We have the same problem on the Aberdeen and Rockfish and our sister road the Pee Dee River Ry. Both lines have thousands of dollars of track damage caused by 4 wheelers at any given time. We almost never see the offenders. How do you talk to people you can not see? The police are worthless. They won't even arrest people caught red handed stealing and think the ATV riders are doing nothing wrong.

As bad as the problem is for the railroads in this area farmers may have it worse. Not only are people on ATVs destroying their fields but those with four wheel drive trucks are also riding through their crops and doing donuts destroying everything in their path. Like the railroads, the farmers I talk to can never catch the offenders.

Perhaps the best response I have ever heard to these vandals came from a shortline railroad crew I know. They nearly hit a man riding an ATV on their track. When the train did stop and the crew got off the engine the ATV operator demanded they help him get the machine off the track. Being in an area on a bluff along a river and many miles from the nearest crossing the crew agreed to get the ATV off the track. They dumped it over the bank into the river and left the man with several miles of walking to do just to get out.

For me this is not just a problem at the railroad. I also have trouble with people riding on my property and destroying my land. I have come to the conclusion it should be illegal to own, operate, manufacture, or sell these mechines. The only thing they are made for is destroying other peoples property because most of the owners have nowhere of their own to ride them.

John Bohon


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 Post subject: Re: Trespassing
PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 7:22 am 

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 9:19 am
Posts: 720
Location: Scottsboro, AL
In Pennsylvania, the Keystone State Railroad Association (an industry trade group) lobbied the legislature to have a railroad trespass bill passed. As I recall, some of the sportsman's groups opposed the move and the final bill was, as with all legislation, a compromise. It was better than nothing and since then we have become more aggressive about posting our property. Our "No Trespassing" signs include a citation of the relevant state code for the benefit of both potential trespassers and local law enforcement.

We are fortunate in our area that the county sheriff is a rail enthusiast and one of his deputies is a former railroad police officer. I can't say that they've arrested anyone for being on our property, but I did get stopped and questioned while walking our track and marking ties one evening . . . .

The Federal Railroad Administration is very concerned about trespassing both from a safety and a security point of view. They have draft legislative language which they are encouraging states to adopt. If you have a state rail association, I would suggest becoming involved and see what measures are being taken to educate legislators on the problem.

FRA Model Trespass Legislation

Unfortunately, to be effective, "No Trespassing" rules need to be enforced aggressively and uniformly. I've found railfans tend to be some of the worst offenders in the "these rules don't apply to me" department.

Alan Maples


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